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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Scottish prison officials ‘can weed out’ inmates abusing trans rights

35 replies

Igneococcus · 08/06/2022 06:04

The Scottish Prison Service says it can totally tell the once trying to abuse trans rights from those that don't:

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/2f3717dc-e676-11ec-9b02-3f136f233710?shareToken=88735806eadd7a1adcbe0433466937d3

OP posts:
mrshoho · 08/06/2022 07:36

How is this ever ever going to work? If the bill is passed men can identify as women without question and obtain a new birth certificate showing their new gender? Am I reading correctly? If these people go on to commit a crime and are sentenced are they then automatically referred to as their reassigned gender and housed accordingly?

PiffleWiffleWoozle · 08/06/2022 07:31

How? How do they tell?

PonyPatter44 · 08/06/2022 07:30

I am genuinely horrified that the SPS has placed a female offender in the male estate. WTF were they THINKING?? HMP has very occasionally placed females in the male estate, but only ever as a very very short-term solution and under very strictly segregated conditions.

This is the nonsense (or genius, depending on your PoV) of recording gender over sex. You don't even know how many trans offenders you have, beyond their own say-so. They could be self-IDing as female, they could have had full gender reassignment surgery. They could even just be fucking with the SPS, because sometimes (and this is a revolutionary idea) sometimes prisoners tell lies.

Whatwouldscullydo · 08/06/2022 07:29

So much fir acceptance without exception huh...

MrsGhastlyCrumb · 08/06/2022 07:21

FOJN · 08/06/2022 07:07

Updating the committee, he said that, as of March 31, there were 16 trans prisoners in custody across Scotland, with 50 per cent of trans women housed in the female estate and 75 per cent of trans men in the female estate.

I find this sort of thing fascinating. Do they not understand we can tell they are trying to avoid telling us exactly how many men are in women's prisons? Who in their right mind has agreed to house a female in the male prison estate?

Doesn't this likely add up to there being 4 trans men and 12 trans women in the estate, and therefore 6 males housed in women's prison, 1 female in the males'?

334bu · 08/06/2022 07:16

Yes use of percentages interesting as it masks different numbers between male and female prisoners. Would be very interesting to see if ratio between male and female transgender prisoners is similar to the ratio in the rest of the prison population. Have seen elsewhere that only 1 transman may be in male estate.

WalrusSubmarine · 08/06/2022 07:15

So they are admitting it might be a problem. What genius came up with that.

This is farcical. We have no lie detectors. We’re utterly reliant on the honesty of males in prisons verbally asserting that they are women. Plus we’re shaming and shunning people who don’t agree so no one is going to stick their neck out and call liar if they could lose their job and be labelled transphobic.

FOJN · 08/06/2022 07:07

Updating the committee, he said that, as of March 31, there were 16 trans prisoners in custody across Scotland, with 50 per cent of trans women housed in the female estate and 75 per cent of trans men in the female estate.

I find this sort of thing fascinating. Do they not understand we can tell they are trying to avoid telling us exactly how many men are in women's prisons? Who in their right mind has agreed to house a female in the male prison estate?

mrshoho · 08/06/2022 06:28

What could possibly go wrong? A disaster in waiting. If the GRR bill is passed, officials will no doubt be very wary of challenging a person's gender identity (it's bad enough now!). The lawyers and courts will be busy that's for sure so at least they'll be some winners amongst the mess.

aweegc · 08/06/2022 06:24

So, the Scottish Prison Service basically decides who is "true trans"? That's rather transphobic.

The SPS thinks 50% of trans women are too dangerous to be in the female estate? Rather transphobic.

The SPS thinks 75% of trans males should be in the female estate? Transphobic much?

The SPS seems to think it can carry on this judgement of trans people when prisoners will have legal documentation of their self-ID-assumed gender identity? That will surely be illegal!

And if they're so good at determining who is abusing the system (which I thought nobody did..) then why are there reports of male prisoners "detransitioning" upon release from women's prison?

But really: Tell me you're structurally misogynistic without telling me you're structurally misogynistic.