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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Gender critical Twitter is on fire today...

78 replies

tabbycatstripy · 25/05/2022 20:43

...after a Muslim children’s writer outed herself as gender critical, and when she received the usual ‘disappointed’ comments and accusations of being a ‘terf’, the ratio was clear: most people either support her, or they prefer not to say anything.

The tide has turned. Some of her accusers have been forced to delete their tweets, after their publishers were tagged in to the abusive content.

You love to see it.

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YetAnotherWalk · 31/05/2022 17:39

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 25/05/2022 22:21

They went after Onjali Raúf again?

In case you missed it, here's a guide to one of the lowest points so far.

How trans activists in publishing hijacked a children's book competition to pursue a personal vendetta

I bought one of her books after this and DS has really enjoyed it.

GoodThinkingMax · 31/05/2022 03:40

ooo thanks for the heads up about the sale.

I loved The End of the World is Flat. Mr Edge just nailed the current insanity in which we live. And it has an optimistic ending which alleviated my pessimism for about 5 minutes.

And of course, I'm waiting for the next Robert Galbraith book.

Also there's this beautiful thread about the apparently hate-spewing children's book by Rachel Rooney. I wish all the young people I know were young enough for what looks like an absolutely gorgeous book - in the realm of the Dr Seuss books, like The Places You'll Go

Thread by the assigned fabulous at birth Jane Harris.
Thread about Rachel Rooney's My Body is Me

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 31/05/2022 01:58

Better get to that book-buying. Voucher code at the end of thread.

Simon Edge (who I mentioned before) tweeted yesterday

Twitter Thread (edited in places for readability because new MN gets upset about twitter handles now)

Simon Edge on Twitter: The publishing industry has been vicious to authors who challenge gender ideology. The people who destroyed the careers of Rachel Rooney and Gillian Philip and tried to do the same for JK Rowling are now gunning for Onjali Rauf. I've mostly avoided it with The End of the World is Flat, partly because the Right Side of History brigade much prefer persecuting women ti men, but also because I'm published by a very small publisher not afraid to take risks.

However Eye and Lightning – which has published all five of my novels, and where I'm also on the editorial team – hasn't gone completely untargeted. There are a few tales I may never be able to tell, but I can relate one, about our shortlisting at the British Book Awards last week.

Eye Books was established 25 years ago in Shropshire, mainly publishing travel books and stories of ordinary people doing extraordinary things. In its earliest days it worked out of a mobile home on a caravan site. In its 25-year history, Eye Books never entered the British Book Awards or 'Nibbies', the Oscars of the book trade, because they tend to reward big publishers dealing in much greater bulk than us. But this year they unveiled a new category, Small Press of the Year.

That really had our name on it because, if nothing else, Eye and Lightning is small. A staff of six, none full time. No office premises. Flying by the seat of our pants a lot of the time. But always aiming high. So we thought we'd finally give it a shot and we put in an entry. We were chuffed to get longlisted (even if we suspected it's the kind of award where every entrant gets put on the longlist). Then we were OVERJOYED to win our Midlands regional heat. That meant we were on the national shortlist. Like, wow.

For me it was especially nice. When the shortlist was announced in the Bookseller, the long-established trade mag that runs the Nibbies, they cited my own novel The End of the World is Flat as one of the reasons we stood out. I tweeted about that, perhaps rashly – because shortly afterwards we were tipped off that an 'activist' had written to all the Small Press of the Year judges warning them not to give the award to Eye Books, which they should consider beyond the pale for daring to publish my novel.

There's obviously an irony here: my novel is a satire on the climate of censorship and fear created by a bunch of loons in thrall to a deranged ideology. So what do its critics (who I assume haven't even read it) want? More censorship! But of course they don't do irony...

Anyway, we went to the Nibbies last week, we had a great time and we didn't win. Let me stress: I don't think the campaign to lobby the judges played a part. they chose a very deserving winner, plus a deserving runner-up. We didn't expect to win and are happy with how far we got.

The point is, someone tried to sabotage the most joyous event in this tiny company's 25-year history. I don't know who it was. I can guess, although I may be wrong. And I'm reasonably sure it was someone punching down. Let's face it, it would be hard to punch up at Eye Books.

