Women's rights general conversations

Am I still on a feminism board? Do we really have a man mansplaining using prostituted women on a women's rights thread?

JFC.

Another thing: women who have suffered abuse often respond to this deep trauma by 1. risky behaviour and 2. hypersexualised behaviour.

A form of self harm. A way of trying to turn the bad experiences into something good, justify them, minimise them. Or even just a way to relive them, over and over, like a bad dream, in the way humans sometimes do when they are traumatised.

This thread isn't going quite as I'd expected... seems to be an exchange between a bloke who doesn't care what we think and we don't care what he thinks.

I'm going to butt in at a tangent to remind everyone to visit the petitions board once in a while - there's often stuff worth supporting, some explicitly feminist, some not.

www.mumsnet.com/talk/petitions_noticeboard

I saw the thread about sex work and unpunting a couple of months ago, I think I linked it to a thread on FWR.

The twitter thread posted by a pp led me to a site where former sex workers posted their stories. I read a couple, it was very depressing. The ones I read, they seemed to just fall into it and then it was like mission creep. One couldn't make her rent and her nice, fairly personable, landlord made an offer. Then his friend, the money was good but the lies cost. Then can't afford to be choosy, and so it escalates. This woman seemed to have avoided the worst of drugs and pimps. But was very lucky to get out.

Re. My transphobic things...bravo!

I've seen some Mr Menno's stuff on YouTube. I know he did a pastiche Doh Ray Me about pronouns. I hope I didn't subconsciously plagiarise him. Apologies if I did.

Now I've got, if you've got a cock and you're wearing a frock.....that's MRA, If you 'just want to pee' but your pronouns are 'she'......that's MRA.

Prostitution takes away every bit of a woman's choice, leaving the punter and the pimp with all the choice in the world. Prostitution is what is done to women, not something women would choose if they had an alternative.

• Fiona Broadfoot, sex-trade survivor.

When boys at Eton and Harrow have prostitution suggested to them as a career choice, and their parents cheer them to offer blowjobs for cash, I will believe that prostitution is a choice.

There are similar reports from ex porn stars too.

I think Hoff needs to read the thread in relationships.

I suspect they don’t.

And I suspect that in this era of digital signatures, that if their content escapes onto other platforms their images will be held and searchable by those with the means in the future.

Hey Hoff, did you have to sell your arsehole and mouth to the highest bidding dick to stay alive while you were squatting?

Do you think that I'd you had you might have convinced yourself that you were OK with that in order to survive mentally too?

I also suspect that many people who do this kind of work probably do tell others that it’s fine, because, well, nobody wants to admit how shit everything really might be.

You suspect right. At a fairly recent Nordic Model Now meeting the ex-prostitutes said that when in it you have to keep insisting that it's fine, you can handle it, you're in control. To ask women who are still being prostituted to admit the horror is extremely cruel and for their own sanity they won't do it.

One woman said that she has only got angrier about what happened to her the more years that have past since she managed to get out.

And I don't think a lot of them are aware that these things will escalate, to compete they will need to go further, degrade themselves more, do more extreme things etc

Yes. Only fans were to make money you just have to degrade yourself. Just do acts to keep those punters happy…

You knew them while you were ‘squatting’ ?

So tell us. These women, they had loving families, and were educated enough to get well paying jobs, no drug dependencies, they had accommodation that was safe and clean and they had all the options that women should have?

Oh. And they just loved sex with strangers for money and kicks?

File under: Men Who Know Women Better Than They Know Themselves.

Yes the degradation and humiliation aspect was another thing I was thinking in terms of how it's not even so straight forward awful as just having someone stick their appendage in you.

The mental toll it takes on a person is a massive part of the damage prostitution, cam or only fans do.

It's not about view or opinions, but knowing the motivation or coercion and protection (or not) of sex workers

I just happened to know a few as friends when I was squatting in South London many years ago

Funnily enough we don't give a shiny shite what you think either, you've proven yourself a giant misogynist so.... don't let the door hit you on the arse.

I also don't think it matters, nor should we have to justify our close relations or not with anyone who is in prostitution.

As women we are supremely qualified to judge the harms done by prostitution and the men who use prostitutes. We see it all the time. You have demonstrated it here tonight by calling it sex work and touting it as safe and aspirational.

I also suspect that many people who do this kind of work probably do tell others that it’s fine, because, well, nobody wants to admit how shit everything really might be. And it’s that whole idea of selling a skill or a talent. Women lie to men. To please them or to tell them what they think they want to hear.

So, it depends

No. It doesn’t depend.

Did your mates love having strangers dicks shoved inside them? Did they have the education, the opportunity and the self esteem to find other work?

Fuck!!

Excellent come back mate. 👏

Yes, and of course the risk of it being recorded and circulated. I do know someone who did this kind of work and she said a lot of it was about humiliation, along the lines of being asked to do increasingly ridiculous and degrading things.

And we don't care for your views or opinions either.

I really don't care what you think, to be honest

And yes. I have known women who are prostitutes.

You obviously believe that sex work is work to continue to call it ‘sex work’.

It's not complicated, Hoff, duckie.

You're just trying to justify being a misogynist and square it with how you want to be seen as a Good Guy.

I've never advocated for that nor excused it

I just happened to know women who chose a means to earn money, whilst being in control of their environment

I also knew a heroin addict who died from an overdose after getting into prostitution, she was one of my best friends

So, it depends