Free beer for men at Bills' restaurant

No it really wouldn't be brilliant and it really isn't.

Oops, I came across a bit Mary Beard there. Speaking of which, her absolute takedown of Boris Johnson is well worth a watch for those who haven't seen it before. What an arrogant idiot to try to argue against an actual Professor of Classics and to ignore her home turf (quickly checks spelling...) advantage: www.intelligencesquared.com/events/greece-vs-rome-with-boris-johnson-and-mary-beard/

Oh for goodness sake. Basically, the upshot of OP's live chat was that if you are a man or you present as a man, you can have a free beer on Father's Day. It's really quite simple.

If anyone is that desperate for one free beer they could potentially just dress up as a man for the day to go and get their one free beer (probably have to buy a meal with it).

But really, how likely is that?? The much more likely scenario is that men and potentially a very very few transmen will go along and have a lovely complimentary beer with their families whilst celebrating Father's Day.

Unless of course there are a number of gender critical women who decide to go along dressed up as men to prove... what exactly, that they can get a free beer.... ?? So boring.

It doesn't highlight any other issues whatsoever so please just bore off.

Sounds like a modern remake of Aristophanes' Assemblywomen /Ἐκκλησιάζουσαι :en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assemblywomen

It's never easy to be sure exactly where he was coming from (e.g. Lysistrata has similar themes both celebrating and mocking women, and his other works can include some throwaway lines that are typical of the homophobia of Athens in 500 BC) but the dude was writing 2,500 years ago so I'm happy to cut him some slack.

Why are you spending your time looking for arguments with businesses?

You know it's the Bank Holiday, right?

I think this whole thing is mad, but spamming all their social media because they didn't answer you straight away on Jubilee day is just ridiculous.

I've tried contacting them through the link upthread to ask if they had had any training with Stonewall (perhaps they've been captured?) but they haven't replied so I've also now messaged them through their instagram and facebook pages.

Has anyone on this thread said it's a big issue? Has anyone on this thread said they're going to Bill's to kick up a fuss with the 16 year old girl earning pennies?

I think that when there is something solely for men it makes sense for GC people to make some points and ask some questions?

(1) Do you - senior management at Bills - know what you mean by men? Do you understand that some trans men might claim a free drink and are you "trans exclusionary" or "inclusionary"? If inclusionary then are you going to be consistent by excluding trans women even though some might be biological fathers, whereas no trans man is a biological father. (Obviously there are other fathers, not just biological ones).

(2) Do you underpaid waiting staff know what you mean by men, and why, so they can deal with the imaginary waiter-harrassers on mumsnet?

(3) Can you see how a seemingly innocent offer could open up a can of worms?

(4) Can you see how you need to be very clear how you define men otherwise your offer is basically a "open to anyone" offer?

(5) Can you see how you need to be very clear how you define women otherwise the women's toilets are basically a "open to anyone" toilets?

It might be an example of an opportunity to spread awareness of the wider issues.

This is why the Daily Mail hunts about for ridiculous stories to discredit women. Who gives a fuck about this individual shite?

I am GC. This thread is ridiculous.

Surely this is a cue for a group of female GC legends to sport beards, storm Bills and declare they are men for that day...?

Just an idea.

Go on! It would be brilliant.

Once again astounded at the small minded petty thinking of some MN posters when it comes to trans issues

I imagine she has better things to do than tweet about free Father’s Day beer.

This thread is absurd and I generally consider myself GC

I would like to know that Bill's are doing "the right thing

Seriously, why do you feel that they have to justify this to you?

The vast majority of people employed by Bills are minimum wage wait staff. They really can do without having to field this entirely unnecessary pettiness from people like you.

Also its principles, not principals.
And people who say "but it's the principle of the thing" are almost always fighting an unnecessary battle and losing sight of what actually matters.

Definitely!

Has anyone brought this to JKR's attention?

If she tweeted about it then it would probably be picked up by the Daily Mail, Talkradio, GB News etc.

As long as Bills' (never heard of them) do the same or similar on Mother's Day I don't see the problem? Although this could be an occasion when self-id could come in handy, I suppose!

Obviously there are much bigger issues, but there is such a thing as principals.

I would like to know that Bill's are doing "the right thing", which is, IMHO, to have a scientifically accurate definition of the word "man" and not serve women the free drink.

If, however, they are using the word "man" in a Stonewall approved way then two very important things. (1) They need to know that they are idiots. (2) they need to know that the only meaningful way that they can determine whether someone is entitled to a free drink is whether they say "I am a man - free drink please". And if that is the policy then I think that they should make sure that they inform all women who enter the premises of the fact so that gender conforming women don't miss out on free drinks offered to gender non-conforming women.

I don't think this helps the gender critical camp though - quite the opposite.

It is more likely to make Bills think that they need to pander to people with special identities for an easy life.

Oh don't be a dick. If you really want a free beer you can present as a trans man and go and get one - you've been told that's ok. Otherwise just leave it be - it's not really got anything to do with you.

What a load of nonsense this thread is. The live chat person was probably rolling her eyes and thinking there's always one, it must be a MNetter.