Hospital refuses to operate after woman requests all-female care

Why shouldn't a man be able to refuse a female doctor? You should be able to refuse any medical professional and not have to give a reason, and asking for one of the same sex is perfectly reasonable, whether a woman has a lump on her breast or a man has one on his testicles.

Of course anyone can refuse care from anyone but they can't be guaranteed a preferred replacement.

The fact is, tho, that male people are not female and should not be pandered to when pretending they are .

At the very least, I'd want medical staff who are honest about which sex they are.

Hilarious. That is all you have?

No. Facts are not dangerous things.

But I have yet to see you post a relevant fact here. Hence why the word is contained in ' '.

Perhaps in your need to try to shame posters instead of engaging in discussion you missed those ' '.

So, please. Post the relevant fact again so we can all see it and appreciate its splendour.

Your posts are just continuing to show that you seem to posting from ignorance and intolerance. Do crack on.

This right here. 👏🏼

I’m very tired today so may be missing it, but what fact have you posted @landOFconfusion ?

Do you believe that a woman who has been forced to undergo an abortion by her religion deserves the respect if she states she needs a female only care team?

Fact are dangerous things. Aren’t they?

They can make people feel uncomfortable and rather foolish when the fact
conflicts with their opinion.

Thank you for taking the time to warn us about facts.

I agree. It should go both ways for intimate care (and the EQ10 does actually allow for this).

Both men and women are able to request same sex HCPs and if it’s not possible, the management need to explain why and either find an agreeable compromise or find a suitable onward referral.

Obvs in an emergency situation there is no opportunity for the patient to make the request, let alone hash out a compromise.

However, some requests can be fairly easily anticipated, and that’s why we collect data, including the 10
yearly census.
The majority of women are going to prefer female only breast radiology clinics.
The majority of man are going to prefer male testicle cancer treatment teams.
This preference is going to be particularly notable in areas that have significantly sized communities with orthodox/conservative religious beliefs or communities who have a recent heritage in countries where religious teachings have influenced the country’s legal system (even if the belief/faith is not personally held by the individual).

Of course, the majority of nurses/HCA/carers being female makes it harder to accommodate a male request for a same sex carer, but that doesn’t make his right to request any less legal (just harder to fulfil).

Thoughtful deployment of staff and using the legal provisions for sex equality exemption when hiring for certain roles will maximise the opportunity to fulfil patient requests but no patient should ever be shamed, ridiculed or rejected for making a same sex HCP request, even if that request cannot be met due to practical considerations.

Indeed, DdraigGoch. The Equality Act is quite clear that men are also entitled to single sex care.

By the way, when a friend of mine went to a men's clinic about a bump on his testicles, bringing his partner with him for moral support in the waiting room, he was warned that the staff would check with all other attendees whether her female presence in the waiting room caused them distress.

Friend and partner accepted this, not being arseholes.

Yup

Why shouldn't a man be able to refuse a female doctor? You should be able to refuse any medical professional and not have to give a reason, and asking for one of the same sex is perfectly reasonable, whether a woman has a lump on her breast or a man has one on his testicles.

my little ladybrain

Wow. another enlightening snip of a comment.

Who here has even hinted at such a thing? It does fit though with the instruction to 'touch grass' though to people, mostly females, discussing a case of where another female has had her life saving operation cancelled because of her request for female carers where it was reasonable and possible.

Ladybrain? Touch grass? From a person telling us how to feminist properly?

All too familiar with those type of posters.

The bar for not being WORIADS is a lot higher than believing in peculiar texts and following some associated weird rules written by a long dead science fiction author.

Scientology is a protected belief under EQ10 (eg you can’t legally refuse medical care to a Scientologist).

You don’t have to personally agree with a religious belief as part of not discriminating against others with that belief.
That would result in one entirely dominant religion rather than our current multiples.
History has taught us that one single belief system is both undesirable and impossible to sustain anyway (even murdering the non-believers only works for a little while)

Currently the only belief system that demands that everyone else in the UK must also believe in it (or convincingly pretend to believe in it) is Genderism.

Hahahhaha ! 🤣🤣🤣

Thanks for that laugh, confused one.

Of course you weren't being racist. It's just that you hate Tom Cruise.

There is always this danger, isn't there? When people are asked to clarify and extrapolate the meaning of their 'just a fact', 'just a few words'.

What happens if the complete lack of substantial thought behind that 'fact' just plopped onto a thread meant to shame those posters who disagree with the 'fact' plopper.

So, landOfconfusion, do you care to engage or is this another slew of derisory posts which end up showing your own ignorance and intolerance?

