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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Why surrogacy should be banned

233 replies

DomesticatedZombie · 10/02/2022 19:51

  • article from Stefanie Bode.

'It’s always harmful. It harms our health, it exploits our bodies; it’s dependent on global inequalities and makes them worse; it violates our dignity, our physical integrity and many others of our human rights. It is a form of slavery (of women and children), and obviously it’s violence against women and children. It makes babies into commodities. It’s very cruel and inhumane to women and babies to separate a baby from its mother. '

www.filia.org.uk/latest-news/2022/2/8/why-surrogacy-should-be-banned

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KimikosNightmare · 11/02/2022 00:26

@Catcrazy83

Humans need to understand we can’t all have what we want all the time. If for what ever reason you can’t have your own baby, gay, fertility issues or illness. I’m sorry it’s tough. Uteruses and babies should not be for sale.
Agreed- but I suspect the horse bolted/ ship sailed long ago on that concept.
DidoDino · 11/02/2022 00:07

I don't see the issue of removing a child from its birth mother, when the child will be placed in the care of loving parents

Infants aren't blank slates to be passed around caregivers. Newborns recognise their mother's voices and smell, they have an intimacy of connection that can't be replicated by another parent, no matter how loving. Furthermore, that child will be formed around abandonment. Pre-verbal, un-symbolised abandonment that no amount of love, reassurance, or rationalisation will heal.

Surrogacy creates developmental trauma.

MrsTerryPratchett · 10/02/2022 23:59

@fallfallfall

what about families doing this to help infertile daughters? mother or sister etc? i'm not sure all surrogacy should be banned.
This is to surrogacy what the happy hooker is to prostitution.

A very small section of a very small section used to justify the whole.

Catcrazy83 · 10/02/2022 23:56

Humans need to understand we can’t all have what we want all the time. If for what ever reason you can’t have your own baby, gay, fertility issues or illness. I’m sorry it’s tough. Uteruses and babies should not be for sale.

FannyCann · 10/02/2022 23:49

And here is what happens when babies are reduced to a product for sale. Defective products are returned to sender. I'm only surprised the woman didn't ask for a refund.

Woman rejected disabled surrogate baby as a ‘dribbling cabbage’.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/906372bf-1f6f-4195-b75b-d18202b12bd6?shareToken=43de95cb9d48a273a791cd8470ad9dcff_

mummykel16 · 10/02/2022 23:46

Let's face it this is about making money like so many other dodgy things currently done.
It could be banned as a commercial enterprise but the doctors etc would still profit so still push it, I don't know the answer

FannyCann · 10/02/2022 23:41

Here is a superb analysis of the harms of surrogacy from a feminist point of view..

"Conclusion

Surrogacy is incompatible with the full realisation of the rights of women and children. As I have shown, as a practice it raises a number of concerns related to medical ethics, exploitation and commodification. Its fundamental root lies in the patriarchal relationship between men and women. Whilst slavery, exploitative labour and the sale of human organs are almost universally condemned, the exploitation and sale of female bodies is accepted to a much greater degree. There is no part of female anatomy that cannot be profited from. Given the growth and increasing acceptance of the surrogacy industry it is a key contemporary issue for feminists.
The general direction of reform globally has been towards prohibition in recent years. There have, however, been notable exceptions. New York state recently legalised commercial surrogacy as its governor included legislation within the coronavirus pandemic budget. In the UK pro-surrogacy groups have lobbied for a change in the law and steered a government consultation such that the rights of women and children were far from fully considered.
Law and policy is developing and changing across the world and it is vital that the rights of women and children are always the foremost consideration. I have argued for an abolitionist approach because a regulatory harm reduction approach does not advance the aim of feminism. Industrialising patriarchal norms is not compatible with a political movement that demands the emancipation of all women. Feminism cannot succeed by sacrificing the most disenfranchised women to patriarchy, restricting its interest to making improvements to the conditions of their abuse. Surrogacy must be prohibited."

objectnow.org/how-do-altruistic-and-commercial-surrogacy-affect-the-rights-of-women-and-children/

mummykel16 · 10/02/2022 23:40

@Shuffletime

I'm 90% against surrogacy but have no qualms about a completely voluntary, unpaid offer of surrogacy to help a sister/friend/relative have a child. Obviously there is still risk but it's a very different scenario from paying for a birthing vessel.
Nice
user1471604848 · 10/02/2022 23:39

I don't see the issue of removing a child from its birth mother, when the child will be placed in the care of loving parents.

