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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Badenoch to meet Robison over GRR

90 replies

ResisterRex · 18/12/2022 10:25

Here:

https://www.mailplus.co.uk/scottish-edition/news/244821/uk-plea-to-snp-to-halt-gender-law

"THE UK Equalities Minister will use a dramatic eleventh-hour intervention ahead of the Scottish parliament’s gender reform vote to implore the SNP to delay the changes.

Kemi Badenoch will meet Shona Robison, an ally of Nicola Sturgeon and the person steering the Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill through parliament, tomorrow – only 24 hours before final talks on the divisive law begin.

It is understood Ms Badenoch will call on the Scottish Government to explain how it has reached the conclusion that allowing people to self-identify as a different gender is the right path for Scotland, its people and the rest of the UK.

A Government source said: ‘Kemi wants to understand what their evidence is. It’s an attempt to urge them to take heed of warnings about the Bill, to rethink age limits and ensure there has been enough safeguarding.’"

And there is this on the support the SNP needs:

"This newspaper is aware of Nationalist rebels – who earlier this month staged the biggest rebellion in 15 years of SNP rule over the plans – rallying the support of opposition MSPs to help them defeat their own government this week. In particular, they are targeting Scottish Labour members who they claim will be the ‘kingmakers’ in deciding whether or not the gender reform Bill goes through.
One SNP insider last night told The Mail on Sunday: ‘We need their [MSPs’] support.’

Another said: ‘Those who stood up against the reforms have had significant support internally, and there is a recognition that some of those who are standing up for women and girls are doing so at great personal cost.’
Although they declined to say if more Nationalist MSPs were set to rebel, one source said: ‘I suspect there will be some colleagues who are increasingly anxious about their position.’ "

OP posts:
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happydappy2 · 20/12/2022 13:34

The only way out of this shitshow is to repeal the GRA-anything less is a fudge that will still cause problems for women.

RealFeminist · 20/12/2022 13:30

HopRockers · 20/12/2022 11:50

Is it normal to expect opposition MSPs to do your bidding? (& surely they expect that to be publicised?!)
Sounds quite mad to me but then often parliamentary stuff does...

ITS LIKE THE CHRISTMAS TRUCE THIS WEEK WERE EXPECTIN ALL THE TORIES TAE JOIN IN WI SNP BILLS

ArabellaScott · 20/12/2022 13:26

ResisterRex · 20/12/2022 11:40

Findlay on a letter he received from the SNP about his amendment. He's been asked not to push it:

twitter.com/russellfindlay1/status/1605155200444112897?s=46&t=3cGPK4PwYx_nOfVZK2gCQw

good god.

Said Minister was Robison, afaik.

Abccde · 20/12/2022 13:04

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 20/12/2022 12:48

It is. I am genuinely beginning to worry about the competence of the Scottish government. I was previously a staunch indy supporter but this whole gra debacle is making me seriously reconsider.

But the Labour Party are culpable with there support.

This was the perfect chance for them to gain support.

I don't know what's happened to Scottish politicians - there used to be some good ones!

Datun · 20/12/2022 13:01

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 20/12/2022 12:48

It is. I am genuinely beginning to worry about the competence of the Scottish government. I was previously a staunch indy supporter but this whole gra debacle is making me seriously reconsider.

Exactly. They aren't just looking misogynistic, they are looking ridiculous.

Datun · 20/12/2022 12:58

The absolute insanity of nonsensical statements like trying to 'make it a criminal offence offence if people lie', or saying you can't treat transwomen in such in such a way, when they are pushing through a law which effectively eliminates the whole concept of being trans.

Anyone can apply to be the opposite sex. They've abolished all and any criteria.

Any person, whatever their condition, whatever their motivation, can apply to be the opposite sex, even if they're just doing it for a laugh, to prove a point, or because they've got nothing better to do that afternoon. There's no criteria that says otherwise.

The 'living as the opposite sex' is absolutely meaningless. Where's the list?

This desperate attempt to push through a nonsensical law will, apart from anything else, showing people up to be the power crazy, or utterly misogynistic, or thick as two short planks, danger they are.

There must be umpteen significant people, now, who have done a serious doubletake at what the fuck is going on.

It might be naive, but I imagine this is going somewhere to strengthening the backbone of Westminster. Seeing the decent, articulate and educated opposition will be noted.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 20/12/2022 12:48

Whereareyourshoes · 20/12/2022 12:36

It’s all quite astonishing.

It is. I am genuinely beginning to worry about the competence of the Scottish government. I was previously a staunch indy supporter but this whole gra debacle is making me seriously reconsider.

Whereareyourshoes · 20/12/2022 12:36

ResisterRex · 20/12/2022 11:40

Findlay on a letter he received from the SNP about his amendment. He's been asked not to push it:

twitter.com/russellfindlay1/status/1605155200444112897?s=46&t=3cGPK4PwYx_nOfVZK2gCQw

It’s all quite astonishing.

