Boston Children's Hospital receives bomb threat after being "targeted" by Libs Of Tik Tok

I never said that you shouldn't. I don't care what you do in the UK. I care about what happens in the US. This particular incident occurred in the US, therefore it is of concern to me. What's happening on this page is social media damage control, including multiple posters claiming they need to get in before anyone comments on left leaning fems associating with the alt right. Well, that's what it is.

I don't care about your anti trans activism. I'm not a trans activist. But when this site and activists like Post Parker decide they want to get involved in what's happening in the US, especially when it involves a terrorist act like a bomb threat, I get to have a say.

You never answered my question about who you regard as "the poor people" in the US.

You're now bringing in discussions from other threads as a deflection but I'll play this once.

On that other thread I meant that when white middle class people in the UK want to add some "identity flair" to their mundane social identities, they use colloquialisms like "y'all" to give the impression that they're somehow akin to folksy people from the Southern US. This is ludicrous.

It's as ludicrous as when privately educated rich kids in Richmond (UK, not US) talk about "the Feds".

They don't have such audio recordings because that's a different hospital.

Okay, they have it on their website. The other hospital admitted on tape. Do you agree both should be investigated further? Or no?

There is no coming back from this because we are now getting into terrorism and armed conflict, which is all too familiar in the US. So if you don't like being regarded as the alt right, don't get in their basket.

So just trying to understand this fully.

Because you don't want to be associated with the alt right, you're advocating turning a blind eye to hospitals admitting (on websites or recorded conversations) to doing hysterectomies on minors? Is that correct?

Because condemning something the alt right also condemns is not an option for you?

@Boxowine Gish Gallop....

You never answered my question about who you regard as "the poor people" in the US.

They don't have such audio recordings because that's a different hospital.

Perhaps I should call you stupid. Let's settle on misinformed.

Although I think that this thread was created for a specific purpose and that is to play defense for Libs of Tik Tok, which is now paid content by the way.

One of the more frustrating tactics that I see on this forum is the insistence that you're not allowed to talk, you're being silenced, shouted down, attacked, DARVOed, etc. I have done nothing of the sort. I am more than willing to share my perception of this forum and how this activism affects us here in the US. I've read hundreds of threads and I am the only one I see being called stupid or told to shush. Hahahahaha "women won't wheesht", unless of course they don't toe the line on FWR. There is no coming back from this because we are now getting into terrorism and armed conflict, which is all too familiar in the US. So if you don't like being regarded as the alt right, don't get in their basket.

It's a form of American exceptionalism and demonstrates a colonialist mindset.

Yes

this may be news to you, but places that aren’t the US exist

i will have opinions and carry out activism that suit my aims in the UK, cos that’s where I live

your bizarre lecture seems to imply that women here should temper their opinions and actions to suit the US

Again, I didn't say that. And I didn't call you stupid but I can if we need to go there. I am not stupid. For instance "stated" means that someone has actually stated something. I haven't stated that and for you to say that I have is deceitful.

Im talking more generally than you here, though you are illustrating the point very well.

Boston Children's Hospital has not admitted to performing hysterectomies on minors.

A member of staff (in fact was it two?) said they were, on an audio recording. It was also referenced on their website, though i believe they have changed it since. However screenshots exist.

So, with this in mind, what are you arguing?

1. There can be absolutely no truth in this (despite evidence provided by they themselves).

2. Even if we can't 100% guarantee there's no truth in it, our impeccable left leaning credentials mean we should stay out. If children are ultimately harmed by this decision, they are collateral damage and not as important as maintaining our purity.

3. There may well be truth in it, but we're fine with that. If underage hysterectomies are advancing the trans cause, then let's go for it?

Which is it?

Because from everything you've said on here, it looks like 2 to me.

You don't know for fact if hysterectomies are being performed on minors at Boston Children's Hospital

We do know for a fact that they perform mastectomies on 15-year-old girls. It's on their website.

Chest reconstruction surgery is a procedure in which physicians remove excess breast tissue and create a more masculine appearance for your chest. Chest reconstruction can allow transmasculine people to live more easily in their affirmed gender. It is often the only surgical step in the gender affirmation process.

The clinicians in the Center for Gender Surgery at Boston Children's Hospital offer chest reconstruction surgery as a gender affirmation procedure to eligible patients who have documented and persistent gender dysphoria and who are over age 18 (or over age 15 with parental consent).

www.childrenshospital.org/treatments/chest-reconstruction

Do you think it is appropriate to remove the breasts of teenage girls who have no physical illness?

Again, I didn't say that. And I didn't call you stupid but I can if we need to go there. I am not stupid. For instance "stated" means that someone has actually stated something. I haven't stated that and for you to say that I have is deceitful.

Boston Children's Hospital has not admitted to performing hysterectomies on minors. Boston Children's Hospital is a world class facility that has been deluged with emails, phone calls, internet attacks and now a bomb threat over the posts from Libs of Tik Tok. This isn't happening in your country. It's happening in my country and I very much resent seeing a NICU cleared due to terrorism.

There are plenty of ways to discuss your feelings, concerns, facts, position, opinion, etc. without supporting this particular site or defending it.