'm telling you all this now because Eye and Lightning is having a flash sale this weekend. 30% off all our titles (with free UK postage for orders over £15) if you use the discount code PLATINUM. That obviously includes all five of my novels. I may have mentioned them once or twice 😉 You can find them here: eye-books.com/shop

There's also a massive range of other titles and I'd just like to flag up three that may be of particular interest:

First off there's An Isolated Incident by the Aussie author Emily Maguire. It's the story of a violent crime, but it's not a whodunnit – it's about the impact on women. It was shortlisted for Australia's main literary, women's and crime prizes.
www.eye-books.com/books/an-isolated-incident

I also recommend The Beat of the Pendulum by Catherine Chidgey
. She's a literary star: her latest novel was longlisted for the Women's Prize & shortlisted for the Dublin Literary Award. This earlier one is experimental but hugely engaging once you get into it www.eye-books.com/books/the-beat-of-the-pendulum

Finally, you may like The Enemy Within by Adam Macqueen
. It's a thriller with an ex-rent boy hero set against the backdrop of the Brighton bomb. If you want to know what the 80s were REALLY like for gay men, read it. It's also a cracking page-turner. www.eye-books.com/books/the-enemy-within

There are tons of other great books. Browse away. If you make a purchase, you'll be helping Eye And Lightning stand up to the anonymous bully who tried to scupper our big night. Don't forget, use discount code PLATINUM. Sale ends midnight Tuesday 🙏
eye-books.com/shop

Simon's original twitter thread

Mascia · 30/05/2022 16:34

@theemperorhasnoclothes
“The people calling her a transphobe and saying it's 'hate' haven't thought through the issues of mixed sex (by stealth) toilets and other spaces for Muslim women and girls.“

This is something that always baffles me.
People who are usually very vocal in their support of ethnic minorities seem to have a blind spot when it comes to transwomen in women‘s spaces.
For some reason they seem to completely disregard the fact that by including transwomen in those spaces they might exclude Muslim women and girls.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 27/05/2022 01:03

I've seen Frank Cottrell-Boyce (children's author- wrote Sputnik's Guide to Life on Earth, which has some similarities to The Hitch-hiker's Guide to the Galaxy) stick up for Onjali Raúf before, so let's stick him on the List of Decent People in Children's Publishing.

Phobiaphobic · 26/05/2022 23:52

Mollyollydolly · 25/05/2022 22:41

Children's authors seem to be the worst people in the world. That little clique on twitter are absolute poison. Horrible people, just school bullies.

They really are. A bunch of self righteous head girls.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 26/05/2022 23:41

Neither publish children's fiction AFAIK, but for adult fiction and non-fiction, try Spinifex Press (feminist press) and Lightning Eye books, which publishes and employs extremely GC author Simon Edge. I'm not sure trans activists can come in range of Simon Edge without exploding in rage.

www.eye-books.com/post/lightning-a-new-deal-for-authors

theemperorhasnoclothes · 26/05/2022 23:20

The fact is that whilst TRAs frame it as child protection in a 'suicide, no debate' way, GC women talk about safeguarding frameworks and are willing to enage and discuss and talk about the evidence around puberty blockers.

One is a reasonable position of being willing to discuss evidence and what's best for children and the other is an attempt to stifle debate.

theemperorhasnoclothes · 26/05/2022 23:18

Tossedsaladandrambledlegs · 26/05/2022 22:06

Sadly it’s not about demographic. Most publishers won’t even look at your work if you’re GC and it’s an industry built on relationships.

I do think not having pronouns in bios is a statement of GC for the most part. A very quiet rebellion. It’s complicated deeply by the notion that TRAs want to frame it as a child protection issue (both sides do, actually) so it’s a real career killer.

This may be true but I'm betting the GC mothers market is probably much bigger than the TRA market, and more and more women are waking up.

Does anyone have recommendations of GC publishers we can support? Happy to try new authors under a GC Publishing house, that thinks that we should be free to discuss the evidence around giving children experimental drugs.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 26/05/2022 22:46

Wifwolf · 26/05/2022 19:43

I was pleased to see Katharine Quarmby tweeting her support for Onjali’s right to speak and calling out for diversity within publishing to include diversity of view.

twitter.com/katharineq/status/1529732442772459520?s=21&t=BkbIiYecGMjpXdrQS--9dg

Let's be adding Katharine Quarmby's children's books to the list of Women in Children's Publishing who deserve our money then. Her titles all sound really interesting, actually.

katharinequarmby.com/books-for-children/

Villagewaspbyke · 26/05/2022 22:08

I love or for this. As a religious but progressive Jew with an orthodox background, single sex spaces are essential in some contexts.

Tossedsaladandrambledlegs · 26/05/2022 22:06

Sadly it’s not about demographic. Most publishers won’t even look at your work if you’re GC and it’s an industry built on relationships.

I do think not having pronouns in bios is a statement of GC for the most part. A very quiet rebellion. It’s complicated deeply by the notion that TRAs want to frame it as a child protection issue (both sides do, actually) so it’s a real career killer.

SidewaysOtter · 26/05/2022 22:02

I must admit I'd not heard of Onjali Rauf until this thread (I don't have children so I'm afraid my knowledge of children's literature starts and ends with the books I read and JK Rowling). But now I have heard of her, every single time I need to buy a child a present, it will be one of Rauf's books. She sounds bloody awesome.

pollyhemlock · 26/05/2022 21:58

How can she possibly argue that anything Onjali says is hate speech? Can she not see how ridiculous this is? Has she actually read any of her books?

