Waitrose delivery driver

I'd love to know why my post was deleted.

FWR posters have been deleted for before now so it doesn't actually mean much. MN is risk averse for particular magic words in a complaint. tbf, aside from then you might want to avoid references to the top of large and high geographical features, hill walking, and even walking boots in some contexts.

Have any actual women (the boring dinosaur vagina-y sort) ever EVER started a conversation with a stranger by saying "I'm a woman"? Normally I say hello, or I like your top, or isn't the weather mad today, or similar.

I'd love to know why my post was deleted.

To be clear, I imagined a completely imaginary scenario of what could happen if this male trans activist continues to work as a delivery driver. I used the example of a little old lady because little old ladies are women (which is relevant in the context of men encroaching on women's rights, and in the context of TRA misogyny) and because "little old" demonstrates that this hypothetical lady is amongst the most vulnerable of all women.

I was in no way suggesting that it will happen or is likely to happen.

My point is that once Waitrose are aware of his misogyny and aggression and entitlement (assuming we can trust KJKs account, which I believe we can) then Waitrose are putting themselves at massive risk by continuing to put this man in situations where he is alone with women. Waitrose have been given fair warning that this man is likely to be a greater risk to women than an average man who has never done anything concerning. Waitrose cannot be blamed if a formerly perfect employee has a breakdown one day and does something crazy. But when an employees behaviour starts raising red flags then the company are on notice and have to be very careful that they don't allow an unfortunate incident to occur that would have been prevented had they acted after the first event.

That was my point.

Good to know. So when a man who is providing a service asks you a question, the best thing to do is deflect because otherwise you might be escalating.

Do you also think women who wear short skirts are asking for it or is it just talking we need to stop doing?

Yay! Women, speak not, even when spoken to!

What? You mean the carefully constructed story that so upset you didn't have an ageing lady in place of KJK? You REALLY only parsed the Waitrose employee?

Omg!

The latter

KJK wasn’t portrayed in the now deleted post.

Have no idea why you are going on about ageism.

Thats my point. You keep repeating the same thing. I am not arguing about.what was written but rather your response.

You noticed that and are incensed on behalf of the Waitrose employee.

But have no such thought about how KJK was portrayed.

Ageism doesn't cross your mind... you have a bias and are repeatedly showing it

That amuses me...

He asked her a direct question @Hoppinggreen - when you say women deserve single sex spaces, that includes transwomen does it?

What was she supposed to do? Lie? Say no but I don't want to talk about it, just give me my cheese? What?

Well they weren’t people substitutions. @GCRich made it explicitly clear they were writing about the waitrose delivery driver in that post and also in their still standing subsequent posts about that post.

No but I think a simple “ I do not agree with you, don’t wish to discuss it and I would like you to leave my property immediately” would have been a better way to go than to give this person the reaction they wanted.
No being kind or polite or allowing them to push boundaries but no drama either
But as I said, that wouldn’t really have been podcast worthy would it?

Exactly right. Thank you

no problem whatsoever

glad to help

Such hyperbole. We are all adults. Yes, it was an unpleasant scenario but you didn't actually repeat it. You complained about one half of the people substitutions, hence my post about it.

We may not be able to see it but I do remember what I replied to.

@RufustheFloralmissingreindeer
”i see where the confusion is now…you said KJK wants the driver sacked and everyone completely misinterpreted it to mean that you’d said that KJK wanted the driver sacked. got it”

Exactly right. Thank you

I just felt sick after I realised I had summarised portions of @GCRich ’s transphobic post with more detail than I was comfortable with. It was a gratuitously violent fiction and repeating it even to criticise just did not sit right with me.

Oh! What changed your mind about that post?

So... the simple fact that KJ spoke publicly about this means that she wants the driver sacked. Despite not ever saying that, or in fact actually saying that she was happy to accept Waitrose deciding not to deliver to her anymore, if that's what they wanted.

Oh no she didn't.

Yes you parsed it like that. You took exception at The Man in the story as you equated him with the Waitrose worker.

But you did not take umbrage at Little Old Lady, equated in an horrendous display of ageism, with KJK. Well, maybe if you were looking offence.

You saw one and not the other. How odd!

MNHQ tend to err on the side if caution, especially if your report contains trigger words, like transohobia. Doesn't mean you have been vindicated, just that you know which buttons to push.

I never said KJK actually said that she wanted the driver to lose their job

She wants the driver sacked now

oh nope, got it wrong…its not a tone thingy. Its cos you said she wants the driver sacked

i see where the confusion is now…you said KJK wants the driver sacked and everyone completely misinterpreted it to mean that you’d said that KJK wanted the driver sacked

got it

Simply put I disagree, this incident would indicate that this wdd is likely to physically attack a woman in the right circumstances.

HoppingGreen
This isn't anything to do with whether it is fine to not have firm opinions on an issue. The driver is trans so definitely has firm opinions, and KJK certainly does.

This is about the social norms of where you initiate discussion. Richard Dawkins has made a reputation for himself on his willingness to argue with creationists. Does that mean that a supermarket delivery driver who believes in Young Earth Creationism is entitled to tackle him on any of it in Richard's own home while delivering his food for the week? Absolutely not!

@Discovereads Where did I say that this entitled man was likely to attack someone? I didn't, I suggested that knowing that he is argumentative, unable to respect women's boundaries and willing to refuse a woman's request for him to leave her property immediately. Given that Waitrose now know that about him they are leaving themselves open to massive criticism if they allow him to continue to go on as before. Maybe it is only a 1% or 5% or 25% chance that he would ever assault a woman, but Waitrose have had fair warning that he is the sort of man who might. If he had punched KJK he should be sacked and never given a customer facing role again. In this circumstance I think that he should probably be taken from a customer facing role, and hopefully sacked. But the one thing that needs to be done is that he needs to be kept away from women who are alone.