Transman wants to join lesbian group...

Has he said he sees himself as a lesbian? If is a group for lesbians and he sees himself as a heterosexual male, it is not the best group for him.

I personally think that a lesbian group is for biological women who know they are biological women & are attracted to other biological women who also accept their reality.

If this was a woman who wanted to detransition, then I'd welcome them.
That would mean they did not use a male name or he/him etc..

If this was woman who denied the biological reality of being a lesbian or the fact that only biological women can be lesbians, then they have no place there.

What happens when they make friends with a man who wants to call himself a lesbian & bring them along, because they are 'all lesbians together'?

It's just wedging the door open to trouble if they are in denial about their own sex.

You are clear and correct that transmen are women. This person is demanding that everyone go along with her belief that transmen are men. You don't have to.
Imagine that instead of being a believer in gender ideology, they were a part of a religious cult which was deeply homophobic, and they agreed with the cult leaders that everyone in the group was going to be eaten by aliens at some unspecified future date. That would be a massive downer for everyone.
Whether or not this person is female is not the point at issue. All you have to decide is whether you want them in your private group.

For all I know, this may be an attempt at a gotcha, but it's missed the mark. Your group is not a job, or service.

She turned up unannounced. I wasn't there. It's an invitation-only group that publicises its meetings on what was thought to be a secure SM account.
I wasn't going to post as it's not my place but this set off all kinds of alarm bells for me. That's all I'm going to say.

They are new to the area and looking for friends.
That doesn't make sense. Of all the social groups in the area, why would a "man" choose a women-only one?
But basically it is a private closed social group so you can ask anyone you want, or bar anyone you want.
Absolutely this. It's a private club.

But <opens eyes wide> transmen are men aren't they?

I'm confused by your male friend wanting to join a lesbian group ...

I wonder if the lady who doesn't want to deal with it would feel differently if this person did not insist on being treated as male? If so, it might be worth putting that to the individual that while they recognizer her as female not everyone is willing to observe gender ideology niceties like pronouns, and see what the response is.

But basically it is a private closed social group so you can ask anyone you want, or bar anyone you want.

It would be reasonable to exclude this lesbian - being female makes them eligible to join, it doesn't entitle them to join.

This thread feels goady to me, like a chance to pounce on the terfs with screenshots on twitter.

But I'll add my thoughts anyway, in case I'm wrong.

If a trans identifying woman, beard or no, is exclusively attracted to women, then I wouldn't see a problem per se with that person attending a lesbian only group. (I'm lesbian btw)

I wouldn't be interested in a romantic relationship with said person, however, because we clearly disagree on some quite fundamental issues. But other lesbians may feel differently, which is fine.

I've done it again! Sorry, mods and trans allies.

Yes, she is a lesbian. But she doesn't just "happen to use a male name and have facial hair", does she? It's not an unfortunate physical condition that she suffers from. It's a conscious choice to socially and medically transition because you are ashamed of/disgusted by/uncomfortable with your own female body for any number of reasons. You can't ignore the politics.

You said in your opening post that this person is a woman. So you put up with it. If you want to subscribe to the idea that they are a man then you can challenge it. Up to you but make your decision carefully.

So she's a woman, who is attracted to women, who just so happens to use a male name and have facial hair?

In my book, that's a lesbian and they should be welcomed.

Oh, bollocks - just imagine I've used "they" instead of her in the previous two posts!

thing, not think, obv!
Point is, everybody's feelings matter, not just hers.

First think to say is that I don't think you are obliged to admit her just because she is female. This isn't a council service, a sports club or anything like that. It's a very personal thing - women getting together as lesbians, female energy etc. She doesn't have a right to join, nobody does.

You should explain to her what that the issues are - her rejection of womanhood and how others in the group feel about it, etc and invite her to compromise - eg not insisting on male pronouns. That would be very weird in an all-female group.

Then, depending on what they say and how willing they are to compromise, put it to the vote.

I'm not a lesbian, but I would assume that a transman who wanted to join a lesbian group is taking a step towards coming to terms with reality. These women are victims of trans ideology, and all female lesbian groups potentially could provide support as they heal.
I wouldn't have time for any nonsense about pretending that she's a man though.

I would allow her to join because I'm not prepared to give an inch to the idea that she is a man or that TWAW.

But I certainly would not be tiptoeing around them or avoiding confrontation.

I think it's reasonable to ask her to explain herself and make clear that male pronouns are not welcome in an all-female group. Then they can decide for themselves.

if you exclude her on the basis that TMAM then you have to accept the idea that TWAW.

This.

I am a lesbian & would have no problem welcoming this person (though I wouldn't see them as a man, so who knows whether they'd want to be around me!). They are female and presumably exclusively same-sex attracted, therefore a lesbian, so keeping them out seems rather petty to me. Clearly they have some level of open-mindedness because they're not sticking to the precise dogma that transmen can't be lesbians. Integration between gender-affirmative and gender-critical groups can be valuable if it's done in a respectful way.

Same issue as young gay guy with internalised homophobia who is perhaps non conforming so society, culture, Tumblr says non conforming means he is actually a she/her/them. Hey presto elective double mastectomy, hormones, irreversible damage, infertility, mental health issues all being promoted and normalised by Stonewall, Mermaids and Pink news.

All very sad, this person maybe predatory or considering detrans but they would be able to say that during screening for a female only space. .

I'd be saying as Lesbians are female and this person self identifies a male they will need to state their biological sex to be allowed entry to a female only space.

Is there any truth that it is becoming wide spread for butch lesbians to micro dose on Testosterone to grow facial hair? Or was the poster who told us that just over exaggerating the prevalence?

I posted the ‘can’t have it both ways’ message.

I totally understand the logical argument for a same sex attracted female being allowed to attend but I don’t understand WHY this particular one would want to. The thread feels like a bit of a GC ‘gotcha’.

I dunno, if you exclude her on the basis that TMAM then you have to accept the idea that TWAW.
No. The distinction is whether you believe that bio-sex is paramount or gender-ID is.