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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Most Albanian asylum seekers granted UK visas are trafficked women

91 replies

IwantToRetire · 02/11/2022 17:21

Analysis from the Oxford Migration Observatory reveals that 86 per cent of Albanians who received positive decisions on asylum applications in the year ending June 2022 were women, whose leave to remain was granted on the basis that they were likely to have been trafficked and in genuine need of protection.

uk.news.yahoo.com/revealed-most-albanian-asylum-seekers-161018072.html

Just wanted to post this as the main stream media and the politicians are just whipping up hysteria by not reporting statistical facts.

But then its only women so who cares. :(

OP posts:
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IwantToRetire · 06/11/2022 19:32

There was quite a scary report in the Times today about how rampant criminal gangs are, and how hard it is to get justice etc.. But also (not reported by UK media who seem to ignore European news) that other countries have experienced Albanian gangs using migrant routes to set up networks in other cities, with some sucess.

Seems to be another instance where the UK Government seems to think we really can exist as an island and not be connected, impacted by what is happening elsewhere.

We never seem prepared for anything. News story yesterday that the Government is employee people who have been working at check outs etc., which is not to say they couldn't do the job, but 24 hours training isn't really the basis for making asylum applications. No wonder they are only getting through 1.3 applications a week.

But to add I do think that communities that are mainly made up of men does create problems for immediate neighbours, as no doubt other countries have experienced when workers from the UK go to other countries and form an outside male community.

OP posts:
ScrollingLeaves · 06/11/2022 08:27

Thank you very much, I was very interested to read the facts and statistics about this.
I am glad the U.K. have realised that Albanian trafficked women have no protection in Albania and do need asylum here, even though Albania is not at war.
Of the 55% successful claims, 86% of those are women.

It seems about 45% of Albanians are not successful and the majority of these would be men.. This would still be a large number.
The great problem seems to be that the U.K. does not have enough people working to process the applications quickly enough.

I personally feel worried about Albanian traffickers and criminals moving here.

IwantToRetire · 05/11/2022 21:47

I cant find any specific projects offering support for Albanian Women escaping domestic violence.

There seems to have been some sort of short lived partnership with Solace Women's Aid, not sure if it offers ongiong support. :( shpresaprogramme.org/services/information/domestic-violence/

Some research into the particular problems for women and male violence in Albania:

  1. This paper argues that, in many cases, asylum-seekers from Albania who are victims of domestic violence will not be able to avail themselves of a sufficiency of protection or an internal relocation alternative on return. This will be the case, in particular, for victims of domestic violence who are from poor families, who lack a social support network and/or who have physical or mental disabilities. The paper argues that the Home Office Country Policy and Information Note (CPIN) is wrong where it suggests that such claims can properly be certified as “clearly unfounded” under section 94 of the Nationality, Immigration and Asylum Act 2002.
  2. The paper highlights evidence that victims of domestic violence face significant hurdles in obtaining domestic violence protection orders; that such orders are often ineffective even where they are granted; and that victims can be traced easily in another part of the country through word of mouth. It argues that poverty and lack of a support network are major barriers to accessing effective protection. It also highlights evidence that, aside from the risk from the original abuser, some victims of domestic violence will be vulnerable to trafficking, even if they have not been trafficked in the past. It suggests that when considering whether a victim of domestic violence will be adequately protected on return to Albania, decision-makers should apply the factors in TD and AD (Trafficked women) CG [2016] UKUT 92 (IAC) by analogy.
miclu.org/assets/uploads/2021/02/Albania-victims-of-domestic-violence-paper.pdf

Murders in Albania increased by 13% in 2021. Women and girls killed by their partner, ex-partner or family member made up close to one third of all cases. In most cases, victims had already been granted protection from the police, such as taking out restraining orders against their assailant.

The data reveals a disturbing lack of enforcement regarding domestic violence against women, and the insufficiency of Albania’s legal framework to deal with the issue.

www.eu-ocs.com/pandemic-sees-worsening-domestic-violence-against-women-in-albania/

OP posts:
IwantToRetire · 05/11/2022 21:39

re various comments, I am not saying what is permissable to post, just that in talking about the problem overall the specific situation of women escaping male violence gets lost. It would help if mumsnet talk forum enabled threaded posts, eg being able to group comments about:
women refugees escaping male violence
economic migrants
human trafficking
government incompetence
gorvernment failure to invest in basics means any additional demands create problems
and so on

And I was asked what I would want. But I am old enough to know what I want and what I can get or expect are two very different things.

Did anyone listen to any answers this afternoon?

