Women protesting in front of Alameda County Courthouse attacked!

I am adding this post, it is from a sub stack but even if you take out any personal slant on this, the facts about what this male who was being protested in Oakland by these women are grim.

However, the facts are two lesbians, two wives, and their son were brutally murdered.

"three innocents, a white woman and a black woman married to one another and their adopted black son".

This is grim reading people. But if you needed to understand just how horrific the crimes of this male are, I suspect that this will give you some indication.

mandystadtmiller.substack.com/p/rabbitholed-78-dana-rivers-is-the?utm_source=twitter&sd=pf

Thanks Arabella and Datun

I must give onnabug high marks for the driving up the hyperbole on this one. I have been posting in between stuff and never quite addressing the fuckwittery that had been dialled up to 11/10 on this thread.

Just to bring this tactic and lay it bare.

This is how many ways this poster has rolled out the "dismiss violence by minimising it, even while denying minimising/dismissing it" tactic:

06/12/2022 17:43 "A pie in the face, eggs being thrown, signs snatched are not “going too far” or considered “violence” in a country where other protesters are regularly shot with rubber bullets and some are even shot and killed with real bullets or killed by being rammed by a car or SUV (yes I’m talking about even since 2020, not in the bad old days)."

06/12/2022 22:05 "If it’s a “new norm” for the USA it is actually quite heartening to see compared to killed by gun violence, death by vehicle, water cannons and tear gas."

pivot to now superficially acknowledge violence, while still dismissing it

06/12/2022 22:36 "I said it’s not acceptable, but given the way protests in the USA can and have gone down, I think it’s pretty tone deaf to imply what happened is some new escalation of violence when it is clearly a significant de-escalation of violence."

"I dont know if you have seen Antifa in action before? Usually they’re not coming at you with cream pies and eggs. Usually it’s bricks and glass bottles."

"It’s not wrong to point out these women were actually quite lucky. It could have been much worse."

06/12/2022 23:16 "It’s a bit naive to be pretending that cream pies and an egg or two are some new escalation in violence for the US and women are being targeted with heightened violence and assaults. What these women experienced could easily have been far worse."

and

"Side note: King Charles III has had eggs thrown at him twice in the past month….what’s your thought on that?"

06/12/2022 23:48 "Don’t be ridiculous, you’re only upset because it’s showing the shock & horror over a cream pie and an egg or two, is over-egging things a bit. You can decry violence while putting it into its proper perspective:"

07/12/2022 00:19 "Its all violence, but some violence is objectively worse than other violence so that’s not something I would say."

07/12/2022 10.22 "Im not dismissing any violence btw, Ive said it is all violence.

"It seems you are the only one dismissing violence by firstly neglecting to mention the greatest violence in Tacoma was done by women and when that is pointed out, you then go on to justify this violence because it was done by a woman." (Note: thereby stating that no woman should defend herself against a larger person's spitting after 4 minutes of being intimidated )

07/12/2022 10:50 "Of course all violence is unacceptable, but, yes I am uncomfortable with your attempt to portray a cream pie and a few eggs by calling it some “new norm” and implying that it is more violent than before- when over a dozen protesters have been killed at USA protests in since Covid, the vast majority of whom have been black men and women."

and

"So, yes it is my opinion that it is tone deaf to sit in the U.K. and demand the USA should express moral outrage over a few white women getting some whipped cream and egg yolk on them. The USA doesn’t see anything less than actual bodily harm (mace, punching, hitting) and death as violence. We do, but they do not. They do not count the wounded pride of white women having egg on their face."

and

"Yes, I am giving you backlash for caring more about white women with cream and egg on them than you care about minority men and women being beaten unconscious or murdered at USA protests.".

07/12/2022 16:50. "It was peaceful by US standards as no one was injured."

and

"I am bringing race into it because the optics of your initial posts are tone deaf to imply cream pies and eggs are some “new norm” of heightened violence"

and

"It’s not dismissing violence to state that cream pies and eggs are not as violent as being punched until unconscious, maced, shot and killed or rammed by a car and killed."

and

"one small protest in California met with a cream pie and eggs"

07/12/2022 17:07 "unlike many other peaceful protests, no one was injured or killed."

and

"I’m not saying don’t talk about it, it’s perfectly fine to talk about every protest and what happened at it. It’s ok to condemn all violence and call the cream pie and eggs out as unacceptable. What’s not ok is erasing the injuries and deaths of mostly minority peaceful protesters"

07/12/2022 17:39 "they lobbed food at women."

