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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

How do you protect your children from getting sucked into and brainwashed by this?

88 replies

jewishmum · 14/10/2022 09:40

For reference I have one very young child of each sex.

OP posts:
QueenHippolyta · 17/10/2022 14:44

@GingerPushkin great do not bang on about it. As a lesbian I would not want any young person near the Rainbow Queer Mafia. I avoid them too. Gay women lead nice boring normie lives.

GingerPushkin · 16/10/2022 21:58

Bring them up on South Park
I'm only half joking- someone upthread mentioned sense of humour and I'll throw in a good sense of the absurd
I expect yours are way too young at present but mine have been watching SP and family guy from a relatively young age- the "Mr Garrison's fancy new vagina" episode is often quoted in this house- it's bang on the money and from 2006 I think- i can't believe how accurate it is- honestly i'd rather they're exposed to swearing than this hideous ideology (and they have always understood that the swearing is not for them to quote!)
humour trumps everything- kicks piety to the kerb
there has been a background of GC seething/grumbling/ranting from me and kids' father over the years- actually to the point that it started to piss my daughter off so i've reined it in quite a bit as don't want to alienate her- this was when she started secondary school- lockdown happened- and a declaration of lesbianism- a cake with "i'm gay" on it appeared on the table. it's a bit disconcerting to realise that your 12 year old wants to declare a sexuality- but obvs we said great, but remember it's not your personality and didn't make a big deal. my big concern was that she would possibly fall under the rainbow mafia spell
2 years on and we haven't heard anything more about it and luckily her friendship group isn't mired in gender ID
I will caveat that if she is gay, i couldnt give a shit- in fact, having spent so much time lurking on the feminist board and the consequent lightbulb moments I've had it's preferable!- but I'm not going to bang on about it- any more than I would her height/hair colour or anything else that's innate
So, yeah: the importance of humour was what my waffle was all about!

Leakingroofagain · 16/10/2022 21:34

I think a surefire way is to come out as trans/non binary and make it something that middle aged women do.

JoodyBlue · 16/10/2022 21:23

As others have said make conversation and discussion something that is regular in the household. I encourage mine to question when they make an assertion how they know something to be true. Why they think in a particular way and going back to first principles to understand things - logic. The simple logic of understanding sex is that we reproduce via eggs and sperm, humans therefore produce one or the other or are of the category that does. There is no arguing with this simple logic. Basics.

OldGardinia · 16/10/2022 20:00

Keep them off Discord - that place is grooming central. At the very least keep a very close eye on how much time they spend on it.

Expose them to a more traditional viewpoint on sexual equality. I said this to someone and it actually made them think: "I find the current trans movement very regressive. It just reinforces sexual stereotypes. My generation fought for the idea that you weren't defined by your sex. That if you were a girl who was into cars and wanted to be a mechanic, that was fine. It didn't make you less of a girl. Now I see groups like Mermaids presenting slides in schools of the "gender spectrum" with a barbie princess at one end an GI Joe / Action Man at the other and asking kids where on the spectrum they are. It's a trick, really - nobody is absolutely one stereotype or the other nor should they be. But this way they try to convince you sex is some sort of spectrum by using outdated sexual stereotypes. You can act how you want, you can dress how you want. It doesn't mean you sex has to change."

Clear, simple and shows the biggest flaw in trans ideology in a nutshell.

Mrsorganmorgan · 14/10/2022 14:06

My daughter works for the NHS and thinks it is al oad of rubbish. So do my grandchildren, and I have said nothing to them. I think they were not taught this rubbish in school.

MoreHairyThanScary · 14/10/2022 14:03

Talk about it don't, don't let them misunderstand.

My dc have friends who have changed genders they want to support but they know they can respect their friends ( calling by new name etc), but equally they can hold the belief that individuals do not and can not change sex.

It helps that they have a good understanding of science and biology.

MarshaBradyo · 14/10/2022 14:01

We’ve talked about the fact you cannot change sex from an early age, you are a girl or a boy but you can play with or wear what you like

TheGreatATuin · 14/10/2022 13:55

I do agree with Norma27 that there's an element of luck to it.
It's easy to counteract weird beliefs when you know that's what your children are being taught, but some of the stuff that is taught is so out there that it really doesn't occur to people that schools would be teaching or doing it.
I'm thinking of that 'Alien Nation' book that went out as a teaching aid with its 'blue planet' and 'pink planet' with associated lists of stereotypes. Most reasonable people would assume that the lesson to follow is that the stereotypes lists aren't real but it doesnt do that. It just tells children if they don't fit the pink list or blue list, then they don't fit the girl or boy 'planets'.
Anyone taking a cursory look at it would assume its teaching that stereotypes aren't real. It's only when you read what's actually in it, that you realise they're being reinforced.

