Page 12 | Edinburgh Fringe comic spat on and shunned by colleagues as a 'transphobe' for show about women

ScreamingMeMe · 23/08/2022 16:23

IAmAWomanNotACis · 23/08/2022 16:20

I can paraphrase it easily enough - trans women are not women. That's the transphobic bit.

If trans women are women, what are we allowed to call the group of people who have a clitoris, vagina and uterus?

Why is is okay to co-opt a word that has been used for hundreds of years to mean this group of people? A group of people who don't all agree to it's change. Why is it now okay to say that the-people-previously-known-as-women aren't allowed to maintain and defend their identify?

There you go talking about women's anatomy as if it's at all important or relevant to being a woman. Don't you know that is NOT ALLOWED.

IAmAWomanNotACis · 23/08/2022 16:20

I can paraphrase it easily enough - trans women are not women. That's the transphobic bit.

If trans women are women, what are we allowed to call the group of people who have a clitoris, vagina and uterus?

Why is is okay to co-opt a word that has been used for hundreds of years to mean this group of people? A group of people who don't all agree to it's change. Why is it now okay to say that the-people-previously-known-as-women aren't allowed to maintain and defend their identify?

Artichokeleaves · 23/08/2022 16:00

Woman is an adult human female.

Can an adult human female be a transwoman?

If not, why not?

Unfortunately the fact of sex cannot be disappeared and it is not wrong to refuse to participate in a belief system that pretends otherwise.

LaughingPriest · 23/08/2022 15:47

LaughingPriest · 22/08/2022 16:35

She says in that article "For instance, in the Olden Days, when “woman” meant “adult human female”, everyone knew who went to which jail. As “woman” now includes people who are born male but have a sense of femininity the female prison estate became mixed sex."

So the TRAs presumably disagree that the meaning of woman used to mean AHF and has now changed? Or is she correct?

If any of them can manage to respond to this question honestly and clearly without changing my words or anyone else's words, or changing the subject, that would be a good start to civil discussion.

If anyone can actually supply the non-transphobic definition of 'woman', that'd be even better. I'm super definitely holding my breath.

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Think I'm ok to breathe out now.

vivariumvivariumsvivaria · 23/08/2022 15:44

Trans women are male. That's fact.

It might be an upsetting fact, but it is fact. Humans can't change sex and I think you are being unkind, @DadJoke , to pretend to these people that they can be the same as a female. The truth hurts and it will always out, it is better to support these people to accept reality and make peace with it.

AlisonDonut · 23/08/2022 15:43

DadJoke · 23/08/2022 15:24

I can paraphrase it easily enough - trans women are not women. That's the transphobic bit. If you read the article, you know the issue isn't that she did a comedy set about people with vulvas and child birth.

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If trans women are women why do they have to transition to be women?

It is because, and here's the science bit - they are men. The tricky science bit is that they will always be men.

ScreamingMeMe · 23/08/2022 15:41

DadJoke · 23/08/2022 15:24

I can paraphrase it easily enough - trans women are not women. That's the transphobic bit. If you read the article, you know the issue isn't that she did a comedy set about people with vulvas and child birth.

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Transwomen are transwomen. What is wrong with being a transwoman?

PSKeyboardwarrior · 23/08/2022 15:39

I can paraphrase it easily enough - trans women are not women. That's the transphobic bit.

😂 You don't get to change the meaning of words. It's not how the world works.

LaughingPriest · 23/08/2022 15:35

Keen viewers will note that my request specified "without changing words" 😉

Almost as if I've seen "easily paraphrasing" equate to "pretend someone said something they didn't" ten thousand times....

TheKeatingFive · 23/08/2022 15:27

I can paraphrase it easily enough - trans women are not women. That's the transphobic bit.

Scientific fact is not transphobia.

How in the name of Christ did we get to this point? 🤦‍♀️

DadJoke · 23/08/2022 15:24

TheKeatingFive · 22/08/2022 20:56

If you want to know why people think she is transphobic, you can read her article here which does the whole “adult human female” schtick. She is what you would call gender critical, and everyone else, transphobic.

please specify exactly what is transphobic about that piece

I can paraphrase it easily enough - trans women are not women. That's the transphobic bit. If you read the article, you know the issue isn't that she did a comedy set about people with vulvas and child birth.

WanOvaryKenobi · 23/08/2022 15:01

RhannionKPSS · 23/08/2022 14:46

Have you heard anything back from Gilded Balloon yet??

I did, they are not doing anything.

I have contacted the press.

RhannionKPSS · 23/08/2022 14:46

Have you heard anything back from Gilded Balloon yet??

TheKeatingFive · 22/08/2022 21:07

Is this all just one phenomenally long episode of Seinfeld?

It would explain a lot

AlisonDonut · 22/08/2022 21:04

If belief that sex exists is 'transphobic' then when trans people try and change from one sex to another because sex exists does that make them transphobic and therefore the universe explodes?

Is this all just one phenomenally long episode of Seinfeld?

TheKeatingFive · 22/08/2022 20:56

If you want to know why people think she is transphobic, you can read her article here which does the whole “adult human female” schtick. She is what you would call gender critical, and everyone else, transphobic.

please specify exactly what is transphobic about that piece

WanOvaryKenobi · 22/08/2022 20:34

These are the breaches of the Gilded Balloon code of conduct I reported.

This staff member did not foster a safe environment.
This staff member was behaving unacceptably, including making derogatory remarks about a person's body
This staff member was intimidating and threatening
This staff member's intimidation was based on race, gender, gender identity, age, and sexual orientation
This staff member did not respect boundaries
This staff member did not respect how people choose to identify
This staff member assumed sexual preference or background background

Deliriumoftheendless · 22/08/2022 20:32

Artichokeleaves · 22/08/2022 19:02

Essentially at this point it just means 'heretic'.

I think at this point we’re just one step away from being Donald Sutherland at the end of Invasion of the Body Snatchers, pointing and screeching.

WanOvaryKenobi · 22/08/2022 20:31

No idea, I heard back from a director.

I will not be sitting idly on this.

TheClogLady · 22/08/2022 20:28

I just posted on the Sadowitz thread re: the language in the two Pleasance statements and it’s seeming origin in American Equity, Diversity and Inclusion training (the sort of wally-ish advice that got Maya Forstater’s former bosses in hot water).

would be interested to find out if the Gilded Balloon’s response contains similar buzzwords.

AlisonDonut · 22/08/2022 20:25

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/08/2022 20:06

Your post might possibly not last long Alison, but brava. Well said.

I am so past caring.

Sazzasez · 22/08/2022 20:22

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 22/08/2022 20:17

That's a poor customer service policy from the managing company of the venue. I know it's Scotland but I'm surprised that is legal.

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@WanOvaryKenobi can you take it further?

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 22/08/2022 20:17

WanOvaryKenobi · 22/08/2022 19:46

Ok so I have heard back from my complaint.

I did not even get an apology.

They are not taking any action against the member of staff despite multiple reports of abuse and clear breaches of their code of conduct. They have apparently moved him to a different venue.

I am furious.

That's a poor customer service policy from the managing company of the venue. I know it's Scotland but I'm surprised that is legal.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/08/2022 20:06

Your post might possibly not last long Alison, but brava. Well said.

AlisonDonut · 22/08/2022 20:04

DadJoke · 22/08/2022 16:17

If you want to know why people think she is transphobic, you can read her article here which does the whole “adult human female” schtick. She is what you would call gender critical, and everyone else, transphobic.

thecritic.co.uk/women-wont-wheesht/

What the fuck has it got to do with you?

Seriously, it has fuck all to do with men. So fuck off.