Page 2 | The continuing erasure of women - Afghanistan

DomesticatedZombie · 2022-05-07T21:48:09+00:00

'...the Ministry for the Prevention of Vice and Promotion of Virtue announced that all women would have to cover their face in public, and laid out an escalating set of punishments for anyone refusing to comply.' Solidarity with the women of Afghanistan. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-61363969

Original poster

DomesticatedZombie · 08/05/2022 10:35

Fishwishy · 08/05/2022 09:18

It's heartbreaking but this section of Mumsnet was all ready to allign themselves with groups like this with access to single sex toilets last week. I said last week we needed to be careful alligning ourselves with advocates of requiring fave covering or veil and here we are.

Eh?

Feminists are 'aligned with the Taliban' now, are we?

Fantastic. Pals with Vlad, funded by the American Xtian Right and now the Taliban! We're just missing a Christmas card from Kim Jong-il and maybe a secret handshake from the Westboro Baptist Church, and I think MN feminists will be the most-befriended group of middle aged women in the world. Amazing. We could practically run the UN.

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RufustheFloralmissingreindeer · 08/05/2022 10:34

MrsOvertonsWindow · 08/05/2022 10:04

Oh Rufus, I had to read that several times.... I need a coffee.

Oh it’s horrible when that happens, apologies ☕️

we so need an official sarcasm emoji 😒

Original poster

DomesticatedZombie · 08/05/2022 10:32

aweegc · 07/05/2022 23:43

BBC R4 managed to report it as burka earlier today and then "women have to veil" multiple times throughout the day, with "face veil" also used (I've been ill in bed all day with the radio on all day). I don't know who writes the news but "veil" and "face veil" (hijab and niqab) are not the same as burqa.

It seemed like someone didn't know the first thing about Muslim attire (not hard to find out) or they were trying to soften it somehow. And my ill brain could not twist itself around why.

the BBC article had a visual aid with all different types of veil/face covering shown and named. Frankly, I don't think the finer details matter too much - the issue is whether this is a freely made choice or whether it's compelled.

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Whatwouldscullydo · 08/05/2022 10:17

It just never ends does it. Always soke other way to opress or excuse the assault ir murder if women . What are these men so afraid of if women go to a park ffs

Fucks sake.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 08/05/2022 10:04

Oh Rufus, I had to read that several times.... I need a coffee.

RufustheFloralmissingreindeer · 08/05/2022 09:55

mrsoverton

women having singles sex toilets for over a century and wishing to retain that single sex right laid down in the law of their country are EXACTLY like the taliban

MrsOvertonsWindow · 08/05/2022 09:50

Fishwishy · 08/05/2022 09:18

It's heartbreaking but this section of Mumsnet was all ready to allign themselves with groups like this with access to single sex toilets last week. I said last week we needed to be careful alligning ourselves with advocates of requiring fave covering or veil and here we are.

Please provide evidence showing where women on here were aligning themselves with the Taliban?

Or are you suggesting that feminists should start discriminating against Muslim women because we have different perspectives on face coverings etc?

Fishwishy · 08/05/2022 09:18

It's heartbreaking but this section of Mumsnet was all ready to allign themselves with groups like this with access to single sex toilets last week. I said last week we needed to be careful alligning ourselves with advocates of requiring fave covering or veil and here we are.

sashagabadon · 08/05/2022 09:15

It’s in situations like this you can really see the absurdity and ridiculousness of using “identify” as a woman rather than you just are one. It gives an impression that you have chosen to be female and could presumably choose not to be too. That you hold sone responsibility for the situation you find yourself in.
Why don’t Afghan women just not identify as women? Oh yes they can’t 😡

NotTerfNorCis · 08/05/2022 09:10

This 'identify as a woman' seems to be a tic of speech now. A woman in Afghanistan who identifies as a man (and it does happen, although not necessarily because they believe they are male) will have a hard time as she tries to disguise her femaleness. A man who identifies as a woman likewise wouldn't be accepted as the opposite sex and would be running a terrible risk.

TeamSukhareva · 08/05/2022 06:42

A charity that is providing education for girls in Afghanistan is PenPath.
The following news organisations are still operating:
TOLO news
AzadiRadio
Etilaatroz

You can find them on the blue bird. If you cannot read Persian, the "translate" button actually does it well enough.

NotAGirl · 08/05/2022 00:02

Heartbreaking its so hard to know what we can do

nepeta · 07/05/2022 23:56

DomesticatedZombie · 07/05/2022 23:34

Thanks, nepeta. Would appreciate it if you're able to share. It looks from a quick look about that some organisations may be starting to work in Afghanistan again.

I will let you know if I get strong recommendations.

aweegc · 07/05/2022 23:43

BBC R4 managed to report it as burka earlier today and then "women have to veil" multiple times throughout the day, with "face veil" also used (I've been ill in bed all day with the radio on all day). I don't know who writes the news but "veil" and "face veil" (hijab and niqab) are not the same as burqa.

It seemed like someone didn't know the first thing about Muslim attire (not hard to find out) or they were trying to soften it somehow. And my ill brain could not twist itself around why.

FemaleAndLearning · 07/05/2022 23:38

Awful treatment of women and girls.

Original poster

DomesticatedZombie · 07/05/2022 23:36

lindanorgrovefoundation.org/blog/trying-harder-overcome-obstacles/

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Original poster

DomesticatedZombie · 07/05/2022 23:34

Thanks, nepeta. Would appreciate it if you're able to share. It looks from a quick look about that some organisations may be starting to work in Afghanistan again.

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nepeta · 07/05/2022 23:32

BewareTheBeardedDragon · 07/05/2022 23:11

Afghanistan is currently one of the most difficult countries in the world in which to identify as a woman
Yeah - like they can just identify out of it 🤬
Awful.

That must have been written by some faux-woke very young person. It's incredibly insulting and tone-deaf as the treatment of women and girls in Afghanistan has zero to do with some weird belief in floating abstract gender fairies inside our heads.

nepeta · 07/05/2022 23:22

DomesticatedZombie · 07/05/2022 23:05

Are there any, nepeta? I had the impression all NGOs etc would have withdrawn?

I am trying to find out from my Afghani contacts who are, however, out of that country. But one of them may know more about indigenous women's groups and how to help them.

nepeta · 07/05/2022 23:21

The Taliban's interpretation of Islam is extremely misogynistic and leaves women and girls with very few rights. Indeed, adulthood doesn't happen to women who will always have to have a male guardian (mahram).

So if a woman violates the rule to cover her face in public, it is her guardian who will be first told off, then perhaps fined on a second violation, then sent to prison for three days on the third etc.

RufustheFloralmissingreindeer · 07/05/2022 23:20

'Afghanistan is currently one of the most difficult countries in the world in which to identify as a woman

its a fucking joke

Original poster

DomesticatedZombie · 07/05/2022 23:20

Exactly, Beware. It's so head-pattingly crass, smug, and insensitive.

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BewareTheBeardedDragon · 07/05/2022 23:11

Afghanistan is currently one of the most difficult countries in the world in which to identify as a woman
Yeah - like they can just identify out of it 🤬
Awful.

WTF475878237NC · 07/05/2022 23:08

I couldn't believe this has happened the same week as the leaked document from America. Men making decisions about the bodily autonomy of women and over turning previous freedoms is happening across the world. It's awful.

tabbycatstripy · 07/05/2022 23:08

Unsurprising, devastating.