Extremist TW

I cannot imagine a person who would say that any person who would post such a thing (or any voilence or threat in any form against women who don’t agree with them) should be welcome in any female single sex spaces.

However, we know full well that no one calls these people out. And still they say women and girls are hateful for rejecting those people.

How very telling that it just looks like a big old man murdering women in that meme.

So, if I see this and recoil from the idea of the person who posted it being on the other side of a thin piece of plywood from my daughter or sister while she's half undressed and vulnerable, that makes me an eighties homophobe.

Is that right?

Jesus.

But gay men were not trying to take over women's spaces.

100% @PurgatoryOfPotholes

There was an older trans-activist who used to be of this parish, who once admitted they found these types of posts a bit tiresome, and advised us all to wait for them to grow out of it.

And how many women and girls will they harm in the meantime? And how many (even) younger people will they model such behaviour to, first?

The answer is no. If you fantasise about killing my children in response to me asking you to leave, then you shouldn't be in here in the first place. Just no.

I've not seen that before @PurgatoryOfPotholes - that is some scary shit.

So, if I see this and recoil from the idea of the person who posted it being on the other side of a thin piece of plywood from my daughter or sister while she's half undressed and vulnerable, that makes me an eighties homophobe.

Is that right?

‘Some straight men didn’t want gay men in the mens toilets’

but how would they know? If a gay man went in, unzipped, peed , zipped up, left , without making eye contact, or any other gesture, how would anyone know? Or have any reason to object? Because he was a man , in a man’s space. The only objection came about if they were using it to approach other users without consent.

a man in a dress, or as now appears, a man in Perfectly ordinary male clothes lurking about the woman’s loo, as happened recently In Ireland ( cos he was identifying as a woman, so that was fine) is completely different. Because male bodied persons are not in the correct space.

PS please don’t start about those who ‘pass’ , because IRL they are vanishingly few.

Didn't we have two different words to describe this in the olden days - transvestite and transexual? I don't know if I can even say these words now without getting my post deleted.

So how is the forced teaming of women complaining equating to forcing transwomen to be silenced going?

That's what you are trying to show right?

You'll stop at nothing to shut women up to get access to single sex spaces.

For @Sparklybutold

Sorry OP, I've only just seen this. The stats that have been debunked are the fake stats put out by transactivists about a supposed high suicide rate etc.

The genuine stats about TW crime are coming out slowly. TW offend at the same rate as other males, which is much higher than the female crime rate. Transitioning does not reduce a male person's likelihood of committing a crime. Refs: Sexton et al 2010; Dhejne et al 2011.

TW seem more likely than other males to commit sexual offences, according to official statistics. (This is one reason why women don't want them in places where we are likely to be undressed or vulnerable.)

The Ministry of Justice stated in January 2022:
As of our latest data collection on 31 March 2021, there were 146 transgender women (that is, prisoners who were legally male and identified as female) in all prisons across England and Wales. ... These figures do not include transgender prisoners with gender recognition certificates ...In the men’s estate, there were 87 transgender women with a conviction for at least one sexual offence.
questions-statements.parliament.uk/written-questions/detail/2022-01-06/98878

So, 60% of self-identifying TW in prison have committed sexual offences, compared with about 17% of all male prisoners, according to Ministry of Justice figures.

Some of these TW are housed in women's prisons, despite having committed serious offences against women and children.

From the Keep Women's Prisons Single-sex campaign:
kpssinfo.org/males-in-womens-prisons-convictions-sentences/

We have collected details of 28 males convicted between 2014 and 2020 who are known to have been held in women’s prisons or have been given a place in a women’s hostel after release. However, the true number of males who have been held in female prisons is almost certain to be higher than this. ...
All but two were convicted of violent or sexual offences. This includes: ten who were convicted of rape or attempted rape, including the rape of children; ten who were convicted of murder or attempted murder; four who were convicted of sexual offences against children.

transcrimeuk.com has a long list of transpeople who have been convicted of crimes. Most are by TW, but in many cases these have been recorded as crimes by women.

And there's masses more information available. This is just a start.

