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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

To wonder why an MP is lying about womens bathrooms?

709 replies

TeaKlaxon · 28/03/2022 09:33

Lucy Allen has tweeted that the Barbican has mens bathrooms and gender neutral bathrooms, but no womens bathrooms.

Lots of twitter users told her that was wrong.

The Barbican itself told her it's wrong.

But the tweet remains. AIBU to think that if an MP gets something wrong, they should apologise and remove the lie? Or to think that this is deliberate misinformation to further the myth of women being 'erased'?

twitter.com/lucyallan/status/1507076111871713282?s=20&t=D_TGgQBlnKkKZ6NEIjnzsw

OP posts:
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Helleofabore · 29/03/2022 11:54

It seems a big issue for you and now you’re but what about poverty blah blah blah. You seem very confused.

Theluggage15

It is called a swivel or a pivot.

It also is a very widely used technique of extremist activists. Often it is used to hide the cognitive distortions they use to silence others.

TeaKlaxon · 29/03/2022 11:53

@Helleofabore

You guys have been played. And it is poor women, queer women, disabled women and women of colour in particular who will pay the price.

This is another extreme activist tactic.

Trust me there are poor women, queer women, disabled women and women of colour who want to retain their single sex toilets and are concerned by the conversion of toilets into mixed sex. Please include 'women with religious requirements' there too. Or are they not worthy.

It is the tactic to paint women who disagree with changing toilets into mixed sex only as middle class, white, middle aged women. And it fails whenever anyone starts to point out evidence and starts to unravel that tired old trope.

Thanks for trying it though OP. This live demonstration of the tactics used by extreme activists to silence others is going very well.

If I were taking a leaf out of the gender critical book I might even call some people traitors but that is abhorrent language so I won’t.

You don't even see your own hypocrisy do you? YOU have used abhorrent language towards women on this very thread. It is there in all its glory for readers to see.

If you think calling a crank a crank is equivalent to calling someone a traitor then crack on. I disagree.
OP posts:
Helleofabore · 29/03/2022 11:51

Just to be clear, the tweet we are talking about is this one;

I received this message today: “I was at the Barbican yesterday where there were male toilets, disabled toilets, and gender neutral toilets. I asked where were the female toilets as I am not gender neutral I am a woman and they laughed in my face. Women are being erased.”

Because there is a whole lot of sparpling going on that is trying to distract readers that OP misrepresented this tweet and has been abusing the two women involved.

While denouncing anyone who disagrees with OP with name calling and, well, lies. I am not 'right wing' but it matters nought in any case. Just pointing out the discrepancies and the inconsistencies from OP.

girlmom21 · 29/03/2022 11:51

Can I just clarify, when I said this: You can know what a woman is and want women to have safe spaces and still vote Labour. I don't mean you should still vote Labour - because they don't actually care about women. But you can vote for them without becoming a complete imbecile.

VestofAbsurdity · 29/03/2022 11:49

As opposed to Lucy Allen - proven liar - says it happened so it is a ‘fact’ that it did?

Show me using the exact words Lucy Allen used that says she is stating that this is a fact, that it did happen and that there are no women only toilets at the Barbican.

girlmom21 · 29/03/2022 11:48

I’m sure two female PMs will be a comfort to the women who are trying to figure out how to get through months and months waiting for adequate SEN support for their kids due to decimated local authority budgets. And for the women who are enduring the indignity of going to a food bank.

Keep waving the flag for the Tories folk.

Do you understand the economy is affecting men too?

Do you also understand you're allowed to support Labour while not agreeing with everything they say?

You can know what a woman is and want women to have safe spaces and still vote Labour. You don't have to support everything they stand for.

Helleofabore · 29/03/2022 11:48

Every single person cosying up to the Tories because they are pissed there’s now one GN toilet in the Barbican bears some responsibility for the massive inequality that disproportionately affects women and that continues to be driven by a right wing agenda.

Hey... look... another squirrel! And it has acorns!

