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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Second/third wave feminists argued against a biological definition of womanhood??

32 replies

resistingreality · 10/11/2022 17:47

I just saw this by Zoe Williams in The Guardian. I know she has form ... but did all second and third wave feminists argue against a biological definition of womanhood? I wasn't aware of that. I mean Butler maybe ... but otherwise? Overall, this seems such a weird place to shoehorn something on TERFs and what it takes to be a woman. I don't think women have to suffer with childbirth etc to be a woman, but I do know only women experience childbirth.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/nov/10/jennifer-aniston-fertility-obsession-ivf

OP posts:
WomenShouldWinWomensSports · 10/11/2022 18:35

Seems odd that she's lumping second and third wave feminism together. They were waves for a reason.

Secondly, she's the one guilty of reductionism here, not feminists.

Thirdly, feminists aren't a homogeneous group all spouting the same echo chamber ideals. I once read (I want to say it was Binford, the archaeologist, but I'm not sure) something that said if an academic discipline isn't in a healthy state of debate it's become stagnant and is dying. So it seems particularly ridiculous to try and reduce any academic standpoint (or the cultural movement aspect) to a single unified voice, and almost seems to be intentionally implying that it is dying out.

And I will not accept that feminism is in its death throes when so much is being achieved.

JacquelinePot · 10/11/2022 18:32

Sex is defined by biology, but we should not be limited by it. Can I write a graun collumn, now?

Live4weekend · 10/11/2022 18:29

As a girl who came of age in the 90s I was able to have children (something I always wanted) and have a career.

There is nothing to be ashamed of wanting to be a mother, just like there is nothing to be ashamed of not wanting to he a mother.

I went through my own fertility struggles so I do sympathise with how difficult it must have been for Jen and she had the added difficulty of being in the public eye.

FwIW I don't feel that things will be as good for my daughter as they were for me and god help her if she ever needs to seek refuge.

I don't blame feminists for that. I blame people like this Guardian reporter.

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 10/11/2022 18:26

*womanhood
d'oh

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 10/11/2022 18:25

does it matter?

reality has a biological definition of motherhood

NotTerfNorCis · 10/11/2022 18:15

Second- and third-wave feminists used to argue fiercely against a reductive, biological definition of womanhood.

The argument is that women aren't defined by biology alone. Being female doesn't mean you should become a mother. But that's not the same as saying biology has nothing to do with being a woman, e.g a woman can as easily be male as female. In fact, a lot of feminist argument comes back to oppression on the basis of sex.

MangyInseam · 10/11/2022 17:53

All seems unlikely but I'd bet there are others besides Butler who did.

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