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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

If I was to ‘live as a man’ from tomorrow, what would I do?

164 replies

TheOGCCL · 26/06/2022 18:52

I don’t pretend to be an expert in trans issues but I am fascinated by how society drives gendered behaviour.

I believe anyone wanting to change gender would normally ‘live’ as the opposite gender for a while, or even permanently. But what does that mean? What would I need to do to live as a man? I’m guessing use male facilities but anything else? Grow a beard? Plenty of men are clean shaven.

I don’t wear dresses or skirts or have long hair, so why do trans females sometimes think this is part of living as a woman?

OP posts:
sawdustformypony · 29/06/2022 10:20

erinaceus · 28/06/2022 08:05

A journalist did this in this book, which I found quite readable.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-Made_Man_(book)

That does look like an interesting book. I liked reading the excerpt from the Guardian - here Double Agent

Ladyof2022 · 29/06/2022 06:05

My first thought was that, as a man, no matter how formal the occasion, no matter how elegantly I had to dress, even at my own wedding, or to be a celeb on the red carpet, to be a politician, to meet the Queen, or to be the wife of one of the Queen's grandsons, to dance, to be a tv presenter.... I would always, ALWAYS, be allowed to wear flat, comfy shoes without anyone thinking I looked odd or not correctly dressed.

OopsAnotherOne · 28/06/2022 14:12

Now you're living as a man, all women you see are fair game. In the street? In a cafe? Minding their own business at the park? Reading a book? Go get them, tiger

If she has headphones on, gesture or shout loudly until she removes them, they will want to talk to you and even if they seem like they don't, keep trying!

You can even shout at them across the street, but make sure to call them something rude like a slut if they ignore you, it's the best way to repair your ego.

Good luck!

FreeRangeFloozy · 28/06/2022 13:05

SallyWD · 27/06/2022 16:26

A bit depressing that this thread is just trotting out an endless stream of negative male stereotypes. Imagine if a bunch of men were all trashing women like this.

No it’s great. And we don’t need to imagine men talking about women, we already know how poorly men treat women.

FreeRangeFloozy · 28/06/2022 13:01

Mennex · 28/06/2022 00:19

I've been thinking about this studying DH more closely over the last 2 years as we've both been working from home. The main thing I have noticed, which is really, really annoying, is that he gives zero fucks about being blunt and to the point, bordering on rude, especially if someone is wasting his time. He will put the phone down on a time waster or slam the door on a cold caller without even a second thought whereas I get tangled in all kinds of irritating female socialisation being polite, being kind BS. He doesn't even get up anymore, just leans out the window and shout hello, what? Similarly he will just say no if he doesn't want to do something whereas I find it really hard and then agonise about it afterwards or end up agreeing to things I then really resent doing.

There is middle ground. No need to be rude nor to get entangled in unwanted conversations.

erinaceus · 28/06/2022 08:05

A journalist did this in this book, which I found quite readable.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-Made_Man_(book)

DinoDay · 28/06/2022 08:01

Seriously questioning my gender after reading all this. I do a lot of this stuff and acknowledge I'm a selfish, lazy prick. I always wondered if there was something wrong with me, like adhd and felt a lot of guilt for this behaviour that takes a lot of mental effort to correct. Turns out, I'm really a man! Thanks everyone, I can be my authentic self at last and drop the worry!!

Mennex · 28/06/2022 00:19

I've been thinking about this studying DH more closely over the last 2 years as we've both been working from home. The main thing I have noticed, which is really, really annoying, is that he gives zero fucks about being blunt and to the point, bordering on rude, especially if someone is wasting his time. He will put the phone down on a time waster or slam the door on a cold caller without even a second thought whereas I get tangled in all kinds of irritating female socialisation being polite, being kind BS. He doesn't even get up anymore, just leans out the window and shout hello, what? Similarly he will just say no if he doesn't want to do something whereas I find it really hard and then agonise about it afterwards or end up agreeing to things I then really resent doing.

CandyLeBonBon · 27/06/2022 17:12

SallyWD · 27/06/2022 16:26

A bit depressing that this thread is just trotting out an endless stream of negative male stereotypes. Imagine if a bunch of men were all trashing women like this.

That's the rather point though isn't it?

D0lphine · 27/06/2022 17:04

Stop removing body hair. Bliss.

D0lphine · 27/06/2022 17:03

I'd go to HR and collect my tidy pay rise.

BlossomWood · 27/06/2022 16:58

See a clean bathroom and have a shave leaving little bits of stubble everywhere.

How freeing would it be to just have a quick shower, get dressed and go (leaving a wet towel on the floor/ bed knowing that the cleaning fairy will sort it all out)

JennyForeigner · 27/06/2022 16:52

Take your phone into the toilet (gross) and stay there for an hour (so gross).

DdraigGoch · 27/06/2022 16:50

LaughingPriest · 27/06/2022 15:46

You would go see your GP and get told you can see a specialist in 18 weeks as per the NHS rules but they will chortle that its probably going to be 5 years before you hear back.

How is this 'living as a man'? Do men do this?
It doesn't make sense. This is something that would be tested to see if someone has gender dysphoria? Or did you misunderstand the question?

The question can be whatever Kevin thinks the question is, because Kevin is a man and therefore possesses superior knowledge on any subject, just on the basis of having seen a TV programme once.