All because a thread was started about a group of about 10-15 diverse women protesting in California who were attacked while standing silently protesting.

I finally have a spare moment to address the pivots and the whataboutery that has gone on in the past few pages.

it’s a bit tone deaf to say. Apparently, my saying 'This seems to be the new norm' was tone deaf because what I didn't say explicitly was the parameters of what I said it seems to be the new norm for.

Any person who has been discussing the violence at the women's rallies, the ones where women give speeches on FWR over the past few months would reasonably assume that the topic I was referring to was 'for small scale women's rallies'.

Of which, I have yet to see this poster post an example of a 'let women speak' rally that prior to this being attacked.

When you look at the USA and protests that this “new norm” is actually much less violent than in the recent past and of such insignificance compared to the murderous violence that quite a few peaceful BLM protesters have faced in recent years.

So, then this is where this poster has now used a false comparison. They have taken a very small scale, local event and then tried to compare what happened there to what happens as very large scale protests. Ones formed in reaction to some horrific event and well publicised for anyone to join.

It is a really nice touch to see the "If it’s a “new norm” for the USA it is actually quite heartening to see compared to killed by gun violence, death by vehicle, water cannons and tear gas."

The desired effect is = there is nothing to see here, these women should fucking think themselves lucky and they and you should all stop talking about it. And preferrably, they should stop.

Ignoring that even a small scale event of women peacefully standing in silence holding up words is now subject to violence. No need to prioritise the degree of violence. Just that. They were attacked.

Then came the attempt to avoid the accusations of dismissing violence, while attempting to minimise the violence to the point where it is effectively 'dismissing violence'.

I said it’s not acceptable, but given the way protests in the USA can and have gone down, I think it’s pretty tone deaf to imply what happened is some new escalation of violence when it is clearly a significant de-escalation of violence.

Then came the specific examples of horrendous violence that resulted in deaths during very large scale protests.

And to somehow make the point that our narrow focus on this one event, and the implications of the past very small scale events where women were speaking at a small rally, was naive and missing the point that violence happens and there is nothing to discuss here.

Let's remember that King Charles III has had eggs thrown at him twice in the past month….what’s your thought on that? attempt at assuring us all that cream pies and an egg or two is absolutely nothing worth discussing. Because What these women experienced could easily have been far worse.

The desired effect is still = there is nothing to see here, these women should fucking think themselves lucky and they and you should all stop talking about it. And preferrably, they should stop. Even King Charles III has had eggs thrown at him. A man with considerable power and considerable political clout is compared to everyday women standing up for women.

Then the attempt to portray some significant misrepresentation about what happened at Tacoma. Because apparently, women should not defend themselves in this poster's eyes. Hey ... what is a bit of spit and intimidation, eh?

But apparently, Im not dismissing any violence btw, Ive said it is all violence. and the greatest violence in Tacoma was done by women. Translation - No... I am not dismissing violence, but .... that woman should not have defended herself because it was only her having a large person walk directly up to her, nearly nose to nose, stare at her for nearly 4 minutes and then spit at her. Not a violent act at all...

Then came these gems

Of course all violence is unacceptable, but, yes I am uncomfortable with your attempt to portray a cream pie and a few eggs by calling it some “new norm” and implying that it is more violent than before- when over a dozen protesters have been killed at USA protests in since Covid, the vast majority of whom have been black men and women.

So.... still denouncing violence, while minimising violent acts against women. Still using the false comparator of large scale protests to minimise these small acts of violence on a thread specifically started to discuss only the events of 'let women speak' and similar, like this one in Oakland.

But now we have a poster politicising race as some kind of gotcha.

It’s a violent country. The women who went are undeniably brave to have gone. Especially the Black woman as the risk to her is far greater over there due to how racist that country is.

Yes, we are fully aware how racist the USA can be and how violent, but this was a protest for women of all backgrounds. And this poster has also made a judgement call on every single one of those 10 - 15 women's racial background.

