Boris or bust?

@londresstrutt irony a liar who says he knows what a woman is. Talk about gullible. More like conservative supporters just trying to stir things up.

This whole thread is just playing into the hands of people like that idiot Ann Coates on Twitter who posts a thread every day about how awful and genocidal we all are.

Why are you trying to silence women?

Politicians of all stripes have been proven corrupt, venal, abusive and sexually incontinent since Parliament has existed.

Politics requires even the good ones to lie.

Every vote for the Tories is a vote for a party happy to keep on an MP who would pimp out your daughters to rich white men. (see Jamie Wallis).
Vote Tory - they may be lying, corrupt, self-serving, racist, misogynist pigs but they KNOW what women are for.

BJ is no friend of women, despite what he recently said. The austerity policies that have left millions in poverty have disproportionately affected women. He has no interest in protecting women and will just do what is best for his career. In his personal life, he also seems like a giant misogynist so no thank you.

This.

The determination of labour to promote lies as facts calls into question their intellectual / moral ability to stand up to other challenges. When they speak crap about not saying women have cervixes, rapists must be in cells with women and have spent years enabling the bullying of labour women, how the hell can they challenge climate change, Putin, organised crime, corruption, VAWG and all the other problems we face?

Hannah Arendt nailed it:
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists .

In a choice between self-interested liars and inflexible ideologues the liars are better.

Absolutely, I'd take a liar who knows that a woman is an adult human female over the alternative every time.

This whole thread is just playing into the hands of people like that idiot Ann Coates on Twitter who posts a thread every day about how awful and genocidal we all are.

BJ is no friend of women, despite what he recently said. The austerity policies that have left millions in poverty have disproportionately affected women. He has no interest in protecting women and will just do what is best for his career. In his personal life, he also seems like a giant misogynist so no thank you.

To me this slow move towards eroding women’s rights and denial of biology has more a weathervane feel in that it’s a blatant untruth stated because politicians feel they should. Whether they believe in that lie or not.

It’s all very well wanting politicians with deeply held principles as long as those principles align with yours. What if they don’t? Give me pragmatism and “reading the room” over ideology in a politician any day.
I am not a fan of “deeply held principles” generally as I think they make you blind to alternative viewpoints and changing situations and are a sign of lightweight thinking.

The trouble is that Johnson has got rid of anyone even a little bit moderate/sensible (Clarke/Stewart) and surrounded himself with incompetent morons who don't know where Dover is and don't know how Channel 4 is funded while wanting to destroy it.
And while he may talk the talk on women's rights... remember this is the guy who said that prosecuting historic sex abuse was 'spaffing money up the wall'
He's been sacked twice for lying.

[quote Alcoh]@beguilingeyes Boris never wanted those rules. He never believed in them. He wanted a more liberal way but the pile on at the time was mental. So if anything he should have had more backbone then and not been so draconian. But isn’t hindsight a wonderful thing. I remember the shrill calls for schools to be closed immediately and that lockdown happened too late. It was deafening.[/quote]
Yes. I agree with this. Boris is seemingly a weather vane that blows wherever majority public opinion seems to be going. I'd be hard pressed to say at this point what his own deeply held convictions are about anything - if he even has any?

Many of the rules were unworkable and illogical (fined for sitting on park benches?), he knew they were illogical as did many MPs, which is in part why some broke them. That and of course the tendency for people in power to believe they sit above the electorate they serve.

There is an argument to be had that weathervanes are exactly what MPs should be - they do work for us, the public, after all. As a country we seem to like principled politicians though, except we can't seem to reach a consensus on what those principles should be!

I hate Johnson too LK so I'll answer. He's a lazy, lying, immoral, corrupt piece of shit. He cares about money, shagging and being accepted by posh rich people. Full stop. He is careless with real women's lives.

He is such a liar. I don't trust a word out of his mouth, even though I wholeheartedly agree with his statement on biology etc. He says whatever will make him popular. Until they make a legally binding law and enforce it, it is just hot air.

I would never vote Tory, but I can't bring myself to vote for Labour at the moment and not just on the self id issue.

Haven’t decided yet. I think Boris is working very hard to convince the media that it the choice is him or unpopular Labour policies. But the vote-winning combination would be Conservative policies with a different leader and a different Cabinet.

I won’t vote for any party that is going to being in self ID for transwomen. I don’t think I can vote for Boris either: I don’t just dislike him, I hate him. So I live in hope that either the Conservatives can produce a new leader before the next election ir Labour changes its more extreme policies. Otherwise I guess I’ll be voting for some random independent candidate.

I thought about this, this morning with the government's extremely expensive horrific new immigration plans.

Taking male illegal immigrants out of the country helps maintain the safety of women and girls.

It’s Orwellian and scary what’s coming from politicians’ mouth. What a state.

I just hear major Labour figures sounding unhinged and comical on this issue, it's entirely tone-deaf but is not changing.

To me, that is scary, as it feels that in democracy politicians tend to not sound unhinged, unless they are on the extremes.

That is a sign of ideological capture of the party, and it is dangerous. I have no idea what kind of niche ideology they may be captured by next, how can I vote Labour?

In a choice between self-interested liars and inflexible ideologues the liars are better. Not a great choice, but I fear inflexibility in the face of evidence, especially in power.

I've taken the decision that I can't vote in any way that supports this government. I get why people are single issue voters on this but I'm not. Having said that, I don't think there will be a Labour or coalition nect time, probably the time after that.

I think we've come a long way on this issue, in fact, and for me in the right direction. The Cass review has been a game changer. And having the sport issue put in the open.