LGB Alliance to plan helpline with Lottery funding

Also @Starlee you didn't answer my question about wrong bodies.

So you acknowledge that to believe that, you have to have a belief in a soul and some greater being that has 'intended' bodies for those souls to go in?

More importantly, what do you mean by 'match'? Can you be specific - which kinds of souls/minds/psyches 'match' which kinds of bodies?

If you don't know, could you please at least have the courtesy to say so instead of ignoring me? You quoted an older question of mine and repeated an answer to that question that you'd already given, so perhaps you hadn't spotted my following question.

You're telling us to chat to trans people to find out - yet you're here, you're trying to explain lots of things about gender but it's pointless if you can't clarify what you mean when you are asked.

starlee i asked "You believe that heterosexual (ie a person of one sex attracted solely to people of the opposite sex) people can be gay, don't you?"

You said, about a "biologically male transwoman attracted to women" that they would be a lesbian.

It looked like you were answering my question as "yes" with that answer. Are you now changing it?

Yes, you have. You have confirmed that you think a “trans lesbian” i.e. a male attracted to women, i.e. opposite sex attracted, is homosexual. From that, the other points in my comment follow.

You’ve also made it clear in other posts that you don’t even understand what is meant by the letters LGB in “LGB Alliance.” It’s fucking pathetic.

Kids in the past didn't have access to info like they do today, they assumed they were gay because that's all they'd heard about. And then finally they realise, often after many years, sometimes decades, that they are actually trans and everything becomes clear. THAT is what you will be told over and over again if you actually listen to trans people talk of their own experiences, they're not my words.

So, were they males sexually attracted to males or females attracted to females?

You acknowledge that they could have benefited from support to identify if they were L, G or B so they could have worked out their needs earlier.

Yet you are attempting to deny young people today greater access to services that can assist them?

Because of your own deeply held prejudice, that you provide reasons why, but seem to be unable to provide evidence to substantiate those reasons.

You are fully entitled to hold whatever opinion you want, of course. Just as I am.

As for the rest of your post, you don't agree with my replies, well that's your problem, not mine.

No. I pointed out that your answers were hyperbolic, seem to be based on emotional reasoning, misinformation about the organisation and were effectively non-answers.

And you are on a thread arguing against the provision of extra support services for young people based on those opinions which in turn, you seem to have formed based on misrepresentation and misinformation.

EmpressaurusWitchDoesntBurn

How interesting that Nancy Kelly is considered ‘no one’. And that the parallel drawn in Allison Bailey’s court case with apartheid is overlooked.

I mean, I consider McKinnon is probably more important in their own head than reality but USA media, and some UK media consider McKinnon/Ivy as being some kind of spokes person on trans issues. It will be crushing, just crushing that they are also considered as ‘no-one’.

But yes… apparently no one is telling the L and the G those things …

What absolute rubbish! No-one is telling them they "cannot be L and G, homosexuality is like racism" etc or that they "must 'learn to cope' with straight sex".

The comment about lesbians being like sexual racists was from Nancy Kelley, the CEO of Stonewall. Also, at Allison Bailey’s recent tribunal, a Garden Court Chambers barrister repeatedly drew parallels between the cotton ceiling (lesbians not being attracted to biological males) and apartheid in South Africa. I’m linking to Sonia Sodha’s excellent article for easy reference but there are plenty of other citations.

amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/may/29/if-lesbian-prefers-same-sex-dates-thats-not-bigotry-desire-personal-thing

Learning to cope with straight sex came from cyclist Veronica Ivy, formerly Rachel McKinnon.

I have confirmed no such thing, and don't tell me what I mean, you are wrong.

Surely the best way to confirm a person's sexual orientation would be to ask the person themselves, not a stranger?

Stop lying. I have never advocated that anyone should tell children that their body is wrong. But many trans people DO use the term "being born in the wrong body" to try and describe how they feel.
And as a disabled people I can tell you that of course we know our bodies are wrong, it's what being 'disabled' actually means: "a person who has a physical or mental impairment". Shock horror! 🙄

@Artichokeleaves "And yet lesbian and gay people are being told by the same TQ+ political agenda that they cannot be L and G, homosexuality is like racism, they know wrong and it's all bias and prejudice that they must unlearn, and they must 'learn to cope' with straight sex so they do not distress a TQ+ person who wishes to maintain the uninterrupted illusion of their preferred sex and so identifies as being gay and wanting sex with a gay person."

