The ABM, ideologically captured.

I meant to say it was "a very emotional time" not emotive in my first post.

I also think that those who think the "non-carrying partner" (male or female) is reduced to nothing more than nappy changer don't understand the full range of interaction with a young baby. For instance my DH would take DD upstairs and I'd hear gales of laughter from her as he tickled her and played while he did it. They had a lovely time. And as ridiculous as it sounds from the perspective of quite a few years on and not being in that hormonal new mother state, I used to feel quite jealous as I approached nappy changing as a task and somehow we never had the fun and laughter that he had.

So my point is it is ridiculous to suggest that the only way a "non-carrying" partner (NCP) can bond with the baby or help the new mother is by breastfeeding themselves. There are lots of ways for the NCP to bond and help generally. Ways that would improve the adult relationships rather than filling them with tension and causing actual physical harm to the mother by interfering with her lactation. If HCPs think they need to add their twopennyworth to promoting the parents transition to parents and helping their relationship they need to think of better ways to do it than coming between the mother and baby and suggesting everyone has a go at breastfeeding.

Absolutely agree @PomegranateOfPersephone

I loved breastfeeding and whilst my husband is an extremely adoring father and husband he longed to feed DD1. As the time went on, and planning to return to work part time, I started expressing to try to give it to her by a bottle which she utterly rejected. I remember him standing over me watching me express and this sort of expectation that I could just squeeze out a bottle full like juicing an orange. I found it really annoying and had to bite my tongue not to say something inflammatory - it was a very emotive as his mother had died of a brain haemorrhage a few days before DD was born and as well as being sad myself I had to support him and things like this seemed something I shouldn't cause added tension. And truth was I didn't want him bottle feeding her anyway. I was the one who was feeding her.

That is within a loving caring relationship. The opportunity for coercive control to come between mother and baby is huge.

The mother/baby dyad needs protecting at all costs and these sorts of policies directly threaten that.

Indeed if a lesbian co-mother wants to breastfeed then the mother who gave birth should be informed that getting breastfeeding well established first would be more likely to lead to successful breastfeeding, however I am not sure I like that mothers may feel pressured into such an arrangement by a female partner any more than by a male one, or by cultural expectation that when a mother is in a lesbian relationship both will breastfeed.

I would rather protect the mother-baby dyad, I think that the idea that breastfeeding is no longer the domain of the mother who has carried and given birth to her baby is a dangerous path to go down. I really want the pregnant/birthing woman centred in her own biological process of becoming a mother. It is a fragile and vulnerable time for many women and I feel that the relationship between mother and baby should be acknowledged and protected whatever the sex of her partner.

I suppose it could include a woman in a lesbian relationship but breastfeeding in the early days must be done by the mother alone for all the reasons you mention.

Exactly @PomegranateOfPersephone
And as this is for hospital policies it seems it is aimed at newborns or possibly for babies in NICU as the time a mother and baby is quite short these days. I was utterly appalled when I read this.

Supporting a “non-carrying parent” to breastfeed is appalling! What happened to respect for the mother-baby dyad? Where are the concerns about safeguarding, I’d be wondering about coercive control if a “non-carrying parent” wanted to be involved in breastfeeding which means in all honesty coming between the mother-baby relationship and totally scuppering breastfeeding.

All the evidence we have suggests that mother and baby need to be kept close together from birth, immediate skin to skin and as much thereafter as the mother is happy with. There is a balance to be established between the baby’s needs and the mother’s supply, the mother grows in confidence as she builds a close relationship with her baby learning to read and respond to the baby’s cues. Fathers are discouraged from giving a bottle “so they can be involved” or “bond with the baby” not only because it causes nipple confusion but also because it reduces time at the mother’s breast and displaces her milk altering her supply accordingly not only that but there will be a knock on physical effect on the mother as it will disrupt her hormonal balance. The mother and baby should be regarded as one, any third party butting in to that relationship does not have their best interests at heart and is serving only his or her own interests.

Those NHS hospitals that have signed b up to the NHS Rainbow Badge scheme are required to answer this questions as part of the assessment.

"Does the service have sensitive guidance in place to support a non-carrying parent to breastfeed/chestfeed?"

I assume this means that the NHS now has to support men who want to "breastfeed" their baby.

When I was a midwife such a man would have been reported to social services. Now it looks like becoming NHS policy.

The righteous anger these pernicious new ideologies justify is appealing to certain personality types. They are drunk on power. They were always bullies in waiting but now they have been given the tools to do it whilst still believing they are good people and without losing social standing in the eyes of the others, or so they think anyway. Time may tell on that one.

How long before this organisation changes its name to Association of Chestfeeding People? I cannot fathom how so many groups, dedicated solely to female experiences like breastfeeding, have been captured by genderwoo and bullies.

What a mess.