A transwoman feeding their new born baby with their own milk..

I can't believe anybody would attempt to defend even considering testing something so potentially dangerous.
On babies.
It's lunacy.

Anyone who condones this experimentation on babies and children should start thinking up their excuses for why now.

Its sick and does nothing but feed into some weird validation for TW.

I‘ m frankly horrified any woman, particularly one who’s breastfed their baby, could support this

I would be most concerned for the health of any baby being subjected to this

@HermioneKipper not at all. I am just struggling to see the distinction between my case and the case reports cited here, whcih are the ones which are reported. Presumably there is a larger population of TW either seeking medical advice but the outcome not getting reported, or not seeking medical advice and following a protocol anyway. So its premature to conclude that TW can only produce a teaspoon of milk and that this is non-nutritive.

Evem if it is non-nutritive it may have positive benefits for the baby's immune system when given in conjunction with supplementary formula.

Either way breast-feeding promotes bonding between parent and child and improves parental MH both of which are good outcomes for women and TW.

The argument that it must be dangerous because there are chemicals in it and this makes it different to born-women's breastmilk makes little sense if born-women are encouraged to feed breastmilk full of chemicals (I was).

The argument that born-women are taking 'carefully managed meds' whilst TW are taking 'a cocktail of cross sex hormones' makes little sense if in both cases the drugs are prescribed and overseen by a specialist. As someone who has now been seen by a range of NHS specialisms I can assure you specialists may manage the meds they prescribe but no one ever 'carefully manages' the whole cocktail or clusterfuck of pills they are on apart from the patient.

If you object to people feeding chemical laced breast-secretions to babies with some but limited medical guidance that's your call. I don't feel offended but I am definitely one of those people and definitely a woman.

It hasnt happened because men cannot breast feed.

Whats happened is a man has been pumped full of hormones, chemicals, steroids and goodness knows what other unnatural crap to the point that they begin to secrete an artificial liquid which bears no resemblance to breast milk. Which they then proceed to force upon a newborn baby.
It's beyond vile. That poor child.

Article by medical doctor about this. lascapigliata.com/2018/03/26/analysis-of-study-of-induced-lactation-in-trans-identified-man/

Various issues with this, off the top of my head:

1. Where's the equivalent support for new mothers who want to breastfeed and have problems?
2. Ethically, how are the HCPs assisting with this induced lactation squaring what they're doing with their duty of care to the baby, given the lack of research in this area?
3. Why aren't the baby's needs first in all of this, for all concerned?
4. Who's checking that the baby's mother is happy with her male partner taking over this female function? Has she willingly agreed, was she fully informed how it might affect her own efforts to establish breastfeeding (badly, I'd have thought), in cases where she said 'I don't want to try to feed the baby, I'm fine with you doing it' was she saying that to make her partner feel good or because she genuinely didn't want to?
5. How many cases have there actually been? The picture doing the rounds on Twitter at the moment - is that new, or is it from a few years back from the case written up in the so called scholarly journal (a very low impact one, I believe)? Is it a different case from the one in this blog post? www.thestranger.com/queer-issue-2017/2017/06/21/25225867/my-first-time-breastfeeding-my-daughter

@HermioneKipper no of course not, I was replying to a female poster who wouldn’t need anything other than domperidone.

100% agree

Can you imagine any other situation where it would be acceptable to force a newborn baby to suck an adult male's nipples?

Yeah I mean this is going down a bloody dangerous path.

Imagine being so fucking selfish and self centred that you would force your newborn baby to consume your drug filled, non nutritious nipple discharge just so you could fulfill a fantasy and get your validation and euphoria.

Exactly, and that is the difference between these TW and women. Most women put their babies first.

@LilacPoppy I doubt you were on a cocktail of cross sex hormones as well?

@Isaidnoalready I was given domperidone as my disability affects my milk supply. So it is an option but I had to research and ask myself.

Oh for gods sake you’ve clearly got some issue with the fact you used meds while breastfeeding @PenelopePipPip

I clearly don’t mean women who are on carefully managed meds.

A TW is on a cocktail of cross sex hormones which would almost certainly pass into the “milk.” And apparently they only produce about a teaspoon of secretion which certainly isn’t enough to nourish a baby. They’re doing it for entirely their own benefit and not that of the child

Wow. Enlightening. I had no idea a trans could breastfeed. I'm not keen on the idea. I like to think of it as a woman only thing post giving birth.

