TullipR going to sue NHS over poor care pre-sex-change procedure

I'll say it again. Regret rates for trans surgeries are less than most common surgeries

I'll say it again, the earth is flat.

I reckon that this thread will attract a lot of monitors ...

Sure Mishi, getting breast augmentation/reduction is just the same as lopping off your cock, highly comparable, should both be freely available on NHS, 'cos 'body autonomy', right?

My post was that Tulip is mistaken. Feminists are not ignoring young men and boys. We want all young people to be protected from irreversible, harmful consequences of ideology, and for all young people to develop and respect healthy boundaries.

I cannot believe that MNHQ find this offensive. No doubt someone did not like some of the more emotive - yet entirely accurate - terminology I used.

Yes, the invisible elephant in the room is that GD has been reclassed as not a mental health issue.

I imagine it is therefore impossible to say that anyone wishing to amputate their penis needs to consider mental health comorbidities. At least, I can imagine it would be difficult to do so without being accused of 'pathologising' something that some people are determined to describe as not a mental health issue and not connected with mental health issues. Hence why Cass noted that potential other reasons for GD should be noted, and she specifically included mental health comorbidities.

The 'affirmation only' approach as supported by WPATH (of the 'Eunuch' identity links) seems to suggest that anyone who says they wish to transition must be supported without any questions or consideration.

If 'Eunuch' is a gender identity, then any male who chooses to pursue penis amputation would be affirmed, is that correct?

Has Ritchie said what their opinions were of those who either did or maybe would have expressed doubts prior to the surgery? I've seen things posted where doctors or other hcp who express doubts or concerns are then vilified or reported to risk of losing registration due to discrimination.

Regret for private surgeries is one thing. I'm unhappy about some of the body modifications that are escalating these days. They aren't done on the nhs though.

I'm steaming about the difficulty accessing basic care in the NHS, essential surgery that's postponed indefinitely. NHS should first do no harm.

Regret rates for trans surgeries are less than most common surgeries - less so then breast augmentation for instance.

Can you supply any data to back up this statement? Or have you just made this up?

Do you know why regret is low?

Because after surgery you are no longer on a clinic's books. They don't do follow ups. This is what is coming up from the Tavistock mess. Regret is low because they don't ask.

And yet there was no one in the NHS that said "No".

If you have an eating disorder, the NHS don't give you liposuction.

Richie is right, boys are forgotten about in all of this, I'm not sure why there is always sympathy for the girls, but none for the boys.

This could well be a male relative of yours. Any parent should be worried, and it's probably because we as a society indulge any male wanting to change sex that we are now starting to see those consequences on girls and the pressure on gender non-conformity equalling trans.

@MishyJDI

Not all surgeries or modifications are comparable. I regret a piercing - so what? I’m not infertile. I’m not suffering serious long-term detriments. This person is.

The NHS needs to operate according to a rigorous system of medical ethics, not ‘well you asked me to do it so fuck you’.

Should we also campaign to stop sexist breast augmentation surgery, as that has a much higher regret level then trans surgeries?

Does the NHS pay for these?

I'll say it again. Regret rates for trans surgeries are less than most common surgeries - less so then breast augmentation for instance.

Yes there will always be a few who it doesn't work out for. But he was an adult and has to take responsibility for that. And we owe him the support he needs to live with his own decisions. But suing the NHS is wrong.

Should we also campaign to stop sexist breast augmentation surgery, as that has a much higher regret level then trans surgeries?

For every person who has this surgery, there is a surgeon who has carried it out, and a number of other people in the hospital who have assisted. Everyone who made this happen is responsible, not just the person who has the operation. Any, or all of them, could just say no to carrying out such an unnecessary and harmful operation. Why aren't they thinking of the people suffering and waiting for actual necessary operations?

Why are these medical professionals carrying out this unnecessary surgery on demand? They don't amputate healthy limbs from people who 'insist' on it. Why is this different?

If we don’t support people who have had this done to them, it will never stop.

So person insists on ridiculous unnecessary surgery then sues because they got what they wanted? FFS, these people are so fecking self obsessed, do they ever give a thought to the people suffering and waiting for actual necessary operations? Twats.

Do you also think the surgeon in this article should have been allowed to continue to amputate the healthy limbs of patients who requested it?

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/625680.stm

The surgeon who amputated healthy limbs from private patients suffering from a psychiatric disorder has defended his decision to carry out the procedures.

Dr Robert Smith spoke out in the debate over the ethics of the operations at Falkirk and District Royal Infirmary.

The trust which runs the hospital has confirmed that no action will be taken against Dr Smith but the chairman has described as inappropriate this type of surgery in an NHS hospital.

Why should it be OK to amputate a healthy penis on request, but not a healthy limb?

Why is the NHS carrying out these operations when they don't have enough money to treat people who actually need medical treatment?

BUT if those things weren't done, if he didn't have a MH assessment, if they didn't talk all the negatives through with him, then that is terrible.

But if gender dysphoria is not a MH problem then you can't use that to deny surgery! It's a minefield.

Is it's that easy, why do they refuse vasectomies to men under a certain age? Refuse to sterilise women full stop. Refuse hysterectomies?

If I research really carefully and am quite sure it's what I need, can I have a boob reduction and a nose job? Can I have a hysterectomy?

Why not? Why does Tulip get full responsibility for his choices, despite a history of poor mental health and asking for something clearly 'mental', while I get to be told 'no, it's not good for you!'

Come on. Which is it?

I'm not sure. So he was 30. He surely must have known what would happen if he asked for his cock and balls to be cut off? He wasn't a naive 16yo. He bears some responsibility for researching the op, side effects, recovery time, etc.

He said he regretted it the second he woke up - well, that's not the NHS's fault!!

The NHS can't get it right: waiting times are too long, killing trans people; OPs are done too quickly...

He surely must have been talked through the possible effects? And signed a waiver?

If not, then he's old enough to ask about these things.

@ChagSameachDoreen · "So someone falls into the thrall of an ideology, insists on affirmation, and then sues the NHS when they get what they wanted but don't like it?
I'm afraid I'm starting to lose sympathy."

So would you lose sympathy if the NHS gave an anorexic a gastric by-pass surgery?

Responsible doctors do not dispense treatment or surgery because a patient asks. They engage in a detailed clinical assessment of what is appropriate. If that did not happen to this young man he is absolutely right to bring a claim.
his account is heartbreaking.