Just had the labour candidate at my door

That is a good list.

I've posted this list on other threads, so apologies if you're bored by it, but here is why I won't vote Labour:

I'm going to illustrate all the many reasons why I, a former Labour member, will not be voting for them:

Their support of misogynist troll Lily Madigan as "women's officer" and other such characters

Their abuse of all women shortlists to allow males to stand as "women"

MPs joining secret Facebook groups set up to doxx gender critical women, get them suspended from the party and get them sacked, keeping Stasi like lists in breach of Data Protection law

Suspending gender critical women in disciplinary proceedings worthy of O'Brien and Winston Smith

Key MPs signing a pledge to persecute gender critical feminists within the Labour Party

Key MPs saying that they believed MTF transgender sex criminals had the right to go into women's prison

A leader and numerous MPs who can't bring themselves to define the word woman in any coherent way and make themselves and the party a laughing stock

A party that turns a blind eye to the horrific online abuse of gender critical female MP Rosie Duffield, egged on by left wing commentators on social media

A hugely misogynistic culture overall, with a history of telling women their rights can wait until more important things have been achieved.

I've probably forgotten some, but hopefully that gives an idea of why many women will be making the only protest they can, by not voting for them.

I realise we’re all having to make an absolutely shit decision and that we don’t all agree on the best outcome, nevertheless I find it quite bizarre to see women being harangued on a feminist board because we won’t vote for a party that plans to reduce our legal rights.

@alreadytaken

@montyspython If you were presented with the choice of walking through a pile of horse shit and one of dog shit would you choose one or just say no, I dont have to choose I'll walk away. We have a rubbish electoral system because it is legitimised by people voting. Time to join those who say this is not what I want

While I completely agree our electoral system is ridiculous, it is in need of a full reform (scrap it and start again )

But my question was for people refusing to vote for labour based on them "not knowing what a woman is" when under our current government changes are being made to the detriment of women, and women services, I'm not sure how that is better.

Sadly there is not enough of a movement to make not voting a valid way of changing how our country is run, it is your right to opt out of voting, but it will not currently help reform our electoral system.

Can only speak for myself but I know when I was younger I would have been a lot quicker to rush to judgement over someone telling me who they were voting for. Got older, met a wider range of people, started seeing grey and not black and white and while I may disagree with someone I would now be far more interested in why they think a certain way and where there is commonality. I may disagree with Tory voters on many, many issues but if there are areas we can agree eg women's rights, then brilliant, will work together on that if nothing else.

More of a shock has been realising that while my natural home and inclination is pretty far left, 'my side' has been appalling on this issue. Not across the board as there are plenty who would support my views and are driving campaigns forward. But from the very vocal the level of derision, no debate attitude and abuse has been an eye opener. Patting themselves on the back and utterly unaware that they display the same misogyny that has always existed, just in some shiny new woke clothes.

Gosh I do.

On any thread derision towards women caring about women’s rights, or on threads where two posters post a lot and are subject to a fair amount.

I usually avoid those threads

I don't see any surfeit of 'derision and anger' from Labour supporters. perhaps there are some gloating Tories though.

I see a lot of pain and sadness from old time Labour supporters that their party has betrayed them and that so many seem to be flocking to the party that has traditionally fucked over women and especially poor women as a result. But then some of us have been feminists for a long time, are also working class or grew up that way, remember Thatcher and are not single-issue voters.

I don’t see that at all. So much derision and anger from Labour supporters.

it’s off putting

Yes, we were agreeing with you! Sorry if that wasn’t clear.

@EmpressaurusWitchDoesntBurn @AnnieLou12 the post i quoted when I said "national issues" was saying that we should only concern ourselves with the NHS, welfare etc. which are national issues. I'm completely in agreement with you that sex & gender policies are relevant to the work of local authorities.

@montyspython If you were presented with the choice of walking through a pile of horse shit and one of dog shit would you choose one or just say no, I dont have to choose I'll walk away. We have a rubbish electoral system because it is legitimised by people voting. Time to join those who say this is not what I want.

