Boris has nailed colours to mast

Ok, so many of you have vehemently refused to vote for Tory for years and have stated that every other stance they have taken has been completely in opposition to your own principles and beliefs - you believe that their views/actions have been amoral (at best), cruel, unethical, corrupt etc. Pretty much everything else they have done has been repugnant to you and your sensibilities and you will never ever vote for them.

This one issue though, you agree with them. You are aligned in viewpoints with the party whose views and actions you otherwise find abhorrent…that doesn’t give you any pause for thought?

It’s okay. I’m not expecting anything other than straw man arguments and hyperbole in response. Just maybe hoping to plant a seed.

They fell for Labour Caused The Crash and the necessity of austerity.

They fell for Vote Labour Get SNP and Scottish independence (which now looks more likely than ever, thanks to Brexit).

They fell for Brexit.

And now they'll fall for the anti-woke culture war. From a government that gaily broke their own rules to enjoy convivial piss-ups while the rest of the country suffered one of the worst handlings of the pandemic in the entire world. While the ONS predicts on the back of Sunak's budget that we face the largest drop in real household income since the 1950s. While the processes, checks and balances of democracy itself are steadily disbanded to ensure one-party rule forever.

It's like watching somebody slowly torture themselves to death, explaining to them that they don't have to, and then watching them just carry on.

Pink News take: '"biological facts" is rhetoric used by anti-trans organisations that are trying to prevent trans people using the correct services for their gender in the guise of "single sex spaces".'

So the conflict couldn't be clearer.

So just done it
Written to the other three main parties in England about this (again).

'My point was about his denial of the importance of biological sex, he's clearly lying.'

I'm not defending him (in any way) but where did he deny this?

But this isn't what he means. He understands some people can gestate and give birth, but he thinks there is another group of women, some with penises, some who have had them removed, who can't gestate, but are nevertheless women.

I understand this. My point was about his denial of the importance of biological sex, he's clearly lying.

Another one resentfully politically homeless. Very disappointed in Keir.

'If KS could look me in the eye and tell me that when he and his wife decided to start a family they both pee'd on sticks and anxiously waited to see which one of them was going to gestate their child I'd have more respect for him.'

But this isn't what he means. He understands some people can gestate and give birth, but he thinks there is another group of women, some with penises, some who have had them removed, who can't gestate, but are nevertheless women.

(I don't get it either.)

I think he knows that only women have a cervix, but is not strong enough to actually say so. I don’t mean strength as in fisticuffs, I mean intellectual strength. Someone has told him that Guardian readers won’t forgive him if he tells the truth. I won’t vote for that sort of coward.

I wouldn't vote Labour even if I though KS did believe some of the things he says but he, like other Labour MP's, look really uncomfortable when they are asked about anything to do with biological sex. They know they are lying and they also know we know they are lying.

If KS could look me in the eye and tell me that when he and his wife decided to start a family they both pee'd on sticks and anxiously waited to see which one of them was going to gestate their child I'd have more respect for him.

'Someone has told him that Guardian readers won’t forgive him if he tells the truth. I won’t vote for that sort of coward.'

Where is the case for this? I'm not ruling it out, but why are people so keen to imagine that there are Guardian readers who really believe TWAW, but Starmer is obviously lying? Why can't he really believe it, if the Guardian readers do?

I think heknowsthat only women have a cervix, but is not strong enough to actually say so. I don’t mean strength as in fisticuffs, I mean intellectual strength. Someone has told him that Guardian readers won’t forgive him if he tells the truth. I won’t vote for that sort of coward.

This and a pp saying it. It's true, if Kier is too much of a coward to define a woman then he isn't fit to run this country. Running the country is about doing what is right now what is easy.

I'm also politically homeless.

Misogyny as a hate crime is a poisoned chalice if TWAW. Any woman disagreeing with TWAW will be legally guilty of a hate crime. There would be no recourse in law in the way that there is at the moment.

I’m desperately sad that I can’t vote Labour as I always have due to the wordy-salad-soup and batshit denial of biological reality. But that’s life.

Won’t be voting for Boris and this bunch of sociopathic numpties either — such a shame it has to be the Tories speaking sense on this issue, and I’m infinitely grateful they are, and still, even a stopped clock tells the right time twice a day.

Johnson didn’t do much for Nazanin Zaghari -Ratcliff coming out, did he?

I’ll go now! I just despair at the Tory corruption and Johnson 😡

I’ve been a member of the Labour Party all my life until recently, I’m as anti Tory as you can get, but if the only way to protect women and girls is to vote Conservative I’ll do it.

Don't worry about 'who to vote for when the time comes'. Go out and tell Labour you won't vote for them, in the hope that they see sense before that time.

I'm more worried about Labour then compiling a list of women with wrong think and moving against them to make them lose their jobs and criminalise genuine concerns.

Am I being paranoid? Watching Scotland I am not so sure.

Another reason I will vote conservative as freedom of speech is tolerated even if they don't agree with you.

Whereas Labour only allows freedom of speech if they agree with you.

Don't worry about 'who to vote for when the time comes'. Go out and tell Labour you won't vote for them, in the hope that they see sense before that time.

Good point.
I'm going to email the Greens, Labour and Lib Dems now on this.

And another thing - whatever you think of Boris, him coming out and saying this will give courage to Liz Truss, Kemi Badenoch, Jackie Doyle-Price and hopefully a few more to keep speaking out for women. They won't need to fear what has happened to Rosie Duffield.

What matters NOW is to tell Labour MPs that you will not vote for them, and you will actually vote Conservative, as long as Labour maintains its current position

I couldn’t do that with a straight face. I’d sooner eat my own liver than vote Conservative.

I haven't read the full thread but I think this is great because it gives a reason to talk to all MPs now. Voting (in a general election sense) won't happen for a while. But we can get the message out NOW to Labour, Libs Dems etc that there is now 'clear blue water' between them and the Tories on this. What matters NOW is to tell Labour MPs that you will not vote for them, and you will actually vote Conservative, as long as Labour maintains its current position.

Don't worry about 'who to vote for when the time comes'. Go out and tell Labour you won't vote for them, in the hope that they see sense before that time.

Oh lord this could be the thing that keeps them in isn’t it.