Secretary of State for Scotland looking at using Westminster powers to overule gender recognition bill

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64073323

'Prime Minister Rishi Sunak said many people in Scotland had concerns about the bill.

While visiting a homeless shelter in London, he said: "I think it is completely reasonable for the UK government to have a look at it, understand what the consequences are for women and children's safety in the rest of the UK, and then decide on what the appropriate course of action is."'

She's very mistaken if she thinks this is going to 'gain' anything.

Worrying indeed. Did they ever clarify what qualifies as "ordinarily resident in Scotland"?

Listening to the news SNP are fully using we won’t let WM block us.

I loathe NS for stirring this issue for political gain.

Realistically, it always takes time to sort out the limits of political structures like this. Even in established federal type systems where roles are laid out questions arise from time to time and they have to go through processes to work it out. Which is to say there need for processes to do that, and it shouldn't be seen as an attack on the system, but a function of the system.

I think in the USA there are problems with teenagers going to different states to access what they can't get access to in their own state.
16 year olds heading to Gretna is very concerning.

It's not an attack on devolution. It's a devolved power acting ultra vires. Today it's this, what's next? It can't be allowed to stand.

This was sent to me by a man

It looks as if the approach (assuming the DM is being briefed by the Tories) is that this legislation affects England. English 16 year olds can run off to Gretna and change their birth certificates, and lord knows what happens to self ID’d sex offenders who request transfers south, or indeed national statistics/equality objectives. Westminster needs to act to protect the English, who have had no say in this process.

Nicola will presumably find a way, but it may be difficult for her to argue that laws that affect England can be passed in Edinburgh. Especially without proper consultation with Whitehall.

I have no sympathy for SNP/Labour whining about an attack on devolution, and I was an indy supporter.

Yes, it is an attack on devolution. You provoked it with your attack on women and your attack on reality.

Rachel Maclean retweets Kemi:

https://twitter.com/redditchrachel/status/1606185215994474496?s=46&t=Yj8z8TU27SMTRhxu1Eywpg

"I share these concerns and the impact of this legislation on the safety of women and girls across the UK. Rushing through this legislation which could herald life changing impacts on children as young as 16 is a mistake and I’m glad the UK government is considering its approach."

Previous posts include Safeguarding and Victims: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RachelMacleann_(politician)

I think the Guardian has chosen its path and will be sticking to it. They allow the Observer (same owner, different editor) to take a slightly more gender-critical line, to create a veneer of balance.

fromorbit, Labour and SNP were whipped, so those defying face sanctions. Tories voted as they wanted and fell roughly in line with the population. I assume this would have also happened had SNP and Labour allowed similar freedoms. Especially on the reasonable amendments. One of the Tories spoke about it being important to him that the Conservatives were the Rainbow party. In an odd way, good on him for sticking to his beliefs …even if he is wrong

No, that has just returned. Earlier this morning there were about a dozen articles including a good one by a Tory MSP and another by a Glasgow law lecturer.

The DM feed seems to work on algorithm so a hot story and too many articles clogging the top of the feed makes the DM appear obsessive. They don’t like Nicola, but this is bad legislation and an interesting constitutional issue. I assume they will not want their reporting to come across as vindictive and “get Nicola”.

Needmoresleep there's an article that's the second one down that I can see. Is this the one?

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11568771/SNPs-trans-bill-spark-gender-tourism-Scotland.html

Just coming back to this thread - thanks so much to everyone who responded to my earlier question re gay persecution (which I hope didn't come across as a hijack - sincere apologies if it did). A lot of excellent advice

Back in the eighties a surgeon we called miss Evans pioneered gender reassignment surgery at our hospital, she was renowned worldwide, her operations watched by many young surgeons. We were very proud of the work she did in N Wales.

Our neighbour in the village was one of her patients, we were happy that they were finally able to feel they were in the right body. She was in her fifties.

I wonder what changed.

Justasking you are not wrong. I wonder how the editors meeting is going at the Guardian. Double down and risk losing more moderate readers who belatedly realise reading the Guardian means you are uninformed about an important issue/debate. Or start trying to win back left of centre readers from the right of centre papers.

Resister, I am sure I can find the articles. The point is more, why have the DM pulled them all from the feed. Ie from where people might see them. They will be back, the Mail will cover the story. It will be interesting to see the approach they take. An example of this was when Corbyn became leader of the Labour Party. The Mail were strangely silent. Possibly because he was too easy a target so attacks might be perceived as aggressive. It is important on gender issues that the Mail is able to use its platform for womens voices to be heard. Rather than the whole thing to become some nasty shouty contest.

It behoves the daily mail to remember that most of their online advertising is directed at women

Sorry last post written too quickly. They know they have a good argument but they need to tread carefully to ensure that argument is heard not drowned out by calls of “transphobia”.

@Needmoresleep I think there is a Scottish Daily Mail. Also have you tried the previous URL in archive or the wayback?

nilmouse…how many times have you seen on MN…but it’s just the DM, they would say that wouldn’t they.

Everyone is going to be careful in this. Especially Kemi, the DM and others who know they are right, but don’t want to add flame to the tinderbox.

SirChenjins, I have tended to delve deep into my past to reference J S Mill’s on Liberty, which holds that a person should be left as free to pursue his own interests as long as this does not harm the interests of others. It seems to work as an argument.

Homosexuality does not impact others. Privacy of your own bedroom etc. Gender ideology does. The Stonewall “no debate” policy was ridiculous. Women had an absolute right to raise possible harms to them from the implementation of this ideology, as part of a respectful societal debate.

On Liberty was written over 150 years ago but the Wiki synopsis is well worth a read.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_Liberty#:~:text=On%20Liberty%20is%20a%20philosophical,relationship%20between%20authority%20and%20liberty.