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Original poster

Radio 4 today 23/12/22

118 replies

WarriorN · 23/12/2022 06:57

Currently a big piece on Scotland and the GRA reform. Someone from trans actual on.

Justin being excellent

OP posts:
Original poster
WarriorN · 23/12/2022 09:13

Sonia Sodah

twitter.com/soniasodha/status/1606203554804293632?s=46&t=wwvFKQpWz_oTAfhG2d7KBQ

OP posts:
SallyLockheart · 23/12/2022 09:13

Birdsweepsin · 23/12/2022 09:09

Literally.

Show quote history

😂

MoirasSaggyBundles · 23/12/2022 09:11

WarriorN · 23/12/2022 08:52

Thanks so much Moira. it's Helen B's stuff too that needs analysis and countering. Wish I had the time

No problem. I'll post it in chunks. Justin's intro, then Lord Garnier, then Baroness Kennedy.

Birdsweepsin · 23/12/2022 09:09

SallyLockheart · 23/12/2022 08:52

well, its certainly lots of sunlight
my 21 year old son just said its a load of bollocks

Literally.

FrancescaContini · 23/12/2022 09:08

Justin has been clued up on this issue for a while now; all respect to him for keeping his eyes, ears and mind open.

Original poster
WarriorN · 23/12/2022 09:05

Justin's questioning was v good actually, on second listen. She just dismisses every concern.

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Original poster
WarriorN · 23/12/2022 09:05

Ha well not just me then Nancy!

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fswaps · 23/12/2022 09:04

‘Legal fiction’ - well done Justin

As a rule and probably like most women - I find the Today programme dismissive of women’s rights and misogyny.

I was at least slightly mollified by some of this… but really, the whole pack of TWAW cards has to come tumbling down soon …. doesn't it…?!

Original poster
WarriorN · 23/12/2022 09:04

I've just listened again, she contradicts herself and also concedes that predatory men will always find a way. But this is balancing rights and so she is prioritising men here. (My rephrasing.)

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NancyDrawed · 23/12/2022 09:04

WarriorN · 23/12/2022 07:05

Bugger, I put 23 then adjusted to 22

Is it Justin or Nick?

Either way both are excellent on this ...

To be fair Warrior N, at 7am Justin said 'It's Friday the 22nd of December'!

I've just listened to HB's bit. How typical to reply to 'Males do horrible things to females' from JW with 'Females do horrible things to females too'

heldinadream · 23/12/2022 09:03

Helena Kennedy used to be one of my heroines. I didn't know she had gone down the batshit route with this. I'm really frankly gutted.

FrancescaContini · 23/12/2022 09:02

nauticant · 23/12/2022 08:20

Baroness Kennedy effectively saying that the risk to women and girls is low enough not to worry about and this is a price worth paying because of the Most Oppressed Ever transwomen.

Very shocking.

Fieldfly · 23/12/2022 08:58

First time I’ve heard ‘legal fiction’ used, and the question ‘what does it mean to live as a woman’. HK came across as slightly deranged IMO.

Charley50 · 23/12/2022 08:56

MoirasSaggyBundles · 23/12/2022 08:22

FUCK YOU, HELENA KENNEDY, YOU MISOGYNIST, MRA APOLOGIST

I'll second that. Pretending that trans identitying males are effeminate to throw unsuspecting listeners off the trail to the truth of this shitshow.

Thingybob · 23/12/2022 08:56

The positive I took from the interview was hearing Justin say that it was just a legal fiction and that no one could actually change sex. That wouldn't have been said a few months ago

Charley50 · 23/12/2022 08:54

WarriorN · 23/12/2022 08:24

This is where Justin need the data on male pattern violence not changing post transition

I'm sure he has that data; he needs to be brave enough to use it.

Original poster
WarriorN · 23/12/2022 08:54

What I found shocking today is Baroness Kennedy claiming that raped women actively want transwomen in rape crisis centres.

Disgusting and demonstrates a complete lack of awareness of any of the issues.

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SallyLockheart · 23/12/2022 08:53

the BBC is only now slightly turning on this issue and exposing/scrutinising it with some clarity. Better late than never...

Original poster
WarriorN · 23/12/2022 08:52

Thanks so much Moira. it's Helen B's stuff too that needs analysis and countering. Wish I had the time

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SallyLockheart · 23/12/2022 08:52

well, its certainly lots of sunlight
my 21 year old son just said its a load of bollocks

Charley50 · 23/12/2022 08:52

Justin Webb is nearly there. He needs to get some cojones and press for actual answers to 'what is living as a woman?' and to share some evidence of the harm that has been done. Otherwise how can he call himself a journalist?

Notice ZERO mention of female trans-identifying people in this chat. It's all about the menz. Only men benefit, it's fucking obvious, and BBC are partly to blame for this whole shitshow.

totalnamechanger · 23/12/2022 08:50

Yes, Exiled Elsie I was aware of that sorry state of affairs and the almost unbelievable ‘reframe trauma’ comment.

What I found shocking today is Baroness Kennedy claiming that raped women actively want transwomen in rape crisis centres.

Original poster
WarriorN · 23/12/2022 08:50

I’m very tired today, but was she implying that women needing rape crisis services actually want transwomen to be present, in the interests of equality?!

Yes she did.

Justin is good but I don't think he always knows some of the wider details. It could have been pointed out that the ceo is male and no grc and also that male pattern violence trends do not change with transition.

I think Evan did mention no surgery or hormones needed yesterday?

This needs frequent repetition.

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MoirasSaggyBundles · 23/12/2022 08:47

WarriorN · 23/12/2022 08:26

Both pieces need transcribing and multiple addendums.

Unfortunately I'm too full of child management today to do so.

I'll transcribe it. I'm mad as hell, happy to channel it into something constructive. On it now.

Theeyeballsinthesky · 23/12/2022 08:46

They’re cunts aren’t they

first they coerce organisations through threats of funding withdrawal or by deluging them with threats or by training and flat out lying about what they law says to 1. Include TW as women even if they don’t have a GRC (“cos you must never ask!!!!”) 2. Record services by gender not sex effectively skewing all the statistics

and they insist there’s no evidence because statistics blah blah. If a TW says they are female and the service records gender not sex then everything the TE says it does will be recorded as being done by a woman

its not fucking difficult Kennedy - but she’s just n her massively privileged bubble and has been TWAW beee kiiiinnnd for years