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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Racism and rainbow laces in the NHS

28 replies

lanadelgrey · 15/06/2022 08:15

Makes me furious hearing about the racism being reported in the news but all that effort going into lanyards, pronoun badges and more.
The obvious and awful issue being overlooked or possibly papered over by the rainbow stripes.
My DD is named after a doctor who played an important role in her dad’s life: non-white, non-UK so never made it to consultant but wonderful and brilliant person

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BlackeyedSusan · 15/06/2022 15:57

ChagSameachDoreen · 15/06/2022 08:27

It infuriates me when so many resources are being poured into changing simple languages like "women" to "people who have cervixes" - terminology that won't be understood by some women with English as a second language, or limited reading skills. Inclusivity nowadays includes gender and that's it. Nobody cares about improving outcomes for black/Asian, working class and disabled people. The stonewall lobby has done so much damage, and our public institutions have paid them for the privilege.

This.

thanks

MangyInseam · 15/06/2022 15:54

I think there are a lot of artificialities being created across these DIE initiatives in many sectors because the way they set up the questions or problems is itself quite compromised.

Inclusion of disabled people is in some ways very different than many of the other groups, because very often it' sabout the very physical, measurable barriers that belong to individuals. Sure, you can talk about the stats for access for those with disabilities, to health services, or leisure activities, or work. But there is no serious way to address those apart from looking at the very individual needs related to specific direct barrier, and often not even to a group, but to an individual. So maybe you want bus destinations to be announced through a speaker for blind riders, or you need to change an office set up for a specific worker with a specific mobility issue. Concrete problems and concrete solutions, and in some situations it is even clear that there is no solution - the worker with the mobility problem can be accomodated just fine in one office environment, but not working in a warehouse, and that is ok.

But for most of the other groups, the problems are less concrete, less individual. Sometimes their identification is mainly about statistical disparities, with very little real attention to the actual mechanism of the disparity. Sometimes the diaparities are considered good or bad for what seem to be arbitrary reasons. Very often the most efficient solutions to the disparies on a group level are unclear, or would be unacceptable to address directly for good reasons. Sometimes it seems that the disparities are artifacts of something completely different or poor statistical analysis. Often, when you look at an individuals real situation, it is completely at odds with the situation of the group and talking about addressing the disparity concretel is a nonsense.

So for the first group, solutions tend to instantiated in concrete ways measurable by individuals, but which also require real action, in the second group real action may be difficult or impossible, with unclear results for individuals, and yet scemes to combat those disparities are typically performative and cheap.

VestofAbsurdity · 15/06/2022 14:13

ChagSameachDoreen · 15/06/2022 08:27

It infuriates me when so many resources are being poured into changing simple languages like "women" to "people who have cervixes" - terminology that won't be understood by some women with English as a second language, or limited reading skills. Inclusivity nowadays includes gender and that's it. Nobody cares about improving outcomes for black/Asian, working class and disabled people. The stonewall lobby has done so much damage, and our public institutions have paid them for the privilege.

Oh but don't they just love taking our money in the form of tax to do this? Perhaps those the NHS, ignore, insult, discriminate against should refuse to hand over their money to an organisation that so dismisses and derides them, I am sure that the miniscule percentage of the people they are pandering to will pick up the shortfall in funding for them.

Feckedupbundle · 15/06/2022 14:03

I agree entirely with the previous posters. All this 'inclusion' shit only goes one way. Our family's experience of having a disabled person in hospital was appalling. The worst comment we had,from a HCP, was that 'they' didn't feel pain! What she meant was that people with Downs Syndrome didn't feel pain. I couldn't believe that anyone working in a hospital could be so ignorant and actually announce that ignorance. My relative didn't even have DS,which was evident by using ones eyes and reading his notes.
This was about 16 years ago, so not exactly the dark ages.

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 15/06/2022 14:02

I meant to quote a different paragraph about the costs of litigation around maternity care and neonatal outcomes. I've no idea where this comes out wrt the relative costs of maternity care.

The Public Accounts Committee has identified that a small number of high value claims, mostly related to maternity care, is a major contributor to these costs.4 Maternity accounted for 50% of the total value of claims received by NHS Resolution in 2018-19, though it represented only 10% of the total number of claims.1 The high cost of these claims arises because injury at birth (including brain injury) can have catastrophic effects over a lifetime.5

www.bmj.com/content/368/bmj.m552

MrsOvertonsWindow · 15/06/2022 13:58

Katya213 · 15/06/2022 09:28

Can you give examples of racism please in the NHS?

I'd call the repeated failure to tackle with the fact that Black women are statistically four times more likely to die during childbirth than white women in the UK very clear evidence of entrenched racism.

The appointment of so many self interested activists to Diversity & Inclusion posts in the NHS who self indulgently promote their narrow niche agenda is clear evidence of who is valued and prioritised by the NHS.

www.openaccessgovernment.org/childbirth-black-women-uk/117437/

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 15/06/2022 13:56

(The statistics programme More or Less looking at the claim by Jeremy Hunt that maternity services spend as much on maternity litigation claims as they do on wages).

It will be interesting to see the specifics of that but I know there are estimates of extraordinary costs.