OP posts:
Kissingfrogs25 · 03/11/2022 19:44

IwantToRetire · 03/11/2022 16:17

Just a reminder that the title of this was asylum seekers granted UK visas

It seems that the screaming headlines have worked to the extent that we cant have a proper discussion about asylum seekers, including the fact that the Rwanda proposal is in breach of the Human Rights convention that the UK signed.

As to the earlier remark about what my opinion was, is that the UK would do far better to face up to helping sort out the problems it created in other countries, eg Syria and doing something to pay back the benefits to countries we have profited from in the past, so that the peole who live there can attain a life style that means that dont think coming to richer europeans countries is there only hope of a better life.

But as others have said, as a country how is it not possible to sort out women fleeing violence and needing shelter / asylum?

Everything is always going to be worse than it need be if we cant manage the basics, eg have enough affordable housing, enough schools, and an NHS that is leaking staff because the working conditions and pay is so awful.

Op this to me just sounds like wishful thinking. We are trillions of pounds in debt after the pandemic. We simply do not have the resources to prop up the numbers you suggest.
We are struggling to secure funding for our local domestic violence shelters for women here, much less all the need globally.

As wonderful as it would be it’s simply not realistic, and won’t be for years.

Discovereads · 03/11/2022 18:43

eveoha · 03/11/2022 17:58

How can a person be born in the UK and then ‘trafficked’ to the UK ?

1/3rd (34%) of trafficked people in the U.K. are British born (male and female)

You can be trafficked without being trafficked across international borders.

Tallisker · 03/11/2022 18:28

eveoha · 03/11/2022 17:58

How can a person be born in the UK and then ‘trafficked’ to the UK ?

I think it's trafficked in the UK, rather than to the UK. So driven to different towns for exploitation.

eveoha · 03/11/2022 18:00

Above post was referencing ‘discover reads’ assertion re 1/3 of women uk born being trafficked ☘️👍🏿

eveoha · 03/11/2022 17:58

How can a person be born in the UK and then ‘trafficked’ to the UK ?

Sausagenbacon · 03/11/2022 17:00

I think it's striking how the op uses intemperate language while blaming others of being intemperate. Get your own house in order

LemonSwan · 03/11/2022 16:58

You have lost me OP. Can only talk about female Albanians but now we are talking about Syria. The boundaries of the conversation are confusing so 🤷‍♀️

cosmiccosmos · 03/11/2022 16:35

We keep hearing they come to the uk because of the language yet then there is talk about translation services and English courses and thousands spent on providing it.

Then the family claim - of course the moment one person get granted a right to stay they will have family here. This will just then explode, it's not a good enough reason.

They all want to work and/or are qualified. I can guarantee the moment that someone says they should do xyz job eg fruit picking the lawyers will be on it saying they shouldn't be forced to work or do jobs they don't want to. Anyway if they can't speak English it's hard to work here. Where are the stats about this - none of them have papers so where is the evidence they are all qualified.

I don't mind supporting women as they vulnerable and have been trafficked. But I don't want all these young males and don't see they have reason enough to be allowed to stay here. Germany had untold problems with the all the young men that Merkel let in.

Lastly there is talk now if those being he's receiving compensation. Whilst thousands in the uk can't get seen by a doctor and are struggling. It's a disgrace.

ArabellaScott · 03/11/2022 16:23

What screaming headlines? The first article I read about this was the BBC one, prompted by your thread.

Sure, we can talk about visas granted, but the thread is discussing the issue in general, no?

What has been the UK's involvement in Albania? Have we caused problems there that mean we have responsibility to sort out organised crime in Albania?

I mean it would be wonderful if we could solve all the world's problems, obviously. But it seems a bit simplistic to think that we have that power - or even that right.

IwantToRetire · 03/11/2022 16:17

Just a reminder that the title of this was asylum seekers granted UK visas

It seems that the screaming headlines have worked to the extent that we cant have a proper discussion about asylum seekers, including the fact that the Rwanda proposal is in breach of the Human Rights convention that the UK signed.

As to the earlier remark about what my opinion was, is that the UK would do far better to face up to helping sort out the problems it created in other countries, eg Syria and doing something to pay back the benefits to countries we have profited from in the past, so that the peole who live there can attain a life style that means that dont think coming to richer europeans countries is there only hope of a better life.

But as others have said, as a country how is it not possible to sort out women fleeing violence and needing shelter / asylum?

Everything is always going to be worse than it need be if we cant manage the basics, eg have enough affordable housing, enough schools, and an NHS that is leaking staff because the working conditions and pay is so awful.