This thread is about the need for females to have female only care teams. A need that is common through some religions.

You have seemingly brought in something else completely. Yet we can still work where it is relevant.

Do you believe that a woman who has been forced to undergo an abortion by her religion deserves the respect if she states she needs a female only care team?

Are her needs to be respected or not?

This is amazing. Well worth procrastinating on lawn mowing for. "I was, I was, I was thinking of scientology"!

Anyway, legal extract.

Effect

733.This paragraph contains exceptions to the general prohibition of sex discrimination to allow the provision of single-sex services.

734.Single sex services are permitted where:

only people of that sex require it;

there is joint provision for both sexes but that is not sufficient on its own;

if the service were provided for men and women jointly, it would not be as effective and it is not reasonably practicable to provide separate services for each sex;

they are provided in a hospital or other place where users need special attention (or in parts of such an establishment);

they may be used by more than one person and a woman might object to the presence of a man (or vice versa); or

they may involve physical contact between a user and someone else and that other person may reasonably object if the user is of the opposite sex.

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/notes/division/3/16/20/8#top

Are we going to be told why female adherents of scientology can be rescued from the cult by being forced to accept male nurses washing their vulvas? Is this an approved strategy to help people exit cults?

Nope landOFconfusion - nobody (except for you trying to extricate yourself out of the grubby hole you've dug for yourself) is discussing scientology. Nor do we have a list of acceptable women.
Andrea Dworkin might be helpful for you to deepen your understanding of what women centred feminism is about?:

Feminism is a political practice of fighting male supremacy in behalf of women as a class, including all the women you don't like, including all the women you don't want to be around, including all the women who used to be your best friends whom you don't want anything to do with anymore. It doesn't matter who the individual women are. They all have the same vulnerability to rape, to battery, as children to incest.

You're not even reading this thread are you, you're so utterly convinced of your own superiority?

Yes. Scientology - a religion which has been sued on multiple occasions for making its female members undergo forced abortions.

I sincerely hope that nobody will attempt to explain why opposing scientology is “colonialist” and why they consider scientology to be worthy of respect in a democratic society.

Scientologist women need female only carers?

(as this is the topic of the thread?)

Ok. So what? Still worthy of respect that they need female only care team.

Scientology? Wow - frantic flailing and derailing I see.

You're taking disingenuousness to a whole new level and I'm not sure who you think you're fooling, but yes, you would be decreeing from your point of view as a superior kind of person that you have the entitlement to inform a group of females that you do not respect their beliefs or rights to hold whatever beliefs they choose, and should not be accommodated.

But specifically you don't want their beliefs to be respect when (content of whole thread) respecting those beliefs would limit the freedoms of males to do whatever they want in handling non consenting females.

So by easy extension you can then remove the grounds for religious respect to all other religions that you personally don't happen to approve of and feel superior and entitled enough to judge and prescribe on to make the heathens/ sinners more like you and more acceptable in your eyes. Colonialism.

Important to remember however that I doubt you would have the faintest interest in those particular women or any religion or faith, (or that you would have cared about reading or posting on this thread) unless those faiths were cock blocking males. That's the goal. To remove protections from females in salami slice tactics to achieve the freedoms males seek: that females either get their clothes off and submit, or lose healthcare.

I do not think that this poster understands just how racist their posts are.

Not because they criticise a religion, but that those religions have quite a few variations and they are associating all those variations as being 'harmful' and not worthy of respect. And that even if those variations had practices that were legal but were seen to be harmful, that while they are legal and clearly legal, the government has legislation to protect those legal practices and woman have the right to choose to follow those religions if they choose freely to do so.

Criticise, yes. Fill your boots and expect any one who disagrees to debate the point.

Punish women for following a legal religious practice, no.

It is really quite astonishing to see it.

The example that I had in my mind was scientology.

A religion which is - in your words - I truly believe is not worthy of respect in a democratic society.

But go on. Please explain to my little ladybrain why my fierce opposition to scientology is “racist” and “colonialist”.

It’s so funny when they try to use this one against Mumsnetters.

The majority of us have grown other humans inside of us.
Or we’ve spent all of our lives actively deciding not to grow other humans inside of us and being judged on that basis.
Or we’ve spend great amounts of time and energy (and money) attempting to grow other humans inside of us.
And some of us have dedicated huge amounts of time and energy raising humans that, tragically, had been separated from the women who grew them inside of her, and thus dealing with all the difficulties of that sad and life-altering situation.

We really aren’t the ones who need to ‘touch grass’ to understand that material reality is found in the biological environment.