The NHS paid £2.4bn (€2.8bn; $3.1bn) in clinical negligence claims in 2018-19, according to NHS Resolution (formerly the NHS Litigation Authority).1 This sum equates to about 2% of the entire budget for the NHS in England (roughly £115bn). But even these startling figures do not provide the full picture, since NHS Resolution also has to account for claims likely to be received in the future. Now standing at £83.4bn, the amount “set aside” for such claims is among the most substantial public sector financial liabilities faced by the UK government,2 second only to nuclear decommissioning (£131bn).3

www.bmj.com/content/368/bmj.m552

WhereYouLeftIt · 15/06/2022 13:50

MrsOvertonsWindow · 15/06/2022 08:54

I suspect it allows the NHS to ignore all the medical scandals in relation to maternity care - they can keep busy putting rainbows everywhere rather than solving the dangerous situation that kills and maims so many women - especially Black women.

Yes, that was on mentioned on Radio 4 this morning too, as well as the racism. (The statistics programme More or Less looking at the claim by Jeremy Hunt that maternity services spend as much on maternity litigation claims as they do on wages).

The NHS has a particularly un-diverse notion of what diversity actually is. It's supposed to be win-win. Employees of any and all the protected characteristics get treated fairly, and employers get the diverse viewpoints and input that comes with true diversity - saving them from the mistakes of groupthink. Instead we get lanyards and - yes, groupthink.

KittenKong · 15/06/2022 10:09

We were discussing this this morning when it was on the radio. So much money spent on nonsense and the whole stonewall points scoring for suppliers.

who is running the nhs - it’s on its knees and we are supposed to be a wealthy country.

Watermelon46 · 15/06/2022 09:53

Babdoc · 15/06/2022 09:00

Everything nowadays is style over substance - corporate virtue signalling woke wankery. Management prefer spending time and money on this crap rather than care about patients or staff.

Couldn’t agree more

stealtheatingtunnocks · 15/06/2022 09:43

It fascainates me how good a group of largely middle class people with an education are at telling g us that they are the most marginalised.

for a vulnerable group they sure are good at getting everything they want.

people with learning disabilities die because they can’t access basic care. No one had a lanyard for them.

Clymene · 15/06/2022 09:40

lanadelgrey · 15/06/2022 09:38

News today about how Black and Asian medical staff suffer racism - BMA report found 76% had experienced racism at work. Percentage intake of non white doctors does not translate into similar percent reaching consultant level.

I heard a doctor being interviewed on the radio this morning. It's disgusting how little effort the nhs puts into fixing this very really problem and pours scarce funds into rainbow washing instead

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 15/06/2022 09:39

Collection of discussions of NHS and racism in the workforce and work practices.

blogs.bmj.com/bmjleader/category/roger-kline-actions-to-tackle-nhs-workforce-race-discrimination/

lanadelgrey · 15/06/2022 09:38

News today about how Black and Asian medical staff suffer racism - BMA report found 76% had experienced racism at work. Percentage intake of non white doctors does not translate into similar percent reaching consultant level.

OP posts:
endofthelinefinally · 15/06/2022 09:31

I am so glad I am retired. I agree with you OP. I did loads of work on the impact of race and ethnicity on outcomes in women's health, particularly in obstetrics. That was nearly 20 years ago now. It is really hard to get the message out if there is no money and no political will.
Rainbow lanyards and laces require no intelligent input at all.

Beowulfa · 15/06/2022 09:30

The maternity statistics for black and Asian women are an absolute disgrace; sorting this should be a national priority. Women and their babies are being FAILED by medical staff on a daily basis, but let's worry about pronouns eh.

Katya213 · 15/06/2022 09:28

Can you give examples of racism please in the NHS?

RadicalisedByMumzNet · 15/06/2022 09:20

I've been thinking a lot about diversity in relation to physical, mental and learning disabilities.

This affects a greater number of the population (not least because a disability affects those around you more, who you want to fuck only affects you) it is a disgrace how diversity only means one thing now.

ofwarren · 15/06/2022 09:13

sickofthisnonsense · 15/06/2022 09:10

Diversity and inclusion only means for one group now.

Health providers should be working really hard for people with disabilities especially.

Sign language, proper disability access, language barriers. All creat barriers but a bit of glitter and a rainbow are much easier and cheaper to do.

This
My brother is profoundly disabled and access to health care for him is dreadful.

sickofthisnonsense · 15/06/2022 09:10

Diversity and inclusion only means for one group now.

Health providers should be working really hard for people with disabilities especially.

Sign language, proper disability access, language barriers. All creat barriers but a bit of glitter and a rainbow are much easier and cheaper to do.

ThinkingaboutLangClegosaurus · 15/06/2022 09:06

I was going to quote a PP but every one of these is worth quoting. Dead right. And we (through our tax and NI) pay Stonewall to undermine our rights.

Babdoc · 15/06/2022 09:00

Everything nowadays is style over substance - corporate virtue signalling woke wankery. Management prefer spending time and money on this crap rather than care about patients or staff.

IanOsenfrote · 15/06/2022 08:56

It's as though there isn't millions of people on waiting lists if they are spending all this time and money on this nonsense.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 15/06/2022 08:54

I suspect it allows the NHS to ignore all the medical scandals in relation to maternity care - they can keep busy putting rainbows everywhere rather than solving the dangerous situation that kills and maims so many women - especially Black women.

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