I’m sure two female PMs will be a comfort to the women who are trying to figure out how to get through months and months waiting for adequate SEN support for their kids due to decimated local authority budgets. And for the women who are enduring the indignity of going to a food bank.

And more sparple. The guilt tactic continues.

You also missed the part where many women, some on this very thread, will be those people. Or have been those very people. Or work very hard to support those issues.

Keep waving the flag for the Tories folk. They’ve got you covered where it really matters - a toilet exactly where you want it in the Barbican. The key issue of our time.

Look... that squirrel is back again.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 29/03/2022 11:48

Just a lot of fevered Twitter/Reddit bluster. It's not convincing anyone.

I'm not interested what this poster does or doesn't believe. People will make their own minds up.

Hoppinggreen · 29/03/2022 11:48

@girlmom21

Like actual problems. Like not being able to put food on the table. Like being far more likely than men to be in precarious employment. To lack the protection of a union. To be dependent on food banks.

Can I just add, I've been fortunate and never been in any of these situations.
My brothers have.

I have, however, been on the receiving end of sexual assault and harassment.
My brothers haven't.

Women are all different. We have different levels of income and face different challenges However, whatever your status, if you are using food banks or shopping at Waitrose on a daily basis you are equally likely to be hassled threatened or assaulted by a man. As a sex we are in more danger from men than other men are so what other challenges women may face are irrelevant here. I consider being in danger from men an “actual problem” and one that is made worse by not having sexually segregated spaces easily available for us to use if we choose.
Theluggage15 · 29/03/2022 11:48

Yes, women’s rights are a key issue for me, will never vote for someone who says a woman can have a penis. Why are you so desperate for males to have access to female only spaces? It seems a big issue for you and now you’re but what about poverty blah blah blah. You seem very confused.

AlisonDonut · 29/03/2022 11:47

You guys have been played. And it is poor women, queer women, disabled women and women of colour in particular who will pay the price.

The ones that have been 'played' are the ones who now believe that it is possible to even 'be' Gender Neutral' or 'Non Binary' or that trans people have actually changed sex.

Almost everyone on the planet is non fucking binary and nobody has ever changed their sex. Gender Ideology is all 'nonsense on stilts' as I think the saying goes.

VestofAbsurdity · 29/03/2022 11:45

And it is poor women, queer women, disabled women and women of colour in particular who will pay the price.

All the above plus strictly religious women and traumatised women will and are paying the price of Gender Ideology.

Helleofabore · 29/03/2022 11:44

You guys have been played. And it is poor women, queer women, disabled women and women of colour in particular who will pay the price.

This is another extreme activist tactic.

Trust me there are poor women, queer women, disabled women and women of colour who want to retain their single sex toilets and are concerned by the conversion of toilets into mixed sex. Please include 'women with religious requirements' there too. Or are they not worthy.

It is the tactic to paint women who disagree with changing toilets into mixed sex only as middle class, white, middle aged women. And it fails whenever anyone starts to point out evidence and starts to unravel that tired old trope.

Thanks for trying it though OP. This live demonstration of the tactics used by extreme activists to silence others is going very well.

If I were taking a leaf out of the gender critical book I might even call some people traitors but that is abhorrent language so I won’t.

You don't even see your own hypocrisy do you? YOU have used abhorrent language towards women on this very thread. It is there in all its glory for readers to see.

TeaKlaxon · 29/03/2022 11:43

@VestofAbsurdity

I don’t believe the staff did laugh. Or at least I don’t believe they laughed just because someone asked where the women’s toilets were.

You don't believe and therefore everyone has to accept your version of events, you have zero evidence to back up your belief but hey-ho TeaKlaxon says it's not true and therefore it can't be.

As opposed to Lucy Allen - proven liar - says it happened so it is a ‘fact’ that it did?
OP posts:
TeaKlaxon · 29/03/2022 11:43

@Helleofabore

Like actual problems. Like not being able to put food on the table. Like being far more likely than men to be in precarious employment. To lack the protection of a union. To be dependent on food banks.

