Lia Thomas is the Ivy League Champion in the 500 free

I live where the latest swim meets took place. Pretty much radio silence from the news outlets.

I can gaurantee you that if an actual woman was competing with these times there would be

a. total news coverage - as this would be the next female Michael Phelps

b. huge discussion of possible doping

Boston is a big sports town. This record-breaking happened on our doorstep. If it was a woman the sports pages would be full of "phenome swimmer XYZ looks likely to be the female Michael Phelps in next olympics" Instead it is reported below high school sports and in news outlets who haven't completely given up the ghost yet with a bit of "people in some circles question ... "

even the supporters of this mad belief know what is what.

It would be social and academic suicide for the women on the swim team to openly complain. They would be hounded on social media, lose friends and I wonder how forthcoming their professors would be with letters of recommendation etc. - all because they know what we all know. It is madness.

Yeah if the thought of being a woman gives you a massive hard on, clue: you're not one.

I did think that gibbons

What the fuck is emotionally a woman 🤔

Sarah Vine's comment is great barring one sub clause "Lia Thomas, while emotionally and psychologically a woman,"

[quote Goatsaregreat]The Mail on Sunday (Sarah Vine) covering this:

www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-10531313/SARAH-VINE-really-telling-burly-swimmer-Lia-Thomas-playing-fair.html[/quote]
Excellent article by Sarah Vine - spot on.

@Needmoresleep there’s two approaches to us admissions. The main one is to apply with good academics plus lots of extra curricular, such as sport. The ivies are needs blind as you say.

The other way is through a completely seperate application process for a sports scholarship if you are SERIOUSLY good. And that isn’t related to parental income.

Found an archive archive.fo/T2uza

The Mail on Sunday (Sarah Vine) covering this:

www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-10531313/SARAH-VINE-really-telling-burly-swimmer-Lia-Thomas-playing-fair.html

Do you have a share token for this article? Or could you please take screenshots?
Apologies.
This article appeared on my Google news and I was able to read it at that point. However, it now appears to be behind a pay wall. Sorry but I have no idea how I was able to read it in the first place. Could it have been archived?

Scout, are you sure these are not linked to parental income. Ie as in being needs blind, not just linked to sport.

Lots of American parents we knew in Central London encouraged sport as a way for their kids to get into top US universities. It was always the place they were after, not the scholarship. Several did get in, including a swimmer who went on to become an Ivy champion. From what people said, there was no money attached to sport itself. If you were given a free ride it was because they wanted you as an academic/sporty package and you qualified under needs blind provisions.

FWIW Lia and others appear to be from affluent backgrounds.

From the article ‘ As a civil rights lawyer, I run Champion Women, a non-profit that provides legal advocacy for girls and women in sports. We produce data — for athletes, families, alumni and donors – which demonstrates just how badly 90% of colleges and universities are discriminating against women.

In total, women are denied over 183,000 opportunities to play collegiate sports, they’re denied over a billion dollars in athletic scholarships, and hundreds and millions of dollars in treatment, meaning women aren’t being given equal facilities, locker rooms, medical care, publicity, travel, and so forth.

I’ve never met a single female athlete that couldn’t list the ways they’re getting second-class treatment as compared to their male football or basketball players.

In those 38 years, I’ve never heard a single man say, ‘Oh you women face such overwhelming sex discrimination throughout society, particularly in sexual harassment and violence. Here, take our athletic facilities and scholarships.

Quite the opposite.’

Interesting article here in Swimming World magazine by Nancy Hogshead-Makar, a former swimming champion who has set up an organisation providing advocacy and legal services for girls and women in sport.

www.swimmingworldmagazine.com/news/sex-matters-why-lia-thomas-and-transgender-athletes-must-not-compete-against-biological-females/

@Needmoresleep you definitely do get BIG (as in 100%) scholarships to Ivy League schools for sports. That also includes top top training and kit and equipment etc. The academics are there, but not in the same way as Oxbridge if you are very sporty.

Ivy League schools do offer big fees discounts, including for sports.

Afaik you do not get scholarships to Ivy schools. They are so competitive to enter and swimming helps get you in, but you also need to be very academic. And you need to keep that level of academics up alongside training. Sort of like making the British team whilst studying at Oxford. As a result their swim teams are normally nowhere near the levels achieved by the major sports/swimming universities like Auburn. That is why the idea that an Ivy could produce a NCAA champion is very unlikely.

Unless, of course, that swimmer had some sort of advantage.

Just to say I don't give a damn whether Lia has had surgery or not. The break in the rules came in 2003 when transwomen were allowed to compete having had genital surgery. That didn't affect much as the surgery is so rare - but it's right that it's rare. I know someone who had that surgery a few years back and is still having complications from it. I don't think anyone should have it. A woman is not a male person who's had genital surgery.

Was going to ask about the scholarship: that’s shit.

So unfair to women.

Why should they miss out on their swim and their scholarships and experiences for something so obviously unfair. Why can’t the university talk about this rationally with the actual people involved rather some imagined lobby groups online? Those poor women.

If any of them are there on sports scholarships, refusing to swim might mean giving up their university places. And I daresay that for many the degree is the main point of being there, not the swimming.

The other competitors need to make a stand and at the last second not dive in the pool. Let Lia compete against themselves.

So Lia gets a scholarship as well as all the records. Which means somewhere a biological woman isn’t receiving a scholarship. Doesn’t have a place on the team, etc.