Forms, asking for "gender" not "sex" what can I say?

I had to sign a form for DD for school the other day for her second Covid jab. It was a paper form so I crossed out gender and put sex.

This was not a school form but one issued by the NHS. I find the fact that the NHS are doing this quite concerning.

You are possibly kicking yourself in the foot there.

Oh and btw fwiw - I’m actually in agreement with the poster above re swimming: I think in that case they should ask for sex. I’m talking about when it isn’t really relevant.

Tick it. It’s far better than having a form that says gender and not only doesn’t give all the options but then you find out is about biological sex. Or cross out gender and pot sex. One of my students added “non-binary” to their straight up two gender option on a test paper and I told them quite right too and was proud.

"I was going to enter the Swimathon until I got to the question on the form asking for gender. I thought you might mean 'Sex' but as you include 'non-binary' as an option you clearly don't.

You say you want to categorise results by gender, but how can this have any meaning or relevance if it is self identified? Are you going to compare male-bodied non-binary people with female bodied non-binary people? Or even male-bodied people who identify as female with actual women? What would that show? Sex, is a biological fact which has direct relevance in a sport such as swimming. Gender is an ideology and you may as well have categories based on star signs or religion.

I am sure you will say that you are being inclusive, but as an actual woman I do not want to be part of something that has bought into an agressive, exclusionary ideology."

It has not been used as such for centuries. Before 1955 it was only ever used to refer to grammar. Then John Money coined the term "gender role". It became common in the seventies where scholars wanted to distinguish between biological differences and societal differences.

Use as a synonym for "sex" is even more recent than that.

I tick 'other' - but only if it brings up a box in which I can type 'my sex is female; I do not identify with any gender'.

I do worry though that they’ll see these responses not that I’m biologically female, but that I define myself in some other way, but I have no way of telling them that.

Then they didn't test the forms. Or, they did test the forms but didn't want to deal with this issue so decided that the ignoring it was worth the price of inaccurate information.

I’ve come across a few forms like this recently, I think they’re all very confused tbh!

One asked if my gender corresponded to the one I was assigned at birth, and since I don’t believe I was assigned a gender I clicked - prefer not to answer. No mention of sex.

One asked for my sex and one of the options was ‘woman - including trans woman’ but that really should’ve been asking for gender, so again I clicked a ‘none of the above’ option.

I do worry though that they’ll see these responses not that I’m biologically female, but that I define myself in some other way, but I have no way of telling them that.

Blueberry, are you ever embarrassed by yourself?

Something like this?

"I had wanted to complete your online for form X but was confused by some of the wording.

The form appears to confuse biological sex (a protected characteristic) and 'gender identity' an ideological concept that is widely understood to be promoted by controversial lobby groups.

I am also unclear as to why my sexual orientation would need to be requested and recorded and what relevance my religious beliefs would be.

Why would this data be collected for the purpose of the X form? I wanted to participate in X but feel unable to do so. Please can you email in by way of reply so I can better understand the reasoning behind the questions on this form.

I felt that the form was assigning a 'gender identity' to me when I don't have one, I am female and this is my biological sex and has no relevance or connection to an ideological movement I don't ascribe to.

Please can someone contact me to help me understand the purpose of these questions and to perhaps pursue a way I can be involved without completing this form, if the form cannot be changed.

Signed..."

This letter doesn't need to be written in any particular way, so just put it into your own words, say why it bothers you and how it prevents you from taking part in whatever it is they have the form for.

If they reply you can follow up with the links and info on the protected characteristics and all the evidence to show why they should be accurately gathering relevant data and why they could be in trouble for breaching their own rules. That could be a follow up email and you'll get into your stride by then!

Why is Neighbourhood Watch interested in your religious beliefs and why are they imposing an ideology onto those it is gathering data on?

www.ourwatch.org.uk/how-we-work/nationally/governance-strategy/policies/data-protection-policy

I would ask why they are assigning gender identities, it's a very definitive list and doesn't list demigirl or maverick...or did they mean sex?

If you had the time you could complain. It can be tedious to keep pointing out the failures of not keeping accurate data according to the equality act, and the consequences or the message it sends, but it's also surprising how sometimes a company or organisation will reverse it when someone takes the time to point it out.