What absolute rubbish! No-one is telling them they "cannot be L and G, homosexuality is like racism" etc or that they "must 'learn to cope' with straight sex".
You don't seem to realise that a large number of trans people are also LG or B. www.lgbt.cusu.cam.ac.uk/trans/the-t-within-lgbt/

@Helleofabore The T is not being "forced teamed with the LGB?" The majority of LGB people WANT the T included, you and the LGBA are the minority who are trying to force them out.

"Yet.... even you admitted in that post that being 'T' was not like being 'LGB"'.
You stated it clearly: 'In the past far too many trans kids never knew about gender identities and grew up thinking they were LGB although something still felt 'wrong'.'"
Admitted? I've never denied it, of course trans and LGB are different things, although some people are both trans and LG or B.
Kids in the past didn't have access to info like they do today, they assumed they were gay because that's all they'd heard about. And then finally they realise, often after many years, sometimes decades, that they are actually trans and everything becomes clear. THAT is what you will be told over and over again if you actually listen to trans people talk of their own experiences, they're not my words.

As for the rest of your post, you don't agree with my replies, well that's your problem, not mine.

That really makes no sense whatsoever. Trans lives are being excluded and discriminated against in the same way black lives are, and so both groups are currently in need of extra help to fight that discrimination.

I've never said their bodies are wrong, and it's wrong to tell kids that they are. Being "born in the wrong body" is how many trans people describe how they feel, their words, not mine.

Science doesn't agree with you. www.dictionary.com/e/choice-change-convert-lgbtq-harmful-language/

In contrast, the LGBA was set up with the sole purpose of opposing gender identity, it is the stated reason for their existence, as in their mission statement, they are based on discrimination and hatred of another minority, protected group of vulnerable people.
Supporting them is supporting the opposition and discrimination of trans people.

Rewording the bullshit doesn't stop it being bullshit.

Well Pluvia… I just took this inane suggestion as confirmation that some posters cannot conceive that other posters on this thread know either trans people or LGB people.

It is hilarious really.

^Take yourself down to a gay bar* … errrr no need. How about I discuss it with my colleagues and my family and friends? Oh that is right, we need to educated because we have absolutely no LBG people or trans people in our lives.

Because if we did, they would have ‘educated’ us to agree with the posters posting these inane comments… because no LGB or trans person can hold an opinion that differs from the publicised line.

The relationship between the L & the G & the B has always been wonderfully harmonious and everything is awesome!!!!

Take yourself down to a gay bar and chat with a few of the locals.

What century are you living in? There have been no gay bars since the mid-noughties, when straight people began to take them over. I can remember going down Canal Street in 2008 and in every lesbian bar there was at least one transwoman, too often standing alone and glowering in a corner.

From that entire thread you post that?

Why am I not surprised?

Sparple away!

And that tweet you posted… any progress on engaging with the original thread, in the original context ?

or just further misrepresentation?

While you are here, any evidence that the founders I listed were not fighting with Stonewall specifically or with an aligned group to achieve those events you mentioned???

Anthing other than sparple?

and the distraction continues.

Nothing else to offer?

And what has Stonewall contributed that has tipped the balance regarding abortion in NI that feminist groups have not? Seems like you are trying to attribute fighting for abortion to be a primary Stonewall issue.

Oh … look … a squirrel!!!

You seemed to be unaware than NI only legalised gay marriage a few years ago. This is not a squirrel. It is a fundamental right for LGBT people and it reveals how out of touch you are with the community - hence the support for the LGBA.

Have you heard of a place called Northern Ireland? You might want to Google when it legalised gay marriage (abortion too while we're on the subject).

oh dear … still doubling down and missing the points I raised.

Look… there is a squirrel…. Is it a red squirrel or a grey squirrel… no matter, it is still a squirrel.

And yes, you are right, I am extremely prejudiced against transphobes

yeah ok . I am sure you feel righteous and morally superior too!

You seem still unable to engage with the substance of the issues and every post just reiterates that you cannot.

I have no idea who your child is attracted to. That's up to them to figure out. What a weird question.

Have you heard of a place called Northern Ireland? You might want to Google when it legalised gay marriage (abortion too while we're on the subject).

And yes, you are right, I am extremely prejudiced against transphobes.