Talk about hypocrisy writ large.

I am giving you backlash for caring more about white women with cream and egg on them than you care about minority men and women being beaten unconscious or murdered at USA protests. I know you’ll “say” you care about both, but if you actually did you would not have written your opening the posts in such a manner so as to erase these injuries and deaths by pretending cream pies and eggs are a “new norm” that represents higher levels of violence.

No, I do care. But it is very evident that you have decided to build this very fine straw man and burn it to the ground all yourself.

And careful, your continued dismissal thrown in with this new style 'acknowledge that it is violence, but it really isn't' is joined by the fact that you have made the assumptions about the racial background of the women present.

You are the only one here attempting to twist this into a racial discussion because it is pretty clear from the presence of women from different backgrounds that they were not making this protest from a racial point of view.

The desired effect of bring race into this discussion as a gotcha = there is nothing to see here, these women should fucking think themselves lucky and they and you should all stop talking about it. And preferrably, they should stop. Even King Charles III has had eggs thrown at him. A man with considerable power and considerable political clout is compared to everyday women standing up for women. AND now we should be discussing black men and women instead of this small group of 10-15 women of diverse backgrounds because you are racist.

I will stop there because this pivots and the twists are really clear and have become repetitive.

I think I made it clear pages ago what the scope of this thread was. I also have quite clearly stated that I am not sharing my opinions about any other protests or violent acts. Because it is such a huge topic and doing so would, I daresay, render this thread irrelevant. Which is your aim.

When I asked for evidence that comparative like for like events were so violent, you pivoted with 'I’ve not said every protest is met with violence at all. I have said that on average, US protests tend to be more violent than the protest you are pretending was a “new norm” and “of concern” due to “violence” implying what happened at this one protest was far more violent than average..when it is not.'

Fuck... well... how bizarre. I was NOT referring to 'average US protests' on this thread, I was NOT referring to large protests.

I was only ever talking about 'small scale' women speaking events. I doubt that they are in any way near 'average'.

Yet, we as posters have been accused of all sorts of things, including racism I believe.

Dismissal by the degree of minimisation you have done here, still has the impact of dismissing the violence.

Please, engage with the actual topic of the thread.

As I said on your thread. How strange that you used such polarisation on your thread, and here you are attempting a targeted 'proportionality' tactic. But they are just tactics that you are using to get to the same outcome.

These are silencing tactics.

I think anyone portraying this group as only white feminists, clearly has made some incorrect assumptions about the backgrounds of the women protesting.

That would be rather hypocritical wouldn’t it?

Yes. You are right.

How remarkable that you agree with onnabug. I believe you too dismissed the violence in Tacoma. Despite me asking numerous times whether you really were dismissing it.

Because surely, antelope, someone such as you who has posted such surprising posts (Hong Kong boarding school ring a bell as an immediate start) expressing the intensity of your dislike of Kellie Jay Keen and who decreed yourself the real type of feminist would not dismiss any violent act towards women, even those you vehemently disagree with.

I don’t believe you acknowledged that violence against the women on that thread at the time. I am very happy for you to point me to the time stamp where you did post a clear acknowledgment thought . I remember that I think I combed through the thread twice looking for that acknowledgment at the time.

Remarkable that you have now again joined a poster who wishes to make this thread about anything but the violence experienced in Oakland where it was women of a range of backgrounds protesting.

They were protesting peacefully about the potential that Rivers would be placed in a female prison cell. For murdering two women who were lesbians and their teenaged son.

Do you agree that this murderer should not be placed in a female prison estate ?

Or do you think this male should be placed in a female prison estate, where this male could and most likely would then share a cell with a female inmate?

While I agree with you that violence is not OK for either sex, I am not sure why you think this has been staged.

I have never heard of women protesting about males being incarcerated with females if those males say they are women staging any fake attacks. I cannot fathom why they ever would.

Considering there is a group claiming to have done it, it seems even more remotely plausible that it was staged.

Do you mean feminists? Feminists have been involved in human deception?

Which feminists please? I would like to know more.

Dear MNHQ, Please note that the above post is a direct cut and paste from the link above from the trans activists that stole the banners from the protestors in Oakland.

This is most certainly not my words.