AppleandRhubarbTart · 26/05/2022 21:48

Thanks for alerting us to that, it's hilarious.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 26/05/2022 21:43

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 26/05/2022 21:37

I scrolled up from here to see it.

twitter.com/LevinsLaw/status/1529923379448451073

Oh dear. I cringed in embarrassment for Robin.

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 26/05/2022 21:37

tabbycatstripy · 26/05/2022 21:29

I think she picked an argument with whoever runs the Levins Solicitors account. Big mistake. Huge.

I scrolled up from here to see it.

twitter.com/LevinsLaw/status/1529923379448451073

tabbycatstripy · 26/05/2022 21:29

I think she picked an argument with whoever runs the Levins Solicitors account. Big mistake. Huge.

OP posts:
PurgatoryOfPotholes · 26/05/2022 21:23

Yeah, I've been refusing to buy books by Robin Stevens since November 2020, since the time she tried to guilt-trip us all into putting pronouns in bio because Kamala Harris does. Put pronouns in your bio or say grace before your meals? No problem. Order me to do so? Not happening.

For those using screenreaders

Robin's tweet in November: Our vice-president elect has her pronouns in her bio. What’s your excuse?

It was accompanied by an image of Kamala Harris's twitter profile, which does indeed have pronouns in.

Link to Twitter

If you have a squint at her wikipedia entry, you will see that she doesn't exactly come from the wrong side of the tracks. She can do without my money.

Gender critical Twitter is on fire today...
GrouchyKiwi · 26/05/2022 20:43

Onjali Rauf's books are wonderful. I bought them for my children after the last appalling attack on her, and my girls love them very much.

theemperorhasnoclothes · 26/05/2022 19:51

So disappointed that Robin Stevens is anti freedom of speech and for an ideology that thinks children should be given medication that hasn't been tested and shuts down any debate about that.

Won't be buying any more of her books. I did think they were a bit ridiculous and poorly written but DD loved them - still I've got her a couple of Onjali Rauf's now, which seem to be a bit more substantive and the writing style is better, and I'm sure she won't notice that Robin Stevens is off the list. Some good suggestions for new authors upthread too.

I spend WAY too much money on children's books.

Wifwolf · 26/05/2022 19:43

I was pleased to see Katharine Quarmby tweeting her support for Onjali’s right to speak and calling out for diversity within publishing to include diversity of view.

twitter.com/katharineq/status/1529732442772459520?s=21&t=BkbIiYecGMjpXdrQS--9dg

pollyhemlock · 26/05/2022 19:27

@PurgatoryOfPotholes I do so agree with what you say. I have actually read and enjoyed books by several of the TRA children’s authors. I accept that they hold views which I don’t agree with. That’s their choice. What I find intolerable is that they seem incapable of extending the same courtesy to authors who take a different stance on this one issue. A recent tweet by one of them basically accuses GC authors of being unkind to trans children. Well, leaving aside the question of whether there’s such a thing as a trans child, I defy them to find anything that’s unkind to any child in Rachel Rooney’s poems, or Onjali’s books. Or in anything they have said. Quite the opposite actually.

Tiphaine · 26/05/2022 19:00

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 26/05/2022 08:33

I sometimes do purchase books from authors with pronouns in bio, because I think in the toxic world of publishing, it's much more difficult for women to get away with not having them without incurring the wrath of the internet mob. So I felt a blanket prohibition on my part would risk indirectly discriminating against female authors.

Pompous as it may sound, I do sincerely feel that gender identity theory is a philosophical belief that other people are entitled to hold, just like any other religion, and I try to remind myself I think that when I'm most frustrated. My issue with various authors is not their sincerely held belief that TWAW, but the fact they aren't willing to tolerate differences in belief from others. It's the difference between being a Christian, and being a Christian who incites violence against atheists and people of other faiths.

So what I do is keyword searches on twitter accounts to gauge how they act on that belief. For example, to see if they've ever bullied Rachel Rooney or Onjali. It's not foolproof, but it's been enough to cancel multiple book purchases.

You've reminded me of JKR's recent reference to the story about the grocer twitter.com/jk_rowling/status/1516793678265827333?s=21&t=Mz4FXOG1mFYu6Qdx4CsjeQ. I do see your point and in theory I do absolutely agree with you. It must be hard for women authors especially to go against the grain. Even so, seeing their willingness to pay even lip service to a belief system I think is misogynist and homophobic gives me the ick and I just do not want to read a word they've written then.

Also a Lissa Evans fan

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 26/05/2022 16:31

emperor, I can't really disagree there. Every word you say is true.