"any man who thinks complying with sexist stereotypes will make him a woman is by definition a sexist

the only variant is ho much of a dick he is about it"
Pretty much the rub of it @BernardBlacksMolluscs

I completely agree that humans cannot change sex. Alas the social fallout from any attempt to put the trans genie back in the bottle/ repeal the GRA would be pretty complex I would imagine.

Which I guess is why some purport to offer a more palatable/ reasonable take that differentiates the Paris Is Burning/ Pose 'tiny minority' 'genuinely dysphoric' 'just trying to live their life' trans person from those whose motivations could be more fetishistic Them three letters.

This reasoning does not really stand up to scrutiny.

yep

any man who thinks complying with sexist stereotypes will make him a woman is by definition a sexist

the only variant is ho much of a dick he is about it

There is nothing remotely complex about keeping male people out of female only spaces.

Presentation and feelings are irrelevant. Humans can't change sex.

In my mind, this good trans/ bad trans dichotomy is kind of similar to discussions that split the 'good' lefty feminists from the 'bad' 'in bed with fascists' ones.

Is all a massive oversimplification and an attempt to deny the messy complexities of the situation.

There are those that are clear they are one sex and want to be the opposite sex. Your body determines what sex you are but you can feel as masculine or feminine as you like.

There are those who believe you have a free-floating gender that has nothing to do with your biological sex, and that this gender should take precedence in law and policy over sex. Sometimes, rather confusingly, these people also advocate for changing bodies to 'match' genders while simultaneously insisting sex and gender are entirely unlinked.

Any man, no matter how 'nice' someone says that man is, or how convinced someone is that you can't even tell they are really a man, who wants access to spaces intended for women is an extremist.

They are not nice or they wouldn't be trying to get into womens spaces, take womens jobs, take womens words or trample all over the rights of women.

Imo the extremist transwomen are just a camouflaged branch of the incel movement. They hate women.

This video is brillant. Human beings are not clownfish and here's why

Video

These are cognitive distortions being used in place of facts and evidence.

Once you see it, you can't unsee it. Not one explanation is offered, it's all about deflection. For example, the argument that clownfish can change sex so humans can too. No. No they can't.

By the way, there are also quite a few gay men who are also very conscious of the fact there is a small group of them who are actually rather forthright about how they think that ‘not all intergenerational sex with children and those still minors is child sex abuse’. Shall we discuss those views too?

Shall we start with Peter Tatchell? Shall we discuss that Mermaids trustee?

Coming back to this point, the Mermaids Trustee I am referring to is Jacob Breslow.

As I say, there are quite a few LGB people who are calling out the published articles and rhetoric by males such as Tatchell and Breslow. Those LGB people are very clear that there are indeed people within their group who cross boundaries in excusing child sex abuse in their work or seek to destigmatise it or justify it. And they don’t ignore the fact there are people who hold such views or those who act on them.

What they don’t do is try to convince anyone that any male, gay or not, is less of a risk than others.

But that seems to be what suggestions does across these threads. I have no idea how they have explained the statistics and anecdotal evidence that is very easy to find, we have the archived links and screenshots and they are building every single day.

Maybe suggestions will tell us how they interpret the stats and anecdotal evidence to be so assured that transitioned males are no more risk than another female.

Outside of an analysis of their friends behaviours that is. We hear a lot about how friends are not like that, so the rest of the world is not like that.

So you either think female people are a sex class in their own right, with the ability to name themselves as separate and distinct from male people with unique needs and to be able to advocate politically for those needs, or you don't, and you need to ask yourself why you think the sex based reality of half the population should be ignored to pander to male feelings.

I used to question how some (and not aimed at anyone specifically) posters could just post the same tropish posts over and over. Then I realised they were not seeking clarity. Many of us here are developing our thoughts on the various nuances of the wide scope of topics and processing it all again in light of any recent events, research etc.

I realised some posters are seeking only to emotionally manipulate lurkers and readers to ‘be kind’, or to ‘not be like those bigots’ (past or present). There is never any credible evidence posted. It is solely emotional manipulation and sometimes some polarisation as well.

These are cognitive distortions being used in place of facts and evidence.