Simon Rimmer's inadequate facilities

Well that’s easy, it’s, ummm, well of course there’s always the… getting a really tight tap turned on for you? Reaching a high flush or lock? Chasing a spider away? (All of which I am the ‘official do-er in our house)

It only benefits companies who want to save money on providing facilities, those wanting their rainbow club sticker, or dodgy blokes who (you know the rest).

Could anyone provide a single benefit to women and girls from mixed sex toilets with communal sinks?

Just one.

Thanks DelurkingLawyer. I gave up voting for Kate Green when she made it clear that she's full on TWAW.

Have had the odd, thankfully, accident with ibs . It is horrendous. Once at work. I was thankful that the toilet was quiet so I could wash out most of damage in toilet and then finally was cleaning my hands in basin. Colleague came in and looked at me, clearly I wasn’t ok and she checked with me but too embarrassed to tell her what issue was, just asked her to pass on message that I want well and need3d to go home. She had sense to not ask any more as it was clear as a women that I wasn’t in the loo for a picnic but to deal with something not very pleasant
if that had been a male colleague I’d have been so ashamed and embarrassed. God forbid male colleagues would have been able to come into toilet when the bad stuff was happening.

IBS effects men too. I doubt any man suffering from it in same way as me would want strange women around when trying to sort himself out.

Not sure if you got an answer to this, but in case not:

I assume AW is full on TWAW. He stood against Joanne Harding, a local councillor who is gender critical (and the partner of the man who wrote this article www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4591612-good-article-on-what-starmer-needs-to-do).

Jo got a lot of abuse while seeking selection, including at the hustings, and I am not aware that AW either condemned it or in fact did anything about it other than sucked up anti-GC votes to his own benefit.

A search using his handle on Twitter threw up the following:

twitter.com/SelfKaz/status/1536609050313605120?s=20&t=OCVsHZQmwoyJbhXAkvxcRw

twitter.com/AndrewHWestern/status/1198289855257686016?s=20&t=OCVsHZQmwoyJbhXAkvxcRw

He was also perfectly happy to stand in a seat that had formerly been held by a woman who had been selected via an AWS. Labour has been advised that all women shortlists are not currently permitted because more than 50% of Labour MPs are female. Predictably the selection so far has been a sausage party in many seats because as soon as given the opportunity plenty of Labour members will choose a man over any female candidate.

Cravenly, the outgoing female MP, Kate Green, gave her support to AW despite having got selected as Labour’s candidate via an AWS.

Anyway, I don’t have high hopes for him as a defender of women’s sex based rights.

That sounds horrific. I had a blissful barely there period till I turned 38. But I can't imagine what Endometriosis is like.

And also, aw that's the toon for you!

I remember being out on the town in Newcastle dressed to the nines with my husband. I had endometriosis - I looked down in horror as my painful heavy period seeped through to the front of my dress. I dodged into a ladies loo from the street in a pub which was full of young women who all flocked round me with huge sisterly concern. Cleaned me up helped me dry my dress in front of the hand drier and generally clucked around me with empathy and concern. I’ll never forget it.

Seriously we don’t want men however they identify in our spaces. I grieve at this situation in which women and girls find themselves.

Yes I've done this too with a double buggy as well as single. Leave the door of the cubicle open and drag the pushchair in as close as I could. I still felt uncomfortable doing it but I knew it was a female only space so I was safe and other women would respect my privacy. I do not want mixed sex toilets. I do not consent.

I was in London recently and went to the loo of a pub during lunch. When I walked in I came face to face with a woman who had not shut her cubicle door and so I was a bit startled!
But then I realised that she had a small child with her and the cubicles were too small to fit the child in there with her. (They were the type where you end up half sitting on the sanitary bin cause they’re so small!)
So what would she have done if those toilets were now ‘gender neutral’? Women need privacy from men for many reasons, not just menstruation.

I was waiting for someone outside a mens loo in a store that allows men to use ladies changing rooms (it’s all about how you feel apparently - you being the other person and not the ladies in the changing room). A man walks in with a little girl (she looked about 8 or 9) - there was quite an exodus!

Similar happened (same store) in their ‘changing room’ in the men dept when a woman frogmarched her (husband) with a suit over her arm (I guess he was resisting buying one). The men that were coming out and turning around to check the signage (then clocking there was no sex indicator). The man in the door was shrugging, so I assume he was being told ‘there’s a woman in there!

no - men don’t want it wither. But some people positively do want it - which is precisely why we should never have it.