Norma27 · 14/10/2022 13:35

I do think a part of it is luck. My daughters’ schools have been brilliant. Every other school seems captured and all my best friends children the same age and friends of my eldest but different schools are captured. The children always seem to influence the parents too which has caused sons conflict.

TheGreatATuin · 14/10/2022 13:32

By talking about it, allowing disagreement and encouraging critical thinking.
I always tell my son he is welcome to disagree with me and tell me I'm wrong on anything at all. My only proviso is that he needs to make his case. If he's can persuade me he's right, I'll admit I'm wrong, but if I don't agree, I'll make my case and he has to poke holes in it.
We have a lot of good natured arguments debate about all sorts of things

SeasonsHeatings · 14/10/2022 13:12

My son (8) likes to wear dresses and has long hair down to his lower back. He doesn't like football and all of his friends are girls.

There is a boy in his class who was the same but is "now a girl" so my son could very easily be pushed in that direction. Thankfully he is a very logical thinker and loves science. He knows that boy is still male and you can't change your biology. He says "their DNA can't change, it's not physically possible"

He also knows there's nothing wrong with being a boy and liking "girl things" because there's no such thing.

He's also very accepting of the other child though and does go along with referring to him as she and uses their new name.

I'm not worried at all tbh, I just make sure he knows the facts and I'm sure he'll make his own mind up based on that.

Danascully2 · 14/10/2022 13:10

What sort of age might schools start mentioning gender stuff so I can keep an eye out? I haven't heard anything about it
at our school but my older one is just starting yr 4 so maybe not quite yet? I'm firmly crossing my fingers that some of the wilder nonsense will have died down by the time he gets to yr 7/8 but maybe that's wishful thinking.
I absolutely think people should all be treated with compassion and respect, but the gender stereotypes really annoy me.
My younger one has come out of school with some firm views about 'girls like unicorns' and 'hes got girl hair' (Sam Ryder...). Despite me being pretty non girly and his uncle having long hair. But I'm sure that is coming from other kids and not the school.

ArabellaScott · 14/10/2022 12:58

Oh, also:

Advocate for your child, question school approaches, raise the issues with sports groups, councillors, MPs, local papers, etc.

ArabellaScott · 14/10/2022 12:56

-challenge stereotypes as they come up (gently)
-encourage them to ask questions
-be open and age appropriate about information
-teach straightforward biology
-bodily consent is paramount. Don't force them to hug/brush hair/etc
-listening is crucial, always.
-discuss screen times (we made written agreements), use parental controls, check devices regularly and explain why. Talk about internet safety.
-implement clear, sensible boundaries and stick to them. If they disagree, talk it through with them, but don't back down because of emotional responses.
-make it clear your first job is to protect them, that you will support them but that they may not always be happy about you putting up boundaries.
-as it comes up, deal calmly with any genderist ideas. Asking questions and encouraging your child to think critically is a great practise for all areas of life.
-teach them how to respectfully and politely hold their ground, and resist peer pressure.

Buteverythingsfine · 14/10/2022 12:53

I think you are a bit delusional if you think you can control all this. I have had the same family life, chats, discussions over what makes a woman, biology aired in my household; one teen is very much in my way of thinking but accepting of others choices, the other weeps if we even discuss it due to my horrible transphobic ways.

Parents, and authority, are there to be rebelled against and there is a good dollop of luck about whether your children are suddenly pulled into changing sexuality, identity and so on.

Becoming trans is also strongly connected with neurodiversity, so that's not really a controllable thing.

I'm not saying don't encourage critical thinking, or keep them away from social media (be prepared though that this can't last into later teen years), just be realistic you might be great at all that and your child is upstairs plotting their name change. It's happened to so many great families I know, and I would also say the children I know who define themselves as non-binary, trans or bi now out number everyone else by about 17 so try not to see it as a personal failure of parenting, these kids are lovely too but their path is harder, no doubt.

ChlorineChris · 14/10/2022 12:42

GoldenPineapple88 · 14/10/2022 10:30

Ban all forms of social media. All of it. My teens know exactly why we don't allow SM and are fine with it. We answer questions honestly and openly and encourage open discussion. As a result they are very clear that you cannot change your sex 😊

This.