Respondents reported two specific protocols, however there is no data to demonstrate efficacy or safety of either protocol.

Why isn't this the first thing to study? Surely efficacy and safety are the main points.

Another case study.

academic.oup.com/jcem/article/106/5/e2047/6123860?login=true

I am not saying it is healthy for anyone. I was just responding to the comment that it wasn't possible.

I worked as a nurse in Canada and we gave domperidone to mothers who weren't producing enough milk. It was an available treatment for them as well.

Experimenting on children is fine.

Give them man milk.
Give them naked man pantomime.
Give them drugs to stop puberty.
Give them drugs to start puberty.
Give them surgery.

Let the children have what these men with no agenda at all want them to have.

Imagine being so fucking selfish and self centred that you would force your newborn baby to consume your drug filled, non nutritious nipple discharge just so you could fulfill a fantasy and get your validation and euphoria.

The only one that matters is the baby. Anyone playing along with this is an utter disgrace.

Can you imagine any other situation where it would be acceptable to force a newborn baby to suck an adult male's nipples?

Now adult males with special lady feelings are exempt from any and all child safeguarding yet we are the bad ones for pointing out the fucking obvious?

Exactly what I thought. If this is safe and good for babies, get all the men on it immediately.

@HermioneKipper you couldn't take cold/flu medicine assuming you mean decongestants not because they are dangerous to the baby but because they are incompatible with breastfeeding - they dry up secretions whether that is mucus in the nose or milk in the breast. By contrast I was prescribed a number of pretty nasty disease modifying drugs, chemo drugs and various other things to suppress my immune system whilst breastfeeding my babies because even if tehy did cross into my milk my babies would be at more advantage getting my milk than they would from the low level of exposure.

It isn't helpful for breastfeeding women to perpetuate the idea that breastfeeding is incompatible with longterm medication use, in many cases the advantages to mother and baby outweigh the small risks even when considering drugs which are known to be contraindicated in pregnancy itself. Women always need to make decisions in conjunction with their doctor. But breastmilk isn't a sacred fluid that must be unsullied.

Just another way of the menz appropriating womanhood.

Fuck what the long term impact is on the baby, as long as the adult is validated that’s all that matters. Anything else is pure literal actual violence.

I’m so fucking tired of this shit.

Why was my comment deleted?? FFS. Because I said it was a f*tish?

I breastfed all my children and couldn’t even take cold/flu medicine as it isn’t considered safe! Ridiculous. That poor baby. God knows what it’s drinking

what the fuck is in that “milk”?

Having had a quick look, there doesn't seem to be any studies at all about the infant's well being at all. The two main studies in this area seem to be -

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5779241/ (initial study by T Reisman which states some worrying side effects on the person taking one of the drugs in the protocol)

internationalbreastfeedingjournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13006-020-00308-6 (this includes a case of a 55 year old transwoman who induced lactation with no intention of feeding an infant).

Reisman also says this in a Guardian article -

'However, Reisman said the case has also attracted questions about whether men could now breastfeed. “That, implicitly, is saying that you see transgender women as cisgender men, which is transphobic,” she said.'

www.theguardian.com/science/2018/feb/14/transgender-woman-breastfeed-health

I'll refrain from commenting on that one.

But we know men can lactate. There are lots of cases reported of galactorrhea - whether this is a good way to nurture babies is a moot point although historically it has probably happened, alongside widespread wet nursing.

Male breast tissue isn't structurally different to female breast tissue they just have less of it. If you stimulate the production of breast tissue with female reproductive hormones and then give biological males prolactin too they can lactate -its not a freaky dangerous fluid. The hormones in it are the same as those biological women will have after giving birth.

I am a little sensitive on this as a biological woman who breastfed three children whilst taking loads of medication. None of this, like most medications, had been shown to be safe during breastfeeding and all of them were known to have teratogenic potential in pregnancy. We could redefine my breastmilk as 'drug-induced secretions' if you like but the medical opinion was that the benefits of my milk still outweighed the disadvantages for my children.

The newborn is only being 'experimented' on to the same extent as all babies who receive breastmilk from parents who have to take medication whilst breastfeeding which cannot be tested for safety. But in this case we can have good reasons to believe exposure is likely not to be dangerous and effects will be reversible - babies flooded with maternal oestrogen from birth typically show secondary sexual characteristics like breast development for the first few days of life which reverse as hormones stabilise