Tavistock staff and Foucault

• my point here is about the NHS staff/HCPs using the term 'sexual preference' wrt paedophilia. Foucault's academic theory is really neither here nor there.

Although it would also be interesting to discuss Foucault and postmodernism and queer theory, and hear your perspectives on it. Although I'm not realistically going to dedicate a decade of my life to it ... Perhaps a new thread?

@nightwakingmoon

Queer theory believes among other things that all oppression is due to people dividing everything into binaries such as man/woman, gay/straight, adult/child etc. They believe that to get rid of all oppression boundaries need to be blurred which is what they call queering.

Susan Cox, a feminist and philosophy lecturer brilliantly explains Queer Theory in the following interview. It is a must see to get a clear understanding of it and why it undermines women and undermines child-safe-guarding.

youtu.be/DWXHbrt3kvU

It's been routine for male paedophiles to talk of paedophilia as a "sexual preference" since the 1960s and 1970s, way before "queer theory"

And routine for NHS clinicians to also use this term?

[quote DontLikeCrumpets]@DomesticatedZombie Oh yes. Here is a 4 part series that explains how paedophilia is INTEGRAL to queer theory.

(Foucault in an interview stated with others that all age restrictions needed to be removed and that all children are capable of consent.)

The Trojan Unicorn: Queer Theory and Paedophilia 4-parts

1 - Post Modern Foundations of queer theory
uncommongroundmedia.com/the-trojan-unicorn-queer-theory-and-paedophilia-part-i-%ef%bb%bf-dr-em/

2 Gayle Rubin, Influential queer theorist
uncommongroundmedia.com/the-trojan-unicorn-qt-and-paedophilia-part-ii-dr-em/

3 Pat Califia - Titan of queer theory
uncommongroundmedia.com/the-trojan-unicorn-qt-and-paedophilia-part-iii-dr-em/

4 Judith Butler
The Trojan Unicorn: QT and Paedophilia, Part IV. | Dr Em[/quote]
Those are just media articles, not academic articles, and they really don't understand much of the actual theory - which takes a decade or more of study to read and understand to be honest. (They totally misunderstand postmodernism, as well, which isn't remotely what they seem to think it is.)

If you really want to understand Foucault, it might be worth reading some of his work, perhaps starting with Madness and Civilisation. (He may well have been a horrible person. Many philosophers were/are.) But the work itself just isn't what these articles characterise it as.

@DomesticatedZombie

link to the 4th part (Judith Butler) who is on the record condoning incest and generational sex

uncommongroundmedia.com/the-trojan-unicorn-qt-and-paedophilia-part-iv-dr-em/

If you are like me who up until very recently didn't have a solid grasp on what queer theory entails (ie paedophilia), I highly recommend this interview with feminist and philosopher, Susan Cox who btw is highly critical of it.

I'm no fan of identity politics. But Foucaudian historicism is essentially Marxist and psychoanalytic - both of which are directly opposed to identity politics. In fact Foucault explicitly critiques identity politics as a delusion - a false manifestation of underlying social forces.

The rise of trans ideology has far more to do with the rise of cosmetic surgery, social media and widespread porn than it could ever possibly have with some seminars on Foucault, I'm afraid.

It's been routine for male paedophiles to talk of paedophilia as a "sexual preference" since the 1960s and 1970s, way before "queer theory". Eve Sedgwick's work is on the history of gay rights - the old style kind which wasn't dominated by "trans" - and wasn't even published until the 1990s. This Telegraph article is way off base, I'm afraid. By all means critique identity politics, but it's important to aim at the correct targets. Tumblr has more to do with it than Foucault ever did!

@DomesticatedZombie Oh yes. Here is a 4 part series that explains how paedophilia is INTEGRAL to queer theory.

(Foucault in an interview stated with others that all age restrictions needed to be removed and that all children are capable of consent.)

The Trojan Unicorn: Queer Theory and Paedophilia 4-parts

1 - Post Modern Foundations of queer theory
uncommongroundmedia.com/the-trojan-unicorn-queer-theory-and-paedophilia-part-i-%ef%bb%bf-dr-em/

2 Gayle Rubin, Influential queer theorist
uncommongroundmedia.com/the-trojan-unicorn-qt-and-paedophilia-part-ii-dr-em/

3 Pat Califia - Titan of queer theory
uncommongroundmedia.com/the-trojan-unicorn-qt-and-paedophilia-part-iii-dr-em/

4 Judith Butler
The Trojan Unicorn: QT and Paedophilia, Part IV. | Dr Em

That may be, nightwaking, but it doesn't explain these people describing paedophilia as a 'sexual preference'.

Foucault was the founder of a school or a methodology, not of queer theory per se. This is a drastic oversimplification of what queer theory is and not remotely helpful in understanding current identity politics, which draws its roots as much from civil rights movements or aspects of medical biological essentialism (and a range of other theories) as from any part of Foucauldian historicism.

In fact Foucault’s work is actually far closer to a gender critical understanding of the trans phenomenon than anything else. A Foucauldian study of gender ideology would see it as a transient historical phenomenon produced by the medical establishment and social contagion, rather than the reverse.

Eve Sedgwick’s work is also dramatically misrepresented here.

I’m very radfem/gender critical, but this kind of stuff only promotes poor misunderstandings of what are complex forms of thought and often the exact opposite of what is claimed.

The pissed off woman in me says these are people so stupid that their brains have fallen out. My safeguarding knowledge tells me that people so in thrall to queer theory and espousing predatory values should be nowhere near vulnerable children.

“After his death, Foucault’s life and work were subject to a series of salacious attacks that focused on his sexual preferences."

They are calling paedophilia (alleged or otherwise) a 'sexual preference'?

And these people are treating children?