ResisterRex · 20/12/2022 11:55

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 20/12/2022 11:46

He says the SNP have asked him to drop his amendment so their backbenchers don’t get a vote on the bill

interesting

This is mad. The headline would be:

"SNP asked me to protect sex offenders, not the public: my story by MSP Findlay"

Or something.

OP posts:
HopRockers · 20/12/2022 11:50

Is it normal to expect opposition MSPs to do your bidding? (& surely they expect that to be publicised?!)
Sounds quite mad to me but then often parliamentary stuff does...

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 20/12/2022 11:46

He says the SNP have asked him to drop his amendment so their backbenchers don’t get a vote on the bill

interesting

ResisterRex · 20/12/2022 11:40

Findlay on a letter he received from the SNP about his amendment. He's been asked not to push it:

twitter.com/russellfindlay1/status/1605155200444112897?s=46&t=3cGPK4PwYx_nOfVZK2gCQw

OP posts:
ArabellaScott · 20/12/2022 09:41

Thanks. That will be very interesting. And I predict quite tense.

BlackForestCake · 20/12/2022 09:34

As I understand it, yes.

ArabellaScott · 20/12/2022 09:26

I see Stage 3 is to be debated in the Chamber - this is apparently the Big Room - does it mean the whole parliament will be there? And it will be voted on by the full parliament, instead of just the 7 members of the committee?

ResisterRex · 20/12/2022 08:46

Just seen:

twitter.com/fairplaywomen/status/1605114539607052289?s=46&t=3cGPK4PwYx_nOfVZK2gCQw

"BREAKING NEWS
The EHRC has written to stakeholders of the Scottish GRR bill, including Fair Play For Women, questioning the advice given by the UN expert on Gender Identity Victor Madrigal-Borloz.

We are sharing a copy of that briefing on our website

fairplayforwomen.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/12/EHRC-Briefing-on-Gender-Recognition-Reform.pdf"

OP posts:
ResisterRex · 20/12/2022 07:26

HopRockers · 20/12/2022 00:04

Looks like they're pushing for all the amendments to fail...
mobile.twitter.com/holyroodmandy/status/1604961008086405146

I saw the first tweet and couldn't figure out what it means.

At this stage I'd not be surprised to either see it pass, or for an act of god to somehow happen and stop proceedings.

OP posts:
HopRockers · 20/12/2022 00:04

Looks like they're pushing for all the amendments to fail...
mobile.twitter.com/holyroodmandy/status/1604961008086405146

Signalbox · 19/12/2022 21:54

TiddlesTheTiger · 19/12/2022 21:23

It should be debated during stage 3, which happens on Tues and Wed.

If it passes, it still means that sex offenders can get a GRC - they just have to wait till after the trial, whether found guilty or not.

How can they seriously believe there's no impact on women, when they don't even want to prevent proven sex offenders from legally being 'women'?

I guess if they make an exception for sex offenders that would show they don't truly believe in their own ideology. I suspect the amendment will fail. They are extremists.

TiddlesTheTiger · 19/12/2022 21:23

Signalbox · 19/12/2022 19:13

Wasn't there a second amendment that sought to prevent those who where awaiting trial for sexual offences to change their "gender" until after the trial was completed? Does anyone know what happened with that?

It should be debated during stage 3, which happens on Tues and Wed.

If it passes, it still means that sex offenders can get a GRC - they just have to wait till after the trial, whether found guilty or not.

How can they seriously believe there's no impact on women, when they don't even want to prevent proven sex offenders from legally being 'women'?

RhannionKPSS · 19/12/2022 21:19

ILoveJKR · 19/12/2022 10:51

Where can I find details of the rally?

1 pm - 2 pm Wednesday 21st at Scottish Parliament.

BlackForestCake · 19/12/2022 21:18

I seem to recall that she then resigned when she became romantically involved with an SNP MSP.

I haven't kept up with Kez's love life. My recollection is that she resigned when she led the party to under 14% in the opinion polls.

HopRockers · 19/12/2022 21:16

TiddlesTheTiger · 19/12/2022 21:13

I'd give it a go anyway, saying you are writing on their behalf and giving their names and contact info.
It's MSPs you need to write to, tho, as it's the Scottish Parliament.
You can find out who they are here www.theyworkforyou.com

Or use www.writetothem.com and it will send the emails for you too.

HopRockers · 19/12/2022 21:14

ResisterRex · 19/12/2022 21:11

Or look into their souls

Yep!

I would put money on the only people who would be prosecuted are people doing it as protest to show up self ID. Not the flashers or rapists. 🤬

TiddlesTheTiger · 19/12/2022 21:13

BelenaConhamHarter · 19/12/2022 19:33

But this is my problem. One is elderly and the other has learning disabilities, we are not far from having power of attorney and also worryingly close to having to deal with all the fall out of this direct.

I'd give it a go anyway, saying you are writing on their behalf and giving their names and contact info.
It's MSPs you need to write to, tho, as it's the Scottish Parliament.
You can find out who they are here www.theyworkforyou.com

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