Transwoman in the changing room at school pool

The more I read these threads, the less I get it.

I truly have no idea as to why so many people equate a transgender woman with a predator and seem to convince that share a space with them routinely equals risk. I really don't.

I have been a victim of sexual assaults in my life. They were committed by cis men who lived/presented as men and they were never strangers (this was either so called friends, colleagues and a family member), not drag queens in libraries, not trans women having a swim. Men in my everyday life...

I really don't think this is about my rights or my safety being compromised by transwomen. These threads too me are about ganging up on a minority and wasting time and energy there when we should be focusing on the actual perpetrators of domestic violence, sexual assault and the general misogyny/patriarchy poison.

What, in your opinion, are they then? I am genuinely interested in your reply because there are only two choices (I'm not including hermaphrodites because that is a biological anomaly that is irrelevant to this discussion). You are either a man or a woman. If you are saying that a "genuine" (how can you tell if they are genuine?) transwoman isn't a man, then you are saying that you think they are a woman. But they have a penis, which means they ARE a man. No ifs, no buts.

My comment was about defining women through ability to perform surrogacy. Not defining either women or men through ability to get erections. However, your question still asks someone to define ‘woman’ by bodily ability. That is not how some, notably @Fieldofgreycorn in this part of the discussion, define ‘woman’. You aren’t required to agree with her, she isn’t required to agree with you.

@Didimum

lets do a simple question. Do you think women can get erections?

if yes, do you perceive any issues with an underaged girl seeing this?

I didn’t say I was answering the question. I said the answer depends on @Fieldofgreycorn ’s definition of woman.

That's not answering the question.

Depends if you define women by their ability to reproduce.

Only Women can bare children. Infertile women are not men Didimum or do you think they are?

Muso was clearly pointing out the hypocrisy of the chant TWAW...that is until a surrogate is needed and then TW are suddenly not women and women are then defined by their ability to reproduce....

Depends if you define women by their ability to reproduce. Sounds like @Fieldofgreycorn doesn’t.

I am also confused as to what a "genuine" transwomen are.
Please let us know.

One of the factors that concerns me is that if we start allowing men into women's spaces the threat isn't from the transwomen themselves, but the easy path for any male to access these area.
There are other areas in society that have become hotbeds for predatory sexual behaviour- churches, children's home, sports clubs.
These places attract sexual predators, becuase they know there will be easy meat.
If we start allowing men into places where women and children are in a vulnerable situation then predators will target those areas.

So if you were looking for a surrogate, would you ask a TW?

Genuine question, please answer.

All transwomen are men, they are biologically male it's the qualifying criteria in order to be a transwoman, a woman can't be a transwomen as they fail at the first hurdle.

What is this genuine you speak of? How is it measured? What are the criteria? What happens if they fail the genuine test? How many retakes are allowed? How do other people tell the difference between genuine and not?

So many questions, none of which will be answered.

I’m not confused. I just don’t accept that genuine trans women are men.

How can you tell by looking at them which trans women are, in your words, 'genuine' trans women?

What's the threshold they need to meet to be 'genuine' trans women?

I can't think of a way of knowing that. So surely sensible safeguarding would involve assuming they might not be 'genuine'?

We don't think all men are sex offenders. Most aren't, but none of them are allowed in single sex spaces. Do you think that's wrong too, on the basis that most wouldn't attack a woman?

To put this another way, what definition of “woman” are you using that Eddie Izzard is one?

“Genuine”?

The entire point of being a “trans woman” is being a man “living as” a woman. What sort of witchcraft are you i look siting that switches them from living as a woman to becoming one!

Literally none of that is true.

You seem genuinely confused by what a “trans woman” is.

I’m not confused. I just don’t accept that genuine trans women are men.

A woman can usually spot a man at 10 paces because they have to. There are very few males who can pass successfully as a woman. Any number of things can give a man away - height, size of the hands and feet, the jaw line and brow, breadth of shoulders. The list goes on.
Out of respect to the older women in the pool, this person should avoid using the women's changing room.

Those of us who are not so young will remember similar complaints about lesbians in showers at schools or gyms, and tabloids filled with stories about 'predatory lesbians in sports clubs like Martina Navratilova.

No, we don't more risible nonsense and I'm someone who went to an all girls Boarding School.

Those of us who are not so young will remember similar complaints about lesbians in showers at schools or gyms, and tabloids filled with stories about 'predatory lesbians in sports clubs like Martina Navratilova.

This isn't true.

Even if it was, it doesn't negate the fact that males in women's spaced threaten womens safety and dignity.

1 in 6 women in their lifetime will suffer a rape or serious sexual assault ( Stats from RAAIN, the rape crisis support group) That is millions of women in the uk or US. The majority of them will never report it. Which ones are they?

See if can spot them next time you walk down a quiet corridor in a hotel or get into a lift. You can't spot them. Does it ever cross theminds of transwomen that perhaps the women that have a problem with transwomen in their safe spaces are the ones carrying that trauma with then and don't want somebody with a penis near them when they are in vulnerable positions. Toilets, changing rooms, communal showers etc That after all was why safe spaces were given to women in the first place. Perhaps these safe spaces are all that enables these trauma carrying women to function in society.
We don't know because nobody gives these millions of women a second thought and asks them. They are too busy " being kind " and worrying about a tiny number of transwomen.

If this point has already been made I apologize as I haven't read the full thread.

@CrowUpNorth

The irony of you using specifically Martina Navratilova, who has spoken out against TRAs insisting women step aside to welcome male bodied people into their teams and changing rooms is incredible.

Maybe have a read about the tireless campaigning she's been doing to protect fairness and safety for women and girls in sport. You'll learn something.

Awww fuck, sorry no. It's a cinematic trope nothing to do with tabloids.
I mean nice try, but you are so wrong.
Did you forget that you are posting on a website absolutely chock full of women who have been alive a long time and/or are educated in such a variety of things we can shoot down all your utter tripe.