Hospital refuses to operate after woman requests all-female care

I guess they mean that they think she might invalidate their identity.

or subject their staff to potential abuse

Just got to this bit.
What the fuck is 'potential abuse' when it's at home? How is one subjected to it? The only way this makes sense is if you literally mean a thought crime? Thinking about saying something hurtful?

People are lying if they say they don't understand why a woman would request a female doctor. This has always been known. I'm so sick of the gaslighting. So sick of it.

They literally changed the wording from gender (including self identified male transpeople) to sex (female) of the Forensic Medicine Bill in Scotland because of it, causing TRA Mridul Wadhwa to strop off out of the SNP, so the gaslighters can fuck off with their nonsense that it is never a thing.

Of course they don't - for the very obvious reason that beliefs are protected in law. "Belief" is one of the nine protected characteristics in the Equality Act 2010.

Have just read some of this thread, but the combination of a) stupidity b) gaslighting c) misogyny by our TRA chums is off the scale, even by their usual standards.

Instead, she seems to have gone a rant about not using pronouns (whilst using pronouns herself! I is a pronoun)

I'm sure you thought you were making a clever point here.

Not read the full thread yet. But I'm baffled about something - does a hospital really have to share a patient's beliefs in order to offer them their services? How on earth would they go about assessing this?

It sounds like they've just... made a up a reason. But they wouldn't be so dishonest, would they?

The thing is they are investigating the person that barged in.

The issue is they have cancelled the surgery which is not due to anyone who is identifying as trans; it was a management decision.

I don't think there are any grounds for this really to go any further and the woman has a male surgeon - that's far more intimate and she will be far more vulnerable whilst under a GA then any of the care provided afterwards.

I do believe people should have access and be able to (as they are) ask for same-sex care - it's not really something that can be picked up when and if it suits though (unless it's an emergency situation).

I had major surgery, I would have preferred a female surgeon due to the location, but it was a male consultant on call. They tried really hard to make sure that the rest of the team in the Operating Room were female, including the consultant anaesthetist. Had it not been an emergency - then I could have, as was planned had the surgery with an all female team in the Emergency Room. Unfortunately infection reared it's ugly head.

Yes you can. It may be difficult for them to arrange and as should have happened in this case some adjustments may be discussed.

Of course the dynamic is different for a woman or a man getting care from opposite sex carers. But it stands that men too can ask for and should receive same sex care if they want.

My ex boyfriend used to work as a nurse at this hospital and their patients are by and large, very religious muslims.

Your BF has seen more patients than me but, having been going regularly for 18 months as an outpatient and inpatient, I'd say about 25% of patients fall into that category.

As I said earlier, I don't think they've handled it well by cancelling her operation. They've agreed to investigate the person barging in, which shouldn't have happened whether they were male or female.

But is it unreasonable to say they weren't able to offer female-only medical staff post-surgery? It's a private hospital so it has to decide whether it can accommodate patient requests while maintaining the correct resourcing levels and safety of other patients.

I'm sympathetic to her views and I suspect both sides could have reached a compromise had they picked up the phone. But, particularly given HCA is US-owned, I wonder if they were concerned about potential legal action resulting from any issues arising during her stay?

It wasn’t really the point of my post, you can change gender non-conforming to trans identifying if it fits better. I just chose gender non-conforming to emphasise they’re males who want to be perceived as not male.

The point of the post about the power imbalance in targeted discrimination. A male’s perception of offence has legal framework behind it. A woman’s perception means nothing unfortunately.

I find the entire thing odd.

That might be because you've misrepresented it.

The woman's belief that men aren't women is legitimate and protected. She is perfectly entitled to express it and ask that the hospital respect it in relation to her care.

I bet the hospital briefly dealt with this woman and realised that she was going to be a rude, demanding nuisance, and as a private hospital, decided that it wasn't worth the money or the aggro to deal with her.

This made up scenario is just as discriminatory as the actual one. Private hospitals aren't subject to different discrimination laws to everyone else.

And why would a health professional or carer EVER want to care for a patient who didn't want them to? My male friend is a nurse - he always checks if patients are happy with him or would prefer a female, and certainly wouldn't feel personally offended - he (like most nurses) wants the best for patients and wants them to be comfortable.