This is why I don't involve myself in any way with the debate in your country. Any more than I would get involved with the Brexit debate or any of the tragic stories of terminally ill children being removed from life support. I appreciate that there is much about UK laws and and customs that I don't understand and that I would be carrying US baggage into the fray.

I saw as a young person the support the IRA received in the US. Those people all thought they were doing God's work too. It was wrong.

It is toxic. This board is toxic. I read this board for years. I used the information I gleaned here to refute trans activists in the US. I've been thrown off of several sites for speaking out. But what I see now is not feminism, it is exactly what I saw on social media in the US starting in 2016.

I just cannot get over the stupidity of the position being stated here

I.e 'our role as the good guys, supporters of women and children, necessitates turning blind eye to hospital admitted practises of performing hysterectomies on healthy minors'

What the actual fuck is going on?

It does make sense because the UK has legal protections for women and LGB people that are separate from what exists in law for trans individuals. This is not the case in the US and the anti LGBTQ movement here applies to the whole shebang .

You may be able to achieve your anti trans goals without sacrificing LGB rights in the UK but that is not the case here.

The injection of US style political polarisation and identity politics into the debate for those places that actually exist outside of the US (amazingly these do exist) has been so damaging.

Its absolutely fucking toxic

What I said is that you are not coming from a place of care and concern for the state of women and children in the US

Of course people calling for an investigation into hysterectomies performed on healthy children are. You, on the other hand, are so blinded by your own prejudices you can't see wood for trees.

You don't know for fact if hysterectomies are being performed on minors at Boston Children's Hospital, you only know what Libs of Tik Tok posted.

And did it escape you that they had audio recordings of staff admitting to the point? I never said I knew anything for a fact, rather what they unearthed merits further investigation.

I asked on another thread how on earth we had come to this point where we seemingly cannot talk about these issues and the potential harms we are actively doing to children?

You have given me great insight as to how we've 'got here' and how the road back will be so difficult to navigate, so uh, thanks. I guess 🤷‍♀️

Goes off to bang head against the wall at the stupidity of the world

The injection of US style political polarisation and identity politics into the debate for those places that actually exist outside of the US (amazingly these do exist) has been so damaging.

It's not forced teaming. It's voluntary teaming. That's why this isn't a feminist page. It's an alt right page.

I didn't say that it was acceptable. What I said is that you are not coming from a place of care and concern for the state of women and children in the US, you are coming from a place where your focus on one issue, whether I support it or not, causes you to disregard the overall impact of your activism on women in the US.

You don't know for fact if hysterectomies are being performed on minors at Boston Children's Hospital, you only know what Libs of Tik Tok posted. They are not some shining truth seeker, they are someone who was posting really disgusting things about a sixteen year old girl who was shot to death in the street by the police. So when posters come on here and defend the site I have to assume that they are consuming all of its material in a positive manner, which leaves me with a pretty low opinion of them. Especially as regards their impression of themselves as feminists.

Not simultaneously. The GRA preceded same sex marriage by about 10 years.

Good catch. But civil partnerships, which provide all the same actual rights as marriage, came in 2004. And it was the actual impact on the transwoman's life that was the issue in the ECHR case, not the wording on the certificate, so I think being able to get a civil partnership would have likely been sufficient to avoid the ECHR judgment.

I assume it's a reference to Civil Partnership Act 2004. A lot of similarities, some differences.

As it happened, same sex marriage and the GRA happened almost simultaneously,

Not simultaneously. The GRA preceded same sex marriage by about 10 years.

That’s true. But I have read that the Gender Recognition Act was an attempt to placate those who supported same-sex marriage.

Wrong way round. It would have been to placate those who didn't support same-sex marriage in general, by making a very limited exception for transitioned people.

As it happened, same sex marriage and the GRA happened almost simultaneously, but everything leading up to the GRA was all fundamentally rooted in one homosexual transwoman being unable to marry a male partner, despite having been partially legally recognised as "female".

There was a ECHR(?) judgment that "if the state is going to recognise a male as female, they have to to it fully enough to let them have a family life, etc", so the GRA expanded the more limited existing patchwork recognition to cover marriage. But it was almost immediately redundant on the specific marriage point that prompted it. I'm not sure what other major things it added.

It’s horrific enough that teenagers are being sterilised. But a hysterectomy can also cause a lot more internal damage, with lifelong effects. It should never be done except to solve a serious medical condition, not a psychological issue.

There is a second-order issue here in that if women do take testosterone long-term, then enough damage to the reproductive organs can occur that a hysterectomy will become medically necessary anyway. Any woman taking testosterone is setting themselves on the path to a future hysterectomy.

I'm not sure what the stats are on this, but my understanding is that we're talking a significant proportion of female transitioners. Buck Angel's one of those who has spoken of personal experience here.

pretending people can change sex has absolutely nothing to do with same sex marriage

That’s true. But I have read that the Gender Recognition Act was an attempt to placate those who supported same-sex marriage. And that’s never made sense to me. No lesbian or gay man would pretend to change sex just so they could marry, surely? And creating the legal fiction that humans could change sex is a much bigger leap than just allowing people to marry who they like.

Can anyone explain why that’s suggested as a reason for the GRA?