My DC are fairly unusual at school for not being on their phones at all times of the night, for not knowing who certain TikTok celebs are or what the latest meme is. It's done them no harm whatsoever and they themselves can see that a huge amount of fall outs and nastiness happens because of what goes on on SM, and are glad to be out of it entirely.

Keep them busy, engaged and connected in the real world, to real people. Encourage them to take up sports or hobbies that interest them and to base their friendships on real life conversations and experiences.

Keep talking to them,. challenge some of what is unthinkingly repeated from school. Have a keen eye on the pshe curriculum and engage with school if you have concerns. Absolutely be that parent and lead the way for your child to speak up if they are uncomfortable too. Let your DC know you have their back. Mine know that of they ever ever got into trouble for stating their boundaries and sticking to them, I would back them up regardless of who they were offending or in trouble with.

TeeBee · 14/10/2022 12:38

Totally agree Watermelonseeds. There is little point keeping them off social media, their friends will come out with enough shite by themselves. And to be honest, just switch on the news and there are people trying to fill their heads with nonsense. Teach them to think! Teach them to debate with you. Teach them to look at all sides of an argument. But Christ above, let's all develop our own opinions on things rather than delegate our thoughts to someone else. I don't care whether I totally disagree with them but I love it when they come to me with some political stance or strong opinion about something. Good! Thinkers! But never come to me with some half-arsed argument because I'll pick that fucker to shreds. 😃

Beamur · 14/10/2022 12:27

DisappearingGirl
I'd say you need to talk about it before they bring it up. They will be exposed to this at school and kids grow up an huge amount once they leave primary school.
Don't make a huge deal out of it.
I think DD and I spoke a lot about this in conjunction with free speech, freedom of expression and where rights clash.

watermelonseeds · 14/10/2022 12:27

TeeBee · 14/10/2022 10:39

Teach them a scathing sense of humour. The most well-used phrase in my house is 'What the fuck is this nonsense now??!' Then we either all have a good laugh at the ridiculousness of the world or totally disagree with each other but proclaim 'What the fuck is this nonsense now??!' at the person we disagree with. So then the person has to explain their viewpoint.

I think they have so much crap fed to them at school and through social media that they have developed a very healthy scepticism about it all without my intervention and pressing them to defend their thinking actually makes them think a bit deeper rather than just accept the nonsense doing the rounds.

I really think this is important. Not to teach them to be cynical and mocking, but to have a sense of humour and perspective. There's a lot of "be kind, pussyfoot about" directed at children, and not enough "don't accept nonsense, don't apologise for having a brain".

Bionicbum · 14/10/2022 12:24

@DisappearingGirl I would bring it up with your 11 year old and ask what she thinks about it. Teach her to critique, question and debate, including with you.

Leafstamp · 14/10/2022 12:17

CandyflossGin · 14/10/2022 09:58

...you can't? They should be allowed to learn of all viewpoints from pretty much any given topic and should be allowed to come to their own conclusions...

Not agreeing with you wouldn't be 'brainwashing'. And given that you presumably love your kids I can't imagine a difference of opinion would be a problem anyway.

People who think humans can change sex have been brainwashed.

People who think as woman is anything other than an adult human female have been brainwashed.

People who think being a woman is about feeling feminine or girly have been brainwashed.

Not only have these people been brainwashed but they're ideas are damaging to children and women and same sex attracted people.

Lilithslove · 14/10/2022 11:56

You can't control your childrens' opinions anymore than your parents can control yours. What you can do is is encourage them to think critically and love them even when they come to different conclusions than you.

DisappearingGirl · 14/10/2022 11:52

I have a question. I have DDs age 8 and 11 (in Y4 and Y6). I am generally pretty open with them, but tend to mostly answer questions as they come up naturally. I also (where possible) try to reinforce the idea that we shouldn't be restricted by gender stereotypes. They both have friends, male and female, who are somewhat gender non-conforming.

The kids at their primary school seem pretty innocent on the whole. Neither my kids nor their friends have ever mentioned gender ideology within my earshot. However, it is rife in Y7/Y8 in all the local high schools, and my older DD will be going next year!

So I'm wondering - do I leave gender ideology until they mention it? Or raise it myself out of the blue and risk making it a "thing"?

Beamur · 14/10/2022 11:32

In part you do it by sensible parenting - internet use and such like.
But I agree with the poster who said you can't dictate your children's views and shouldn't try to. But you can make sure they have a good understanding of looking past a statement and checking for themselves what the facts arguments are - in all subjects and areas.
Keep talking to them about everything and anything.