Woman on ward - complains about male patient. Is discharged.

I’m sorry but if you have a penis then you belong on a male ward. I do not give a shit if you call yourself a unicorn or female whatever while you have a penis you belong on the male ward. I’m so over this shit that’s happening.

but where's that same ''concern'' and outrage on threads like this for those women sexually assaulted?
I am concerned and outraged when women are sexually assaulted, and have commented on threads in the past when they have been.
In cases like this though, nobody has been assaulted.
Nobody was in any danger.
Also with trans people just being out as trans.
Doesn't necessarily mean they're a danger.
Some seem to think they are though, which is ridiculous, they're people just like we all are.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/nhs-gaslights-women-who-want-single-sex-wards-as-transphobes-claims-nurse-9xntx69p5

Dr Sinead Helyar, a clinical research nurse, said NHS policies allowing transgender patients onto single-sex wards were “formulated and enacted to the detriment of women ”.

Speaking at a fringe meeting at the Conservative Party conference on Tuesday, Helyar said doctors working for at least one trust had been told to “reiterate . . . that there are no men present” if questioned why a transgender patient was on a single-sex ward.

                                                      ....

In one mental health trust, a male who identifies as a woman was placed on a female ward with observation. This patient complained that the observation was discriminatory, and it was removed.

The patient went on to sexually assault two women patients. The same patient was placed on a female ward on a subsequent admission, and each time assaulted women. Staff concerns were ignored.

A Stonewall spokesperson said: “Trans women should be able to access dignified and high-quality healthcare in the same way as everyone else.

“ Inclusive healthcare practices make us all safer and, in 2021, it should not be controversial to ensure that all LGBTQ+ people get the healthcare and support that they deserve. ”

How sweet that some posters are so very concerned for a woman that was misgendered.

You care about women so much, one being misgendered horrifies you, but where's that same ''concern'' and outrage on threads like this for those women sexually assaulted? We don't see you on them. Why?

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4367520-NHS-gaslighting-patients-on-female-only-wards

Medics? Nurses?

How is getting mistaken for a girl the same or equivalent to getting mistaken as a man though?
In your case, you got put with other biological females.
In this women's case, some would have had her in with the men.

So no, they didn’t think I looked like a woman. They did, however, identify my sex correctly.

Trying to pretend that my very clear reference to medics being able to identify sex correctly in unconscious patients was some kind of a swipe at someone whose sex was called into question due to their appearance actually IS a vicious thing to say.

These "fair enough points" always seem to require women sacrificing political effectiveness to be nice. To be nice to someone who can't even be bothered to learn the difference between a vulva and a vagina. As many black women told Munroe at the time, their vaginas are pink.

For the sake of pursuing a point, Munroe ended up othering black women from women. It was disgusting.

Amazing how this "fair enough point" happens to be sabotaging a campaign to help bring together the 50% of the population who have female anatomy. How come Munroe doesn't identify enough with women to tolerate women speaking about female anatomy in a country where access to abortion seems to be perennially under threat? Abortion is now gone in one American state. American women are not in a secure enough position to make these concessions to people like Munroe, and never were.

extract 1

Apussyhatis a pink, crafted hat, created in large numbers by women involved with the United States2017 Women's March. They are the result of thePussyhat Project, a nationwide effort initiated byKrista SuhandJayna Zweiman, a screenwriter and architect located in Los Angeles, to create pink hats to be worn at the march.[1]

In response to this call, crafters all over the United States began making these hats using patterns provided on the project Web site for use with either aknittingmethod,crochetingand evensewingwith fabrics.[2][3]The project's goal was to have one million hats handed out at the Washington March.[3]The hats are made using pink yarns or fabrics and were originally designed to be a positive form of protest for Trump's inauguration by Krista Suh. Suh, from Los Angeles, wanted a hat for the cooler climate in Washington, D.C. and made a hat for herself to wear at the Women's March, realizing the potential: "We could all wear them, make a unified statement".[4]One of the project founders, Jayna Zweiman, stated "I think it's resonating a lot because we're really saying that no matter who you are or where you are, you can be politically active."[3]Suh and Zweiman worked with Kat Coyle, the owner of a local knitting supply shop called The Little Knittery, to come up with the original design. The project launched in November 2016 and quickly became popular on social media with over 100,000 downloads of the pattern to make the hat.[5][1]

extract 2
A global women’s movement, created almost overnight. Millions of women, men and children at over 600 rallies in countries touching virtually every continent. Young and old, rich and poor. Educated and not, religious and secular. Straight and LGBTQ, every race and color. All wearing hand-made, knitted caps on a single day, awash in a sea of pink, arm-in-arm in solidarity for women’s rights and in protest against the rhetoric used toward women and minorities in the previous year’s state and federal elections.

