When did this board become a "safe space"?

In fact we could call it the Scots Government Approach.

Women will be allowed to ask questions, very politely, in a very small amount (to be determined for them) however on a separate thread and not in any way permitted to actually engage with anyone or do anything in order to fight back against the stripping of their rights. Because women resisting men stripping of their rights are just being plain mean and nasty.

How does that song go again? If you want to see sin of the wickedest kind.... here it is!

We'd have to have a separate thread where we listed all the questions for Datun to ask. But we'd need to make sure the recipient of the questions didn't answer any of them on there, because then there'd be no point in having the other thread. This could get complicated.

I'm too impatient so I can't do it.

But you ask such GOOD questions!

Just give everyone a heads up so we can get popcorn & a comfy seat to sit back & watch.

Haha! Much as I love the vote of confidence, I couldn't possibly deprive you all of your question asking. 😁 I mean, it just wouldn't be fair!

Datun, an I'm GC - AMA

Well Datun, another vote from me…

Another vote for Datun.

Possibly we could have a MN webchat style thingy, where all the questions are submitted in advance, then ONE of the easiest is chosen and an advisor writes a very careful answer that says screw you females naicely, and then we're told the subject is closed.

Cos we know all about that.

Or alternatively, we could just go on debating and wait for the rest of the world to start realising that nice, sentimental not looking at the nasty bits and facts sounds lovely, and you can waffle endlessly on paper about how lovely it is, but cold reality is - it doesn't work. Look how it's not working. The evidence is piling up past ignoring point that this is not working.

I wondered if we should have a vote off to the side on who would be the nominated question asker.

Datun, obvs.

I wondered if we should have a vote off to the side on who would be the nominated question asker.

Maybe that is what is expected of us.

I mean, I look back on my posts sometimes and think ‘fuck!’. With the constant pretzeling of words to fit into the guidelines and auto corrections, and typing on a small screen with dodgy focus, it is hard enough to get the questions clear. If I could submit them to the committee, then someone could make sure they are edited properly too before they ask them one at a time.

Will that work?

Or can we just acknowledge that if posters are uncomfortable answering questions and cannot be as honest as posters such as autie and sandwich have been about maybe not having considered all the aspects or themselves getting defensive, that it is their own problem to deal with and maybe they need to go and develop stronger and more robust arguments rather than scolding and emotional manipulation.

I suspect many of the posters who turn up to scold and reprimand think that women shouldn’t challenge them at all and should just say ‘that is nice dear’ and then disappear.

This is the ongoing thing.

This is a womens rights board. It centres adult human females. The experience of, the needs of, the issues of, the challenges, the voices. It's about the only place. You have the whole of the rest of the internet centering the TQ+ and specifically TQ+ male needs, voices, experiences, challenges.

The never ending whine of 'you don't let anyone debate' (so it's an 'echo chamber', God that phrase is so tired now, and therefore those women's voices are invalidated somehow despite being the only place on the internet where they're permitted to talk about these things at all) are invariably followed by what has happened here.

Debate.

Pages of it.

Women listening to what someone is saying with contrasting views, replying, unpicking them, pointing out their own responses in terms of feelings, insights, evidence to support what they are saying.

And then we get scolded for too many women wanting to debate and respond to a poster and participate in the debate in case the one with TQ+ centric views feels uncomfortable (no one incidentally gives a crap about whether those with women-centric views feel or if they're overwhelmed, or being listened to properly, and God knows on many other boards across the internet they'd be chased off in a massed pile on if they dared to speak at all), and a poster encountering actual debate generally either flounces or starts the 'you're being mean to poor me who just wanted to say' thing. It's groundhog day.

Let's face it, the bottom line of 'MN is an echo chamber' is actually 'if you argue back with these views, however right you may be you are a heretic who should not be allowed to speak at all'.

I suspect the only way those TQ+ politics focused people would ever agree women here were being nice enough was if they accepted TQ+ political (anti female) views unquestioningly and with applause. I am over being nice. I've been trying it for years. But if you keep on trying and trying your Patient Griselda act for years with no reciprocation, there comes a point where you are not being a Good Person, you are merely being a mug.

This is an observation, not a criticism. Do you think people who genuinely want to debate and lay out their ideas (like Mylittlesandwich here) could find it overwhelming when more than 1 or 2 posters keep posting and asking lots of questions? I know I would start getting defensive and probably disengage.