Agreed. I'm a man and I wouldn't use them except in extremis. Obviously if any man , woman or - especially - child is 'caught short ' people would be reasonable. But generally we want our single sex provision the same as women.

Yy Datun.

Another one - reads as male, responding to a woman saying she doesn't want to shit next to a man. Telling her 'some guys are into that' LIKE IT'S A JOKEY POSITIVE. Yes love, we know they are. We'd rather not be unwillingly used for their fantasies. Incredible.

I wonder if that's because men wanking in toilets and listening to women urinate is so incredibly seedy. Poking your tongue out and trying to look sexually alluring is one thing. Realising that your audience is the grubbiest end of the dirty mac brigade and that's who you're doing it for, might be quite another.

I've just seen a tweet from a person saying we're all crazy for thinking there are men who masturbate in toilets or find women peeing erotic, and we don't want to be used that way.

This person (reads as female) is literally doing a porn face in her public avatar - that awful tongue out submissive hentai thing. While denying that porn influences public behaviour and tells us something about what men find erotic. Incredible.

There are also some men who get a kick out of hearing a woman use the facilities. Especially an attractive one.

Weird but true, I've been privvy to overhearing over the years not one but two male friends talk along those lines and have never forgotten. Ew, men are disgusting I thought back then shrugged it off, not my problem. Oh look it is.

Women tend to normalise a lot of stuff as well as cope, and also are taught not to talk about it or make a fuss.

Might be time to start talking more.

I remember a horrific thread on mn a few years ago where a poor woman had both awful periods as well as awful ibs at the same time and was trying to work out how she could get her employer (a store like John Lewis - it wasn't John Lewis) to be more flexible with loo breaks as well as asking for help with the actual issue.

It was literally disabling and she was taking some days off which was also becoming an issue.

I never count the v early / chemical miscarriages so had forgotten that one. That one wasn't just a heavy period though.

My 9 week miscarriage went on for a couple of days and started while I was at a cpd course miles away from home. I had to use the loo before I drove back.

I've just remembered that I had a very early/ chemical miscarriage which was extremely heavy.

That started in a pub garden. Lots of friends and kids. Long summer afternoon.

I had to go to the loo about 5 times over the course of the meal we had. I ran out of towels and had to resort to loo paper wads. That was messy and emotional. Had to put on my fake smile; the loo gave me respite. There's no way I could have done that around strange men.

Womens loo was really quiet thankfully. And for women.

I used to do the same.

The goal seems to be to destroy anything and everything which connects the word woman with biological functions and women’s bodies. That includes toilets and changing rooms as much as breastfeeding groups and maternity.

The goal is to insist that womanhood is an intangible feeling and/or a costume not simply the unavoidable, inescapable, observable and unchangable fact of being an adult human being of the female sex.

*Icimoi
In 50 years of using women's toilets I have never, ever seen women washing blood off their hands and clothing or taking off clothes to wash off menstrual blood. If I needed to do anything like that myself I wipe my hands within the cubicle and change my clothes there.*

As a woman going through the peri menopause, this does occasionally happen to me. It happened last summer in a restaurant with unisex toilets. It wasn't possible for me to clean all the blood off my hands in the cubicle, instead I had to wash my hands between 2 males. It was an incredibly uncomfortable experience. I emailed said restaurant but got no response, so now my family and I no longer go there.

I never understood that either. Maybe the TW are hoping to use women as human shields in unisex toilets? By making women use unisex toilets they’re getting the validation they crave (it was never about safety) whilst decimating women’s spaces.
I always ask people in favour of letting TW into female spaces why they are in favour of making spaces mixed sex. The answer is usually ‘we’re not though’. Some people just don’t think of TW as male. This is where be kind got us.

I find it odd how mtf transitioners can't possibly use the men's toilets because they're soooo dangerous, but unisex is absolutely fine?

And mtf transitioners are taken seriously and their concerns validated when it comes to sharing toilets with men but women are told to get over themselves and to stop being so silly.

Perhaps someone who is in favour of unisex loos could explain the cognitive dissonance. Because atm the concerns of people who have penises seem to take priority over people who have vaginas, and there used to be a word for that...

Some rather spectacular gaslighting and dismissing of women's experiences going on in this thread.

Yes. Eye opening that some people have ‘never seen it’. I have seen it often enough in work and shopping situations to know it does happen.

I have rinsed my skirt while on and used the hand dryer.

Remarkable.