SNP Rebels (Yes, really) and More

In any case I don't want to derail the thread. I'm grateful to OP for starting it - it has given me a bit of hope but tbh it seems like this bill is going through no matter what. Women's views don't seem to matter - on that note lots of women have left the SNP over this.

7.5 years since the referendum and still not seen any viable currency plan and SNP can't agree who will pay Scottish pensions under independence. Mr Blackford says "the English" until slapped down by Ms Sturgeon.

Most of the young people I know say the same thing as most young people want independence. I was in my early 20s during the last referendum and this is not a Nicola opinion, it is a widely held fact from the data

Yes - the "coffin dodgers" spoiled it for the separatists. And yes, I heard that phrase being used by one of my husband's separatist supporting nephews. What a charming way to refer to his uncle and indeed his No voting grandmother (who had helped him buy a house)

Unfortunately for the separatists people grow up. There's still not a majority for yes despite 7 years of "coffin dodgers" dieing off.

Angus Robertson is definitely Nicola's chosen successor. Kate Forbes is too young, inexperienced, and isn't woke (probably because of the Christian thing), plus she's currently pregnant with her first so would probably prefer her energies to go towards her baby. Maybe after Angus.

What's a fact? That young people tend to be more radical/reckless, and older people tend to prefer the known to the unknown?

What nobody has factored into this devilishly clever plot is that younger people get older, and often change their minds/voting habits/beliefs in the process.

[quote DomesticatedZombie]- also noting that Sturgeon has made similar comments about how the more people die the better it is for Independence. Albeit veiled in a wink-wink-nudge-nudge layer of 'jokiness'.

“I’ve got democracy on my side ... if they think it’s about playing a waiting game, I’ve probably got time on my side as well.

"You look at the demographics of the support for independence – well, I’m not sure that’s going to get you out of this conundrum.”

Oh, you and your cheeky deathwish on the elderly, Nicola!

www.scotsman.com/news/politics/nicola-sturgeon-time-is-on-my-side-on-scottish-independence-referendum-push-3410524[/quote]
Well it's a fact isn't it?

Most of the young people I know say the same thing as most young people want independence. I was in my early 20s during the last referendum and this is not a Nicola opinion, it is a widely held fact from the data.

• also noting that Sturgeon has made similar comments about how the more people die the better it is for Independence. Albeit veiled in a wink-wink-nudge-nudge layer of 'jokiness'.

“I’ve got democracy on my side ... if they think it’s about playing a waiting game, I’ve probably got time on my side as well.

"You look at the demographics of the support for independence – well, I’m not sure that’s going to get you out of this conundrum.”

Oh, you and your cheeky deathwish on the elderly, Nicola!

www.scotsman.com/news/politics/nicola-sturgeon-time-is-on-my-side-on-scottish-independence-referendum-push-3410524

Oof. Can't picture either of those two in a functioning role as leader. Humza was spectacularly useless as Transport Mnister, and Angus Robertson is just ... well, he's Angus Robertson.

'In 2020 Robertson wrote that a rise in support for independence in opinion polls could be attributed to, "55,000 predominantly No supporting older voters passing away every year... Since 2014, this has added around 330,000 voters to the electorate, with a likely net gain of over 100,000 for independence.”

<a class="break-all" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20210219123541/www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/politics/scottish-politics/2503876/snps-angus-robertson-condemned-for-disgraceful-comments-suggesting-elderly-deaths-were-leading-to-independence-gain/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">web.archive.org/web/20210219123541/www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/politics/scottish-politics/2503876/snps-angus-robertson-condemned-for-disgraceful-comments-suggesting-elderly-deaths-were-leading-to-independence-gain/

So kind. Much compassion.

I don't think Kate Forbes is crazy enough has the appetite for it. I'd like to think she would have no truck with the OFI activists.

So that will leave the heirs apparent Angus Robertson or Humza Yousaf to fight it out. It's a shallow talent pool but the same could be said for the opposition parties.

Yes. We're past due a new SNP leader. Who else is in the running? I know they managed to rig it so that Joanna Cherry couldn't stand.

It’ll be interesting to see what Kate Forbes (potential successor to Nicola?) does.

True, Venezuela.

I find this VERY interesting, politically.

It takes a lot of courage to make a stand against a party seemingly stuffed with yes-men and -women. The fact that this has turned into an open rebellion from within is a significant development and a change in tone from previous years, indicating growing tensions.

Good luck to the rebels.

Thanks for the holyrood article.

The bastards are going to push it through & my daughters won't have any safe changing rooms etc etc etc I am beyond angry.

And yes hopefully it will be struck down by Westminster & then they will whine

Politics in Scotland is totally broken. The system was set up in expectation of power sharing & instead we have an authoritarian dictatorship.

It may be worth writing again to your MSPs, wims, to reiterate that you don't support the GRA reform as suggested.

10 rebels could become more, it's possible.

Yes, I'm confusing myself, here! For some reason thought I'd read MPs.

The SNP seems to me to be largely rotten - from the head, as they say. One person running the show and a raft of yes-men (and women) nodding along.

I completely agree that they are failing their constituents and the people of Scotland. But they seem to have a taste for forcing through unpopular, unworkable legislation.

"most nationalists in the parliament back the legislation and want it passed quickly"

This is quite a shocking admission when you consider the glaring holes in what they are doing, along with the fact the work that should have been done to properly consider the justified concerns raised just hasn't been done. MSPs who support this are effectively saying they have no intention of scrutinising the bill, as is their responsibility, and instead want to force it through without the proper scrutiny.

I've said it elsewhere but the number of careerist invertebrates who occupy seats in the Scottish Parliament is seriously depressing. It's their actual jobs to scrutinise legislation, to hear all views & concerns & to question the many issues & unintended consequences of this bill.

Their cowardice over this is staggering. Joan McAlpine had ovaries of steel, & paid the price for her vocal challenges to this. It's notable that since we lost Johann Lamont, Elaine Smith, Andy Wightman, Jenny Marra & Joan McAlpine, there's been no one vocal speaking about this subject. That's a pretty chilling state of affairs. Kate Forbes is the only one who has spoken on this that I'm aware of. But not to the extent it's had any impact.

10 rebel SNP MSPs isn't enough on numbers. And there's too many MSPs in general who have failed their constituents in declaring their desire just to get it passed, without any intention of scrutinising what this bill will do.

Actually, if that's just out of MPs rather than MSPs or both combined, then it's a fairly healthy chunk (45 SNP MPs).

But this crap legislation will still be pushed through.

[quote DomesticatedZombie]A glimmer. But I'm afraid 10 MPs is just not enough.

most nationalists in the parliament back the legislation and want it passed quickly

The SNPs culture, from what I can see, fosters unquestioning allegiance to party policy. I believe it's not allowed to question or criticise party policy, in fact?

www.heraldscotland.com/news/13207900.snp-clampdown-mps-fail-toe-party-line/[/quote]
Yes, 10 SNP rebels is hopeless. Most Labour MSPs will support. Lib Dems and Greens are a bunch of utter loons and will support. The parliamentary process is an absolute waste of time.

Women in Scotland are f*cked, quite frankly.

I have an idea of who a few of them will be.

I've voted SNP a few times but reckon I'll spoil my ballot this year if this goes ahead.

Thanks for link.