I have twins. At birth, one twin had a low birth weight, so went to the HDU. She seemed oblivious that she was separated from me, and happily took her milk from the nurses in the HDU. Since I had a c-section, my birth partner fed the other twin. Again, he didn't seem to care if he was held by me or my birth partner.
I really feel if I had died giving birth, my babies would have been perfectly happy in the care of my loving family and would not have felt my loss.
I feel the same about surrogate babies, who are immediately placed with loving surrogate parents.

InspiralCoalescenceRingdown · 10/02/2022 23:38

If it's "judgey AF" to be opposed to buying and selling humans, then guilty as charged.

FannyCann · 10/02/2022 23:31

It reduces all women to the status of breeders and babies to commodities.
It's an offence against the human dignity of women and babies.

lavendarleopards · 10/02/2022 23:30

Hypothetical "you" to clarify

lavendarleopards · 10/02/2022 23:29

@fallfallfall

what about families doing this to help infertile daughters? mother or sister etc? i'm not sure all surrogacy should be banned.
Risk of subtle/not so subtle family coercion or emotional blackmail. Could you really say no to your sister who's had cancer or your gay brother who'd make an amazing dad? You've had easy pregnancies after all! The more this becomes the norm, the more women will be expected to put aside their - completely understandable - qualms, "be kind" and selflessly offer up their wombs. No matter what the physical or psychological costs to themselves.
Shuffletime · 10/02/2022 23:27

I'm 90% against surrogacy but have no qualms about a completely voluntary, unpaid offer of surrogacy to help a sister/friend/relative have a child. Obviously there is still risk but it's a very different scenario from paying for a birthing vessel.

sometimespeopletakethepiss · 10/02/2022 23:23

What happened to women being able to choose what they do with their bodies? No one campaigns against women wearing what they want to and doing what they want to.

What right do you or anyone have to say this? I think this thread is hypocritical to be honest and judgey AF

lavendarleopards · 10/02/2022 23:22

Agree wholeheartedly. It's the exploitation of vulnerable/naive/desperate women by entitled people who won't take no for an answer and are used to being able to buy whatever they want.

fallfallfall · 10/02/2022 23:19

what about families doing this to help infertile daughters? mother or sister etc? i'm not sure all surrogacy should be banned.

ArabellaStrange · 10/02/2022 23:14

Also as underlined by the book previously mentioned by myself it would give rise to all sorts of evils, such as producing a child with the internet of using their health to support the health of a child in who is not healthy.
Sick and dystopian are the words that come to my mind.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 10/02/2022 23:03

That is sad yes, but the alternative for that particular child was otherwise to not exist at all.

Yes. And? Taken to its logical conclusion, that implies it is my obligation to get pregnant over and over again having kids I don't want and can't afford, because otherwise they won't exist!

I don't think "does a being get brought into existence that wouldn't otherwise" is a moral criterion that can justify all else.

Personally, I think I'd rather never be conceived at all than be a baby in a commercial surrogacy arrangement.

myyellowcar · 10/02/2022 22:58

Surrogacy is all about the wants of adults with no consideration to the needs of the baby. That tells you everything you need to know.

EishetChayil · 10/02/2022 22:52

@Jacaranda75

What happened to ‘my body, my choice’?

That was a libfem catchphrase to convince women to do what men want under the guise of choice. It was a myth.

blublub · 10/02/2022 22:18

Another vote against surrogacy. It’s inhumane to remove a child at birth from it’s mother and treats a human being as a commodity. An utterly selfish act.

ArabellaStrange · 10/02/2022 21:59

Someone needs to read 'Never Let Me Go' or if that's beyond their capabilities, at least watch the film.

DomesticatedZombie · 10/02/2022 21:55

As for the child removed from its birth mother? That is sad yes, but the alternative for that particular child was otherwise to not exist at all.

Odd argument. If you didn't exist you wouldn't miss being alive!

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coffeepopcorn · 10/02/2022 21:55

@HotPenguin

"Given the choice between being removed at birth, or never existing at all, I think most people would choose being removed at birth"

By that logic it would be ok to produce children to be slaves, or to have their organs harvested for transplants. As it would be better than not existing at all.

Yes, or conceiving children through rape. It's a terrible argument.
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