Yes. But that's the problem with gender ideology, it can't handle questions.

Most people on here know that the argument for allowing men into women spaces crumbles upon challenge. Both the batshit arguments from TRAs and the why can't we just play nicely arguments from people who haven't given it any extended thought.

The only way to expose the lack of argument is to ask questions.

And you can't force everyone on a thread to sit on their hands while one person gently teases out the naive arguments, and simultaneously annihilates the batshit ones.

Everyone wants to ask, because people are so bloody frustrated by the premise in the first place.

I know I would start getting defensive and probably disengage.

And that is absolutely fine to do.

What is not fine is then blaming others for your defensive reaction and accusing them of not being able to accept other opinions when that would at first glance be hypocritical behaviour.

This is an observation, not a criticism. Do you think people who genuinely want to debate and lay out their ideas (like Mylittlesandwich here) could find it overwhelming when more than 1 or 2 posters keep posting and asking lots of questions? I know I would start getting defensive and probably disengage.

I am sure it is overwhelming. However, if you, general you, cannot adequately defend your opinions against a group asking questions that you cannot answer, do you then accuse that group of being unable to allow other opinions?

Or do you acknowledge that maybe the questions asked are not ones you have ever considered and maybe further discussion is warranted. As has been done.

And by further discussion, I mean discussion. Not resorting to telling others they are creating a hostile environment by asking questions that challenge opinions (which neither autie or sandwich have done since they opened discussion on this thread, by the way. )

Both of us, I only had it about 5 weeks ago too. Thanks for the well wishes.

What helle said

its bad enough feeling sick yourself without throwing a sick child into the mix

get well soon

Both of you sandwich? That is very tough. . I hope you both get better soon and that you have some help and care.

Sorry me and the wee man have come down with covid. Feeling pretty rough so not intentionally ignoring this thread.

Sorry me and the wee man have come down with covid. Feeling pretty rough so not intentionally ignoring this thread.

I will stop now, and see if @Mylittlesandwich comes back to read and comment.

I fully accept that there are people who come on this board who have different opinions.

What I don’t accept is that posters who post snide, berating posts and deserve positive reactions and engagement.

Here is another real life example @Mylittlesandwich for you to consider.

This is what happens when males are given access to the changing rooms for females.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11366041/amp/School-let-trans-girl-making-threats-girl-complained-using-girls-bathroom.html

thenewamerican.com/vermont-high-school-backs-down-over-transgender-incident-after-adf-files-a-first-amendment-lawsuit/

“student, who has been playing on the female volleyball team since the start of the year, came into the locker rooms and ‘stared’ at some of the girls getting changed”

“The player had made an ‘inappropriate remarks.’”

This sounds very similar to what happened when Lia Thomas used the female change rooms, except Thomas was reported in changing openly and exposing their dick while doing so.

I also suggest you look up the Loudon County rape where a male who used the female toilets, claimed their rape of a girl at the school’s female toilets was them ‘falling’ against the girl…. That was the defensive I believe in the court case.

These incidences ARE happening

What is just as similar to the Lia Thomas case, is that the girls in this Vermont school were told they are at fault. The girl in the court case was punished for complaining?

All because some people either don’t believe in the scientifically proven fact there are two sexes and those sexes cannot change and so are ‘sex’ blind while believing ‘gender’ is real and should dictate safeguarding processes.

This is the outcome to claiming that ‘gender’ should be prioritised above the protections put in place for all females.

Do you agree with the policies being adopted by schools that allow these incidences to happen?

Do you think being ‘blind’ to sex and prioritising gender is the way to protect girls and women from males (even teens) doing ‘shitty’ things (to use your own term), or do you think that maybe the many parents and women who spend time on this board scrutinising the policies and discussing the potential and real life outcomes have points that you have not considered or maybe did not know about?

Almost like male advantage cannot be mitigated with hormones after all… but I do look forward to posters posting examples of the elite females of the same age winning in competitions against other elite females who are much younger.

Excess testosterone in females or indeed males is considered as doping and those doing it get banned, but a natural or marginally reduced testosterone level in a male that is way, way way outside the natural level found in females is a-ok for a male when he wants to compete against females - funny that.