I asked for a definition of gender because I didn't understand the question they didn't actually know how to explain it to me apparently its "how you identify" I said I don't usually so? Then it was well how do you feel about yourself I said sick that's why I'm filling out the form her supervisor said are you a man or a woman? I said woman but your asking for my gender based on feelings on a medical questionnaire where my sex matters they adjusted the form eventually to put in gender and birth sex with an explanation why it was needed

I chose not to go with them but I'm hoping my point was heard

Even when the only options are 'male' and 'female', gender can't be be assumed to mean sex.

An example of this is the annual school census. Schools are obliged to collect data on pupils' gender, which they have to report in the school census. They are not obliged to record or report pupils' sex, and I guess most don't.

The management information systems that schools use to record pupil data may not even have a field to record sex: the one I have used (SIMS) certainly doesn't.

Many people probably assume that the word 'gender' is being used as a synonym for sex but the DfE guidance shows that this is not this is definitely not the case:

Gender

We need this data for both on and off roll pupils.

The gender of the pupil in the format of ‘M’ (male) or ‘F’ (female).

Gender should be self-declared and recorded according to the wishes of the parent and / or pupil.

Individuals are free to change the way their gender is recorded.

www.gov.uk/guidance/complete-the-school-census/data-items-2021-to-2022

So how are schools supposed to follow this guidance if a pupil doesn't self-declare any gender, or self-declares a gender other than male or female?

If it is a paper form cross out gender & replace with sex; depending on context add note to remind them why this matters.

No, @BlueberryCheezecake, “gender” hasn’t been used as synonym for “sex” on forms “for centuries”. What an absurd claim to make given how many people on this board will remember it never being used; & how many of us have noticed it suddenly being everywhere. Its usage - or not - in this context is something that would, until recently, have been covered by Oxbridge undergraduates (obviously Tripos & Paper dependent but including Historians); but there is simply no way a weekly essay could be set asking a student “What is the difference between sex and gender?*” in the current climate. When there were still Women’s Studies departments this question was closely interrogated too - but there probably wasn’t a need to look at which word was used on paperwork then. It can be great fun to play with counterfactual history & sketch out an alternative timeline, but you’re not meant to then present it as fact.

Incidentally, was it you who mentioned Wollstonecraft using “gender”? A Vindication of the Rights of Woman doesn’t use “gender” once. “Sex”, however, appears 49 times; & “sexes” 41. Thoughts On The Education Of Daughters only mentions “sex” 6 times - but still a big fat 0 for “gender”.

What people who like to argue “it’s been used for centuries!” tend to conveniently leave out is that for the first several of those centuries it had a different meaning. When it first appeared around 1350, “gender” (being derived from genus) was a synonym for “beget”. Hence the now-obsolete meaning “to breed”; & the archaic “to engender”.

This is language evolving.

• Clearly use of sex/gender in this context would have been the tiniest fragment of said essay; but woe betide any student unprepared to discuss & rigorously defend every fleeting thought they included when supervision/tutorial comes round.

Gender looks like a synonym for sex on these forms, but it's not because they usually have options like non-binary, other, etc and they have nothing to do with sex.

My employer holds records of our 'gender'. I'm sure it was originally intended as a synonym for sex but the world has changed.

I'm thinking of asking them to delete my record, as I don't have a gender. Alternatively, perhaps they could confirm that their policy is gender=sex, in which case there would be all sorts of ramifications.

I recently wanted to sign up to a service online, quite an expensive service >1K, and the only options were gender male or female (no 'other', no space for comments) . I contacted the company to say I couldn't answer this as I don't conform to gender stereotypes and all I have is my sex. She basically said, oh its alright, just tick the one that corresponds with your sex. Ermm, no I won't. Have decided not to purchase their services.

Gender is a perfectly acceptable synonym for sex in these contexts and has been used as such for centuries.

I actually tend to go along with that - as long as the only choices are male and female, from which you can reasonably infer that they probably mean sex, rather than assuming they're modern-day genderologists. (But it's still worth nagging them to point out that their use of "gender" to mean "sex" is outdated, so changing to "sex" will align with modern usage.)

The moment there's any other option (aside from maybe "prefer not to say"), then I know they can't mean sex, so I won't answer it with my sex.