Yep. been there. I find it very offensive that a poster weaponises this to silence women (and men) who don't agree with their views.

But, then after the ableist speak and calling the woman who wrote to her MP an idiot, yesterday then trying to make out that the woman was wrong in choosing to escalate the issue to the MP, and then trying to make out that the woman was making the complaint to the 'wrong' MP... I am not surprised.

I don’t care if you find it offensive or not.

Every single person cosying up to the Tories because they are pissed there’s now one GN toilet in the Barbican bears some responsibility for the massive inequality that disproportionately affects women and that continues to be driven by a right wing agenda.

I’m sure two female PMs will be a comfort to the women who are trying to figure out how to get through months and months waiting for adequate SEN support for their kids due to decimated local authority budgets. And for the women who are enduring the indignity of going to a food bank.

Keep waving the flag for the Tories folk. They’ve got you covered where it really matters - a toilet exactly where you want it in the Barbican. The key issue of our time.

OP posts:
VestofAbsurdity · 29/03/2022 11:42

I don’t believe the staff did laugh. Or at least I don’t believe they laughed just because someone asked where the women’s toilets were.

You don't believe and therefore everyone has to accept your version of events, you have zero evidence to back up your belief but hey-ho TeaKlaxon says it's not true and therefore it can't be.

TeaKlaxon · 29/03/2022 11:38

[quote Franca123]@TeaKlaxon if it were a man who had tweeted this, would you believe it?[/quote]
As in a male Tory MP?

No.

OP posts:
Helleofabore · 29/03/2022 11:36

Or at least I don’t believe they laughed just because someone asked where the women’s toilets were.

So, you admit that you have no idea whether the staff laughed. You'd like to think that they did not laugh, but you don't know. Yet you are calling women liars, idiots, cranks, not sane etc based on your belief that someone did not laugh.

What valid reason would any usher have to laugh at someone asking where the female toilets are?

TeaKlaxon · 29/03/2022 11:35

@Franca123

Pearl clutching. It's like men's rights activism bingo. Protecting the interest of women is not pearl clutching OP. Use an actual argument rather than trying to right me off as a human being.
You’re not protecting women.

You’re costing up to a political ideology that has done more harm and is a far bigger threat to the welfare of women than any man in a gender neutral toilet or any trans woman in a woman’s toilet.

You guys have been played. And it is poor women, queer women, disabled women and women of colour in particular who will pay the price.

If I were taking a leaf out of the gender critical book I might even call some people traitors but that is abhorrent language so I won’t.

OP posts:
Franca123 · 29/03/2022 11:34

@TeaKlaxon if it were a man who had tweeted this, would you believe it?

VestofAbsurdity · 29/03/2022 11:34

Did Lucy Allen specifically say that there were no women only toilets in the Barbican when she tweeted? @TeaKlaxon

Helleofabore · 29/03/2022 11:33

Like actual problems. Like not being able to put food on the table. Like being far more likely than men to be in precarious employment. To lack the protection of a union. To be dependent on food banks.

Yep. been there. I find it very offensive that a poster weaponises this to silence women (and men) who don't agree with their views.

But, then after the ableist speak and calling the woman who wrote to her MP an idiot, yesterday then trying to make out that the woman was wrong in choosing to escalate the issue to the MP, and then trying to make out that the woman was making the complaint to the 'wrong' MP... I am not surprised.

Franca123 · 29/03/2022 11:33

Must be a coincidence that Labour have only ever managed to choose a man despite not being able to recognise one

TeaKlaxon · 29/03/2022 11:33

@Enough4me

As in reported what she saw, through a tweet. This was based on a woman's experience. She had the freedom to see this and report on it. As a woman I want to know that staff at venues laugh at women looking for women's loos as this tells me their view on womens safety and dignity.

Do you think the staff were wrong to laugh?

I don’t believe the staff did laugh. Or at least I don’t believe they laughed just because someone asked where the women’s toilets were.
OP posts:
Franca123 · 29/03/2022 11:33

@BacklashBacklash Very good point!!! Grin