James O’Brien on now ‘pregnant people’

[quote oklets]@Intheopinionofourexpert Well my point was is your objection based on you denying the existence of trans/non binary people. And your reply indicates that yes, it is. [/quote]
I'm not denying the existence of trans or non binary people, I'm pointing out that only females can give birth. Being trans or non binary is irrelevant to that point. If a non binary person gives birth, what sex is that person?

'ONLY women give birth'. This is true only if you deny the existence of trans and non binary people.

No, I don't have to deny that these people physically exist in the world to completely reject the faith based ideology that it's possible for a male to be a woman, or have no sex at all. Hope that helps.

I am a cis het female who visibly presents as such too, just FYI.

So much to unpack in this woke signalling statement:

Use of the prefix, signals submission to the ideology that woman are a subset of their own sex class

Showcase their sexuality, although why anyone would think that we either need or want to know that is beyond me.

It all rather falls down at the end with the visibly presents stuff though, I thought Gender Ideology was quite firmly not about presentation or sex stereotypes - contradictory as ever.

But spikes they know who they are including, who they are objecting to. They know whether they would choose a transperson as a sexual partner and why/why not.

They know what sex is. They choose to overrule that knowledge, for ideological reasons, as you said.

He's so rude and just cuts people of whose (perfectly reasonable) opinion he doesn't like. So uncomfortable to listen to. HomeThink he's too comfortable in his job.

@SamphiretheStickerist

I actually think a lot of people genuinely don't see why. Most people don't think about things that deeply unless that personally affect them. They just adopt views that they see as belonging to their 'tribe' (I'm on the left! I'm inclusive! I'm kind! So I must think this!)

So they just hear that its about being kind and polite and inclusive and it doesn't hurt anyone to be polite and kind and inclusive and they absorb that (propaganda) without thinking about it.

I like LBC, .. it's my channel of choice, after James O'Brien has gone off. In the morning it's Times Radio for me. I've never forgiven him for how he spoke to Kellie Jay. He's a typical left winged, posh boy misogynist. Cannot stand him.

Oh they see why. All of them.

Some choose to ignore that because it doesn't fit their ideology

Some choose to ignore it because they value inclusivity above all

Others because they like to disrupt anything and everything they can attach themselves to.

And a small subset of any/all of the above need to believe otherwise, for their own reasons.

But they all know

Quite. There are good examples on this thread of why using words to mean specific, precise stuff is really important for communication.

Yet people still claim they can't see why words need to have exclusive precise meanings

Not all people are women.

This logic lesson 1, blueberry.

"""All I'm hearing is 'women have the right to be called women'. This is true, nobody is denying this. Then 'ONLY women give birth'. This is true only if you deny the existence of trans and non binary people. Think my question has been answered so toodles""""..........

Oh look, another drive-by scolding.
You know only women give birth don't you? Because "woman" means those people of the FEMALE sex. With female reproductive capacity (whether it works or not, whether it has ceased to function or not, whether they have gone through menopause or not, whether they have had their reproductive organs removed or not).
No man has ever or will ever give birth.
Nobody 'denies' the existence of trans people, but we know that their biological sex never changes. In fact, it is people like YOU who deny the very REAL (and by real, I mean provable, documented, and true) existence of biological fact.
Woman means adult human female. Only this kind of human has ever been pregnant or given birth.
Therefore, only women give birth. It's actually very simple. Self identity does not change biological reality. I might identify as a chicken tomorrow, but I won't start laying eggs. My biological reality is that of an adult human female.
I don't know why it has to be so confusing to some people, really, a five year old child can grasp that there are two types of human and which ones have the babies.
Your word salad and obfuscation of the facts won't change that.

But you're not on this thread anymore are you? Drive-by scolding accomplished.

Growing up I instinctively knew I was never going to be a famous millionaire footballer. 100% of them are people and yet somehow also 0% of them are people.

If only we had a word to describe which people are shut out of that lucrative work.

Trans people exist.
Transwomen are men.
Transmen are women.
Non-binary people can be either women or men.
Only women give birth.
Everything above is logical and consistent.

It’s all very simple and clear unless you go out of your way to make it much more complicated than it needs to be.

I don't care how you present, or think of, yourself. Just don't make demands of me that are inherently negative for me

Quite. Its a real eye opener into how lowly women are viewed, that this is considered unreasonable.

Or rather, that people just don't think through that some of the demands are inherently negative for women: and that women's voices aren't worth listening to, when we point out that they are.

That has to be the take away message, doesn't it?

I don't care how you present, or think of, yourself. Just don't make demands of me that are inherently negative for me.

Start with don't call me cos, do refer to me as female, woman.

And then maybe I will honour your wish to be referred to by a feminine name.

Do not call me cis

Turn

Just to clarify.

I am an adult female, a woman. This is why I can (and have) given birth.

As a woman I respectively ask to be referred to as a woman. In tern I will respect others by referring to them as trans men.

I am a cis het female who visibly presents as such too, just FYI.

Can you explain how I ‘visibly’ present as this? I’m currently wearing my DH top and his joggers. Does that make me a cis male? Or am I a lesbian? Or am I bi? What am I?????

Shit I really had not realised my presentation impacted my capacity to give birth! I had clearly misunderstood and thought it was something completely different!

This thread has reminded about the one day perfumery course I took many years ago, with about ten other women. We made our own perfumes, which was fun. Apparently men did occasionally take this course, but they were very much in the minority.

Anyway, the perfumer leading the course told us that the perfume industry was very male-dominated. One woman asked why that was, seeing as we’d already discussed how women had the better sense of smell. The perfumer, a man who’d been in the industry for many years, said something about how the men knew that and therefore had “kept the women out at all costs”.

The old attitude of “keeping it for the boys”, must have excluded some of the best perfumery talent - risking profitability and and a company’s competitive edge. I’d say something about how the men were literally cutting off their own noses to spite their faces, but that would be a terrible pun.

The rush to pretend that the erasure of the use of the word "woman", when referring to anything to do with the female body, has absolutely nothing to do with the inclusion of gender questioning female human beings but everything to do with male people, who identify as women , and therefore feel excluded when the word " woman" is used to refer to female biology. This is clear from people like Munroe Bergdoff warning women on the Women's March not to discuss female health matters as it excludes males who identify as women and from the fact that no trans groups are advocating for a similar change of language when discussing male health matters.

JOB is smug and spineless. Makes out he is a paragon of logic and objective thinking, but underneath he’s terrified of being cancelled and every bit as self interested as the next person.

Such a shame they sacked Maajid.

Well of course not Redlake Tasmanian devils can’t talkso no one knows how they feel (I mean really?)

however they know exactly which other type of Tasmanian devil you need to make a baby Tasmanian devil