I was in hospital for 4 nights 2 years ago after emergency surgery for a trauma related injury.

There was one male nurse on the staff and he was always respectful of the fact that the female patients might prefer a female nurse for intimate care.

I don't think that trans women are respectful of this wish because they are 'women'. Thanks for that Stonewall.

It's pure and simple gaslighting. We are expected to believe that something that isn't true is true even if it harms us.

This lady has been refused treatment for wrong think. For refusing to believe men can be women.

I find the entire thing odd.

My ex boyfriend used to work as a nurse at this hospital and their patients are by and large, very religious muslims. In fact the hospital group has contracts with Arab governments and sends many of their citizens there for treatment.

I find it extremely hard to believe that this specific hospital cannot guarantee female only staff for intimate care. If this woman had simply said "please can I only have female staff for personal care" they probably would have said yes.

Instead, she seems to have gone a rant about not using pronouns (whilst using pronouns herself! I is a pronoun) before being admitted, even before her pre-assessment - why is this even relevant to your care at all? Why would hospital staff need to know about this, why would it be on your medical records?

She also seems to have kicked off about a transwoman just existing as a nurse.
Would she have been ok with this nurse just checking her blood pressure or giving her medication? Or would she have been rude and called them a man in a wig to their face?

I bet the hospital briefly dealt with this woman and realised that she was going to be a rude, demanding nuisance, and as a private hospital, decided that it wasn't worth the money or the aggro to deal with her.

This was covered in her emails to the hospital. The surgeon she was going to have was a man and she realised that the team who would have done the operation would have been mixed sex. Her request was for female nursing and ancillary staff pre and post the operation, which is much more feasible. As others have said, the hospital has a lot of women patients who would request this for religious and cultural reasons.

The woman at the centre of this was to have been operated on by a male surgeon.

She has not and has never demanded that everyone involved in her treatment is female.

This is disgusting. How on earth have we come to this. It's terrifying.

It will be this multiplied by 1000 if Labour get in at the next election and pass self-ID, there will literally be no public spaces where women can be safe, and any complaint about a man being there (even if not a 'genuine' transwoman) can be rebuffed with a claim of "I identify as woman so I have a right to be here".

Women are being sacrificed, and I could cry.

Can any hospital guarantee all women staff at all times? Ig their is a medical emergency a man may be the only one available to do an emergency op? Yes a women in attendance alongside but not guarantee all care will only be a woman

Meant for @OldCrone

You don’t know why this happened.

someone barging in without knocking is highly unprofessional, all staff knows this.

if this was an in innocent mistake, the man should have apologised then or later, and the hospital should have apologised when she made the complaint.

as none did I find it hard to believe it wasn’t on purpose to intimidate her.

You don’t know why this happened.

someone barging in without knocking is highly unprofessional, all staff knows this.

if this was an in innocent mistake, the man should have apologised then or later, and the hospital should have apologised when she made the complaint.

as none did I find it hard to believe it wasn’t on purpose to intimidate her.

Might have already been asked but:

As a male, can I insist on all male care at a hospital? Baring in mind that 90% of nursing staff are female?

Many males who want to be called 'she' behave in a very male gendered way. Very entitled and make it clear that they consider women to be inferior. I don’t think it’s accurate to refer to them as gender nonconforming.

oldcrone I so agree.

Whatever happened to "actions speak louder than words"? Or louder than how somebody is dressed and does their hair?

Outpatients is also split across different buildings and orthopaedics is not at the same site as the digestive practice.

But she has received poor care because of a trans related issue.

They've explicitly said her surgery is cancelled because they don't share beliefs regarding it.

*I wonder if that's the person who 'appeared to be a transgender man in a blonde wig and make-up opened the door and made eye contact with her.'

They're blond in their photos.*

I was stood next to SM-A two weeks ago and it's definitely not. Her hair is light grey, not blonde.

But why would this have any effect on hospital policy?

It would be like telling patients that because one of the surgeons is a devout Christian, they won't treat atheists or people of other faiths unless they convert to Christianity first.