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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

AIBU? Trans friend....

609 replies

OrchardBlack · 21/03/2022 22:41

Have NC'd for this.

So a close friend of mine (female) and I booked tickets to an event in our town some time ago, due to take place in a few weeks. Both excited and looking forward to it , all good.

A few weeks ago she asks me if a male , straight friend of hers can also join, no problem, the more the merrier. I've never met him.

Except it now transpires that he has (quite suddenly from what I gather) said he is transitioning to be a woman and will use this night as his 'coming out'. He has messaged my friend saying that he's going to wear a sun dress and heels and he's nervous but excited too. He has also said we are to refer to him by his female name. My friend says he is currently in a relationship with a woman.

Now my friend is saying she is finding this all a lot to take on so suddenly as she's known him for many years as his male name and never even seen him with makeup on. I asked if he would be using the women's toilets on our night out, she doesn't know but I can only assume he is.

I feel very uncomfortable, as does my friend. I am fully supportive of people choosing to live how they wish, I just can't help feeling he's high-jacked our night. He isn't out as trans to any of his family etc so he has said no photos of the night etc. I'm also massively concerned that he is clearly still attracted to women and what this means for the safe spaces such as toilets etc.

She says she doesn't feel like she can talk to him about it and is concocting a plan to say she has covid and giving me my money back so we don't go. I'm dissapointed as I was looking forward to it.

AIBU to be deflated and a bit annoyed??

OP posts:
PinaColada123456 · 22/03/2022 04:20

@Nellle

Yes, that's literally what I said.

Sounds like OP (and OP's friend) will choose not be friends with this person based on their gender identity.

@Nellle Not based on their gender identity, but their absolute insensitivity, their thoughtlessness and selfishness.
Midlifemusings · 22/03/2022 04:18

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

PinaColada123456 · 22/03/2022 04:12

@Susu49

Um, yes I think yabu. Why can't you be happy for him?

Disclaimer: I'm aware I don't hold the same views as many in mumsnet.

@Susu49 The OP, nor her friend, are being unreasonable for not wanting their night out/trip away to be hijacked by a selfish and thoughtless man high on male privilege. HE is the one being unreasonable!!
PinaColada123456 · 22/03/2022 04:03

So once again, men spoil something for women, in this case, a nice trip you had planned. It's so unfair! Except it now transpires that he has (quite suddenly from what I gather) said he is transitioning to be a woman and will use this night as his 'coming out'.*
Men like this really have no sensitivity chip or self awareness, do they? They just muscle in and make it all about themselves, when he was graciously invited along to something he wasn't even originally apart of, it's very galling.

He has messaged my friend saying that he's going to wear a sun dress and heels
It's always all about the 'dress' and heels with them, isn't it? Always. Like they can't be a woman in jeans and a nice shirt or blouse. Hence why I don't buy that most of these trans women are genuine and to me they seem more interested in dress-ups and cross-dressing than actually being a woman.

My friend says he is currently in a relationship with a woman.
Woah! Does his partner know he is going away with 2 women? It's a wonder she hasn't asked to be invited, unless she doesn't even know about this. His selfishness knows no heights does it?

Why are these men so incredibly privileged and selfish that they HAVE to make everything about themselves? It's so very clearly a common denominator with these men - they never stop to think of anyone but themselves, they certainly never show any consideration or sensitivity to the 2 women here, they turned it all into about themselves. It seems to be a trans women trait. Think of no one but yourself.

I would be honest; because there really is no way out, he'll want to go even if your friend has covid, so he'll expect to go with you even if she can't go. Or he'll want to re-schedule. Seriously, there is no way around this, your friend will be simply putting off the inevitable. Have your friend be honest with him and say you are both uncomfortable with him using an offer to make it all about him, and you've both decided not to go, as you both are uncomfortable. It might mean the end of her friendship with him, but he clearly isn't much of a friend anyway, and this situation will continue to come up so your friend needs to probably exit the friendship with him. Because if he's this selfish, he will continue to make things difficult for your friend, especially when he learns she is uncomfortable with him using the womens toilets. It will have to come to a head sooner or later, I think she needs to make the decision now do a drift away from him.

Both of you go to the show on your own, no need to cancel, just be brutally honest and disinvite him, she can say you've both cancelled if she wants, but the two of you go anyway, he won't know. But, even doing that, she is eventually going to either have 'the' conversation with him, or stop seeing him. Eventually it will have to be dealt with head on.

Justilou1 · 22/03/2022 03:55

It’s a bit cringe derailling someone’s event to turn it into your own event… Like the bridesmaid announcing her pregnancy during her speech at the wedding reception. Time and a place.

WanderinWomb · 22/03/2022 03:22

Why is this not in AIBU @mumsnet ?

This guy is not "coming out " that night otherwise it wouldn't have to be a secret to his girlfriend and family. Something quite different is going on, and apart from anything else the secrecy will ruin your night. It's like being made party to an extra marital affair and being sworn to secrecy, it will ruin your enjoyment of the evening. Tell your freind you will certainly not keep any secrets from the girlfriend and see if the guy still wants to come.