OP posts:
MarshaBradyo · 03/11/2022 15:51

ArabellaScott · 03/11/2022 15:48

'newspapers shouting about 10,000 Albanian men arriving by boat isn't the same as being able to say that the UK has granted 10,000 Albanian men.'

It comes to the same thing, surely, if those 10,000 men are lost into the population. What happens to those 10,000 men? Where do they go while their applications are considered?

I agree that we need a far better system for assessing claims before people try to enter the country.

Agree. They are lost into the population and their claims cannot be assessed. But it doesn’t mean the headlines are incorrect re 10,000 males arriving.

ArabellaScott · 03/11/2022 15:49

I wanted us to think before allowing emotive and false headlines to influence our feelings

The BBC article appears to be using government figures, and seems fairly neutral in its reporting.

ArabellaScott · 03/11/2022 15:48

'newspapers shouting about 10,000 Albanian men arriving by boat isn't the same as being able to say that the UK has granted 10,000 Albanian men.'

It comes to the same thing, surely, if those 10,000 men are lost into the population. What happens to those 10,000 men? Where do they go while their applications are considered?

I agree that we need a far better system for assessing claims before people try to enter the country.

LemonSwan · 03/11/2022 15:48

For me I just struggle with this. Because there’s obviously refugees and people who need help (trafficked women). But then there’s also a lot of bloody countries which are fucked up.

But besides all that the bit I struggle with the most is that (and this may not be you OP) those who want half the world to immigrate to the U.K. (because let’s be honest half the world are probably in shit circumstances living under dictators, poverty or something), are also the people who say we must be net zero yesterday, not use oil or gas, we must live sustainably, we must have free healthcare/ education and social safety net, adequate housing and space for nature/ care for the planet etc. Whilst all these things are true in isolation and something I wish us to strive for to one degree or another; bringing that all together is something else.

What is the carrying capacity of the U.K. if we are to live off our land for food and energy sustainably. There is a finite number.

IwantToRetire · 03/11/2022 15:36

In 2020, there were around 6 asylum applications for every 10,000 people living in the UK. Across the EU27 there were 11 asylum applications for every 10,000 people. When compared with EU countries, the UK ranked 14th out of the individual countries in terms of the number of asylum applications per capita.
commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn01403/

There are significantly more applications for asylum than the number of people who come to the UK through organised refugee resettlement schemes or as close family members of recognised refugees.

According to Home Office quarterly immigration statistics, between June 2021 and June 2022:
1,622 people came through a refugee resettlement scheme.
5,290 people came through refugee family reunion rules.
63,089 asylum applications were submitted.
14,062 asylum seekers were given permission to stay (rising to 15,716 after appeal).

But in addition to the above, significant numbers of people have come through the visa route for people from Hong Kong with British National (Overseas) status (133,124 visas granted since January 2021), and the two Ukraine Schemes (125,900 arrivals since March 2022). And so far this year, around 11,300 people have been granted indefinite leave to remain under the two bespoke schemes for Afghan nationals and family members.
commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-9630/

There are fewer foreign nationals living in the UK than there are people born in other countries. In 2021 there were approximately 6.0 million people with non-British nationality living in the UK and 9.6 million people who were born abroad.

The UK’s migrant population is concentrated in London. Around 35% of people living in the UK who were born abroad live in the capital city. Similarly, around 37% of people living in London were born outside the UK, compared with 14% for the UK as a whole.

After London, the English regions with the highest proportions of their population born abroad were the South East (13.4%), the West Midlands (13.9%), the East of England (12.9%), and the East Midlands (12.7%). In each of these regions the proportion of people born abroad was lower than for England as a whole (15.5%), which is skewed by London.

Of all the nations and regions of the UK, the North East had the lowest proportion of its population born abroad (5.8%), followed by Wales (6.5%), Northern Ireland (7.0%), and Scotland (9.3%).
commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn06077/

OP posts:
IwantToRetire · 03/11/2022 15:29

I started this thread more because I wanted us to think before allowing emotive and false headlines to influence our feelings - and the voters as a whole.

So there are 2 totally different categories. Those seeking asylum - and I wanted to emphasise that for Albania those accepted as genuine asylum seekers were / are women whose claims are accepted.

Then there are those who are coming as economic migrants, some of whom may be being exploited by gangs. They are unlikely to be accepted as asylum seekers and as likely to disappear from the system, so newspapers shouting about 10,000 Albanian men arriving by boat isn't the same as being able to say that the UK has granted 10,000 Albanian men.