@PurgatoryOfPotholes My generation were taught to listen and discuss politely so that you could try to change the other persons view - or maybe they would change yours. You dont change someone's views by insulting them, something the young would do well to learn. The bigots are those who refuse to listen.

@MarshaBradyo Mud slinging has always started with the stories.

I can believe it too given the tone of much on here from Labour supporters - derision and getting angry at how people vote.

I don't understand why so many people have doubted the OP.

It's a generational issue, if you like. Gordon Brown clearly sometimes thought that people he doorstepped were bigots, but he thought his duty to pragmatically attempt to gain votes for Labour outweighed his duty to stand up for what he believed. So he nodded and smiled, and then said what he really thought when she was out of earshot. Shame for him that the journalists recording weren't out of earshot.

This generation (which is also mine, to be clear) has internalised the value that it's our duty to stand up for what we believe, however inconvenient, and that you're always obliged to register your moral opposition to anything you perceive as bigotry. So if a householder says something that the canvasser perceives as bigoted, they're going to say something to that effect, and Labour's election prospects be damned.

I’ve also been doorknocking for Labour in the past and 100% can see this interaction happening. One election I had to stop an enthusiastic new canvasser from talking to anyone after he told a resident thinking of voting Tory that they were uncaring and clearly hated their own children.

Lots of people in Labour see their political positions as moral and disagreement as immoral. It causes all sorts of issues when talking to voters.

Well yes, exactly. It couldn't be easier for the Labour Party to secure my vote again - all they have to do is pledge to uphold women's current legal rights. It's their call.

Whilst watching porn openly in the House of Commons!

Do you go into other threads here (generally not just fwr) and tell people not to believe everything they read on the internet?
Do you do this on any other site?
Cos we ain't five years old now, we can decide for ourselves if its maybe real, maybe exaggerated, maybe a flat lie.
And honestly it matters not if it's real or "fake news" labour positively are going to decimate womens few rights as soon as they step foot in power. On that alone I will not vote for them.

the tweets are about Surrey PCC Lisa Townsend who was subject to complaints from Crispin Blunt because she liked a gender critical tweet. She subsequently refused to apologise for her GC views. Plus an undignified pop at Nadine Dorries.

Whilst I don't believe the OPs version of the events, I do understand a lot of people not wanting to vote labour due to them "not accepting what a women is"

But how does that sit with us currently being under a Tory government who are showing you they don't respect your space, under them, we are having our spaces invaded, funding for women's support being slashed. Surely they are actually in power, making these decisions and showing you their contempt.

You dont necessarily have to believe an OP to respond - you may decide to give them the benefit of the doubt and offer advice anyway or you may decide they are without doubt a teenage troll but still feel there is something you wish to say whether to the troll or anyone else reading.

The idea that people must believe a poster because they have replied is naive.

I think it’s interesting how powerful that is for a stand alone statement on an anonymous forum that can be neither proved nor disproved and no one seems remotely bothered by that.

It's simply the reality of anonymous forums. Choose to participate, or don't.

'The Ashton-under-Lyne MP described the Tories as “a bunch of scum, homophobic, racist, misogynistic”, the Daily Mirror reported.'

Why? Angela Rayner calls Tories 'scum'

www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/angela-rayner-tories-scum-apology-b957307.html

Another member and door knocker, though I am currently on strike due to this issue. I haven’t been on the doorsteps for this campaign so I don’t know if it has been raised. But I get the canvassing emails and the guidance on how to approach certain issues and there is no guidance at all.

In the circs this sort of reaction wouldn’t surprise me. A well organised campaign will have dozens if not hundreds of canvassers across a large borough. Some will be old stagers who know that you never have a row on the doorstep whatever their personal views. Some will be less experienced and if they are TRA and also have no talking points they may well react in that way. Let’s face it a big problem with Labour activists is that they are all too willing to say “fuck off and join the Tories” at the best of times.

@MidCenturyClegs You should name and shame him. It's the right thing to do.