CloseYourEyesAndSee · 22/03/2022 03:20

@ClaryFairchild

Of course someone dressed as a woman will be using the women's toilets. I don't like to but can you imagine the abuse they will have if they enter that men's toilets?!
Really?? Men should be allowed to abuse womens spaces because if they don't other men might abuse them??
Pinkbonbon · 22/03/2022 03:18

Why don't you just tell him that no, he cannot hijack your night out. That if he wants to come out of the closent then that great - but not on your time as this is a night out you and your mate had planned and you've no interest in making it all about him.

Don't cancel, just uninvite him.

WouldBeGood · 22/03/2022 03:15

It was the bit about not out and no photos that made me think that. Apologies if I’ve got that wrong

Marsmon · 22/03/2022 03:09

I might be missing something, but did they say they'd be deceiving their partner?? There's no indication that the partner isn't aware.

WouldBeGood · 22/03/2022 02:51

I also wouldn’t want to be a part of someone deceiving their partner, tbh, having been deceived myself.

Saltyquiche · 22/03/2022 02:44

Can she suggest coming out another night, at a more special location when it’s just them 2 together. Would feel like the night is being hijacked otherwise. The alternative is to carry on as originally planned but not make a fuss of the hair or makeup or heels and instead chat about usual things.

WouldBeGood · 22/03/2022 02:32

They are dominating the night before even going on it by setting out rules on photos, though!

This just isn’t the night for this. The person can arrange their own night out with their own agenda, not just make demands on someone else’s.

Midlifemusings · 22/03/2022 02:30

@Kennykenkencat

We have no way to know what he will be like. He doesn't want to be in pictures on his first night in a dress because he isn't ready for it to spread though his friend's social media. I can respect that.

There is nothing that says he will dominate the conversation and make it all about him. It is being reported third hand by Op who heard it from a friend who spoke to the guy.

If OPs friend has known him awhile and been friends, it isn't like putting a dress on is going to flick a switch that turns him into an asshole.

People are inventing problems that don't exist in this scenario just to have something to be mad about but they are arguging against their own assumptions and ideas - not the actual person or facts as we know them

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 22/03/2022 02:28

"I've never seen someone get a kick out of watching a lady use the loo tbh."

Have you been living under a rock for years or something??

The number of peeping tom issues, cameras over and under cubicle walls, upskirting, etc. that go on and you've just "never noticed"?

Wow.

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 22/03/2022 02:26

I'd uninvite him.
And, if necessary, tell him I'm of a turfy nature (I know that's not how it's spelled).
Even if it's not true - in that you have a FTM transitioning friend - doesn't matter.

Either way I'd not be going on this night out with him.

WouldBeGood · 22/03/2022 02:16

@Cheetocat sadly it’s really common for men to get a kick out of it, I used to be a criminal lawyer and it’s not rare

Kennykenkencat · 22/03/2022 02:15

@Midlifemusings

It sounds like his coming out is just wearing a sundress and using a female name at the event. It doesn't sound like he has a band or bells and whistles or a plan to take over the night. He doesn't need to be in any pictures you take - anyone can choose to not be in pictures of a night out.

I don't really get the outrage because he wants to wear a dress. Who cares - let him wear what he wants.

But it isn’t just be going out with a guy in a dress it is a guy in a dress who has already started putting restrictions on the evening and I doubt he is going to sit back and go with the flow it will be all about what he wants or doesn’t want. What he wants to talk about
WouldBeGood · 22/03/2022 02:14

It’s weird to hijack someone else’s night to make a point about themselves. Demanding no photos?!

I think I’d just say that whilst you have no issue with his choices this is not the night for it.

Go to the event yourself if your friend cancels rather than just telling her friend.

Cheetocat · 22/03/2022 02:13

@ferrisbuelleronadayout

"He" is not transitioning. "He" is still attracted to women and is just playing drag. I wouldn't be happy with him using the women's toilets in this situation. And he is not transitioned yet so not a she. Seems more like attention seeking and predatory behaviour.
You're exactly right, sexuality has got nothing to do with gender, she probably still likes women if she did before coming out. Are you scared she'll be peeping under the cubicle or something? I've never seen someone get a kick out of watching a lady use the loo tbh.
Kennykenkencat · 22/03/2022 02:09

Can you not say that the night was about going out to enjoy yourself and as he has now made it all about him and started to demand that you don’t take photos then maybe it isn’t the evening for him.

This would apply whether someone was gay/straight or trans
If someone starts making an evening out about what they want to do and starts asking for things then it probably isn’t going to work out.

ferrisbuelleronadayout · 22/03/2022 02:07

"He" is not transitioning. "He" is still attracted to women and is just playing drag. I wouldn't be happy with him using the women's toilets in this situation. And he is not transitioned yet so not a she. Seems more like attention seeking and predatory behaviour.

Cheetocat · 22/03/2022 01:59

So another woman will be joining you and a friend? I don't see the issue, she's obviously not a predator or anything if your friend trusts her enough to have planned going to an event together in the first place.

DoYouSeaWhatISea · 22/03/2022 01:55

@Susu49

Sorry, her
LOL
Marsmon · 22/03/2022 01:26

It's totally reasonable for your friend to tell the person, "Hi friend, your plans for this night out make me feel hijacked and uncomfortable. You've sprung this big news on me and as your friend, I want to be supportive but I need more time to get my head around it. It feels like you are making this night all about you and your big coming out, which is different to our original plans. I am not sure I'm ready to join you in going together to [event]."

Decent people understand that friends need time to get used to such a radical change. If they don't understand that, then that's their problem.