But surely what we can all agree on is that whatever system the Government has is place just isn't working. Genuine asylum seekers wait far too long in terrible conditions to have their claims assessed and during that time aren't allowed to work, so survive on a pittance and as reported in the news today is such unsafe conditions that rape and sexual assault of women and children happens.

Part of the problem is the really petty behaviour between France and the UK. Why doesn't the UK have assessment centres in France, although yet again given the complete dog's dinner that the UK Government made of assessing Ukrainian refugees it seems likely that these would fail as well.

Another problem is the fact that the UK wont allow temporary work visas. Many businesses including agriculural ones want this. But ideology is taking precident over real life. Like Liz Truss' financial package.

And Suella Braverman's decision to stop booking hotel space. Then there is a panic because conditions get out of control. Then government or the agencies they pass the buck too, start taking expensive and unsustainable decisions or just totally fail which ends up with a coach load of migrants dumper at Victoria Station.

Just as a side note, but also about how duplicitous politicians are, it has only recently be revealed that overseas aid money that is usually spent to help communities in others countries has been used this year to pay for Ukrainian refugees temporarily living here. So in other words overseas aid in actual practice has been cut.

OP posts:
inamarina · 03/11/2022 14:37

orbitalcrisis · 03/11/2022 08:12

@lollipoprainbow Most people who live in areas with a high immigrant population are FOR immigration, not against. It's those who live in low immigration areas who are afraid of the mythical immigrant who comes to this country just to claim unemployment benefits while simultaneously stealing your job! So, I should think a lot of these 'do-gooders' have been affected!

I‘m not sure that’s the case to be honest. I used to think that way, but I somewhat changed my mind in the last couple of years.
We moved to a town in the UK where there’s a large community from Eastern Europe - many Romanian Gypsies.
I see the issues I didn’t want to know about before I moved here (I used to be completely opposed to Brexit).
There seems to be very little integration going on, no real social cohesion.
Groups of men dominating the town centre, teenagers harassing people. Lots of shoplifting happening too.
Locals try to avoid the town centre, businesses closing as a result.
I never thought I would say it, but I see why this town has voted for Brexit.

ArabellaScott · 03/11/2022 13:16

100%, Anactor. An approach that attempts to shut down all discussion, that pushes 'no debate' or suggests that any discussion is 'racist', is storing up problems for the longterm.

Anactor · 03/11/2022 13:10

hooksb · 03/11/2022 10:50

Yes, it was more nuanced. But nowhere "changes beyond all recognition" overnight,
And it is quite telling that the areas with long term high levels of immigration tend to be pro-migration. Showing the fear-mongering is just that.

Sadly, Brexit and the current incumbents in charge of the U.K. have taken us back about 60s years in attitudes. Enoch Powell would be so proud of Tory leaders and some people on this thread.

It is more nuanced, and it is true that cities with traditionally high levels of inward migration tend to be more open to, well, inward migration. They're often areas which have long had a tradition of 'churn' - people move in, make their money, move on. Those cities tend to see the latest wave of high migration as part of that ongoing trend.

It's also true that higher Brexit votes tended to be associated with recent high migration - either in the places most recently affected, or in a circle round them. So, it's untrue to talk about 'the Valleys' being unaffected. The people who live and vote there may well work in Swansea or Cardiff and have lived experience of the recent high migration.

The major problem with this is the tendency among some to automatically associate this worry about high migration with racism, rather than drilling down. If we drill down we might have to do something about people's worries - and stuff like building new schools for the increasing numbers of children, new social housing for the new families, new hospitals etc, etc, all cost money.

It's so much easier to shout 'Enoch Powell'. And to forget that while no place changed beyond recognition overnight, the worries expressed for years were often rejected as 'bigoted'.

When people aren't listened to, they will find a way of making themselves heard.

ArabellaScott · 03/11/2022 12:57

That BBC article seems pretty balanced and has informative figures.

It sounds like there is a massive issue with criminal gangs from Albania. It needs to be addressed.

I agree that women and children should have a separate system - I suppose to an extent they already do, seeing as so many more women are approved for asylum status.

Hepwo · 03/11/2022 12:50

No one chooses to risk their life on a dinghy across the channel for the possibility of getting £40pw week! That's definitely not voluntary, economic migration and it's beyond absurd and ludicrous that anyone thinks it is.

You can swim the channel it's so safe. I regularly cross it on small boats. Hundreds of thousands of people do every year for fun.

This is the problem right here isn't it. Of course it's economic migration. I suppose the question is why do people want to believe that it's not?

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