DdraigGoch · 27/06/2022 16:47

DisgustedofManchester · 27/06/2022 14:39

First of all you would lose many of your friends, especially if they are the ones that think being trans is trendy. You may lose your job eventually, definitely any promotions. Your partner may join a trans widower group and make fun of you. You would go see your GP and get told you can see a specialist in 18 weeks as per the NHS rules but they will chortle that its probably going to be 5 years before you hear back. You may notice you are targetted more for abuse and violence in the street. Some people will just keeop calling you 'Miss' because they're bullies. You will have to track your own gyni schedule because the NHS will drop you from their records. If you;d been younger you may have been able to have PBs but only the most suicidal 5-10% are allowed those. And people will constantly tell you that you are really just a lesbian even though ( assumption here ) you are still attracted to men.

Taking everyone's obsession with poo, your farts will smell less. Yes, scientific fact

Oh look, Kevin has turned up to mansplain to all of the wimmin here.

DdraigGoch · 27/06/2022 16:39

*Forgot to clarify that in that 15 minutes I showered, cleaned my teeth, the lot. Skipped breakfast and bought it at the station instead but otherwise cut no corners.

Eliveonline · 27/06/2022 16:37

Relinquish yourself of any family mental load

This was my experience of parenting with a man. Yup. And no acknowledgement from them that they were doing this.

DdraigGoch · 27/06/2022 16:37

Onehotmess · 26/06/2022 23:24

Roll out of bed In the morning, put on what you wanted and go?

This morning I overslept so left the house within 15 minutes of actually getting out of bed. Can't understand how women make it so complicated - even those who never wear makeup.

Eliveonline · 27/06/2022 16:33

How liberating vs having to wash and dry hair, apply makeup, dress in lots of different styles, accessorise etc. It’s such a bloody waste of brain power (and yet I do it every day)

the only bit of that I do is wash and dry hair and I'm a woman. And drying hair = quick blast with hair dryer.ni

Conflictedunicorn · 27/06/2022 16:30

SallyWD · 27/06/2022 16:26

A bit depressing that this thread is just trotting out an endless stream of negative male stereotypes. Imagine if a bunch of men were all trashing women like this.

We don’t have to imagine it. Most of us know full well how some men hate women Thankyou

WhiteFire · 27/06/2022 16:29

You will have to track your own gyni schedule because the NHS will drop you from their records.

That is something us meanies on here have been pointing out for a long time. It is something that needs resolving, easiest way is for the sex marker to not be changed, but you know that isn't acceptable.

definitely any promotions.

Women already get overlooked so no difference there then.

You would go see your GP and get told you can see a specialist in 18 weeks as per the NHS rules but they will chortle that its probably going to be 5 years before you hear back.

The NHS is letting a lot of groups down, many can't be seen at all. Women are fobbed off for being a woman and /or our age.

So in essence a transman has as a rough a deal as a boring old woman. And so, the world keeps spinning.

LaughingPriest · 27/06/2022 16:28

Anyway - I've been assuming that most people on here already know it, but in case not - the requirement for 'living in an acquired gender' is as follows (alongside a gender dysphoria diagnosis):

  1. Time living in your acquired gender
To qualify for recognition under this provision you must be able to prove that you have lived full time in your acquired gender for at least two years before the date of your application. [...]

We need you to provide evidence in the form of documents that are dated and include your name in your acquired gender. If the evidence is in a different name to the one you have used on the application form, you will need to show that it does relate to you.
Evidence could take a variety of forms. The following lists some examples:
• Official documentation e.g. driving licence and passport;
• Payslips or HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC) documents such as a P60 or P45;
• Department of Work and Pensions or HMRC benefit or tax letters or
documents;
• Bank or other financial institution documents or statements;
• Letters from official, professional or business organisations such as from
solicitors, accountants, dentists, doctors, employers or letters from people who
know you on a personal basis;
• Utility bills;
• Academic certificates or documentation;
• Health Care or identity cards including photo ID issued by an official
organisation.
This list is not exhaustive and is only intended as a guideline.

...
Typically five or six different documents should be included with an
application including where relevant a passport, driving licence, payslips or benefit documents, utility bills or other documents of an official nature.

SallyWD · 27/06/2022 16:26

A bit depressing that this thread is just trotting out an endless stream of negative male stereotypes. Imagine if a bunch of men were all trashing women like this.

TheSmallAssassin · 27/06/2022 16:21

FrancescaContini · 27/06/2022 16:05

What does “stereotypically female way” mean? Is there an objective definition? And what qualifies a psychologist to decide if the person applying for a GRC fulfils this requirement?

Well, precisely, that's part of the argument for removing some of the hoops that trans people have to jump through to get a GRC.

FrancescaContini · 27/06/2022 16:05

TheSmallAssassin · 26/06/2022 19:12

I don’t wear dresses or skirts or have long hair, so why do trans females sometimes think this is part of living as a woman?

For many years dressing in a stereotypically female way for a substantial period of time was required before trans women were allowed to get a gender recognition certificate. This was (is?) one of the ways that they needed to prove themselves to their psychologist. That might be one reason.

What does “stereotypically female way” mean? Is there an objective definition? And what qualifies a psychologist to decide if the person applying for a GRC fulfils this requirement?

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