And it all started with two sticks and a ball of yarn.

In late 2016, artist and design architect Jayna Zweiman was rehabbing from a serious injury. Unable to work or engage in strenuous physical activity, Jayna wanted to find a creative healing modality she could do for recuperation. She roped in Krista Suh, a screenwriter, to take a crochet classes at the Little Knittery, a local yarn store near her home in Los Angeles. The two were hooked.

During many lengthy conversations in knitting circles, the two women found common ground in their passion for women’s rights and the inspiration they found in the pro-women’s rights language of the pending Women’s Marches.

Krista was planning to attend the Women’s March in Washington DC that January of 2017, and needed a cap to keep her head warm in the chill winter air. Jayna, due to her injury, would not be able to attend any of the marches, but wanted to find a way to have her voice heard in absentia and somehow physically “be” there. Together, a marcher and a non-marcher, they conceived the idea of creating a sea of pink hats at Women’s Marches everywhere that would make both a bold and powerful visual statement of solidarity, and also allow people who could not participate themselves – whether for medical, financial, or scheduling reasons — a visible way to demonstrate their support for women’s rights.

Little Knittery owner Kat Coyle designed a simple and brilliant pattern that would allow people of all knitting levels to be part of the project. The name Pussyhat™ was chosen in part as a protest against vulgar comments Donald Trump made about the freedom he felt to grab women’s genitals, to de-stigmatize the word “pussy” and transform it into one of empowerment, and to highlight the design of the hat’s ’pussycat ears’. Leveraging social media and the close-knit nature of the global knitting community, word was spread and the fuse was lit.

A Pussyhat now resides in the Rapid Response collection of the Victoria and Albert Museum, the permanent collection of Michigan State University’s museum, and other collections as an important piece of feminist history. What started as a simple means of protest, participation and solidarity, has become an iconic global symbol of political activism.

It's not surprising that so many women are frightened. Numerous NHS trusts have written special policies about allowing male born sex offenders on women's wards. They've discussed it and see it as a good thing. Personally I'd sack any medical professional involved, but as we know, there are a lot of undesirable organisations with influence over this:

www.womenarehuman.com/nhs-guidance-allows-male-patients-including-sex-offenders-in-female-only-wards/

.

@EeeICouldRipATissue But it was a direct reference to the offensive remarks of TFG, wasn't it? So reclamation by women.

might seem like a fun, inoffensive and light-hearted accessory, designed to unite women, but it feeds into a narrative that continues to push us apart. Last month, prior to the march I tweeted a reminder to those participating that it was an event for all women. I said, for the day to be truly progressive, it should focus on elevating the voices and experiences of those who are most often silenced and ignored in society. I felt it seemed reductive to summarise women as walking vaginas – isn’t that a similar approach to that of misogynists?
I think that's a fair enough point actually

@Waitwhat23 I'm familiar with the topic.

[quote Innocenta]@FFSFFSFFS I phrased it quite badly. I didn't mean my sympathy for any woman is limited when it comes to her needs for a specific type of accommodation in hospital. I see how it's possible for my post to read that way, and I apologise.

I was trying to convey my wider discomfort with some aspects of the GC movement (although I think others are valid and fair). For example, I do think there is a lot of transphobia under GC colours, and that really does trouble and upset me very much. I truly believe that it should be possible to support women's rights, even to be a radical feminist, and also to support trans people. But I sincerely didn't intend to sound as though I was unconcerned over any woman in hospital. I am often admitted myself and I know that anyone in that situation is very vulnerable. [/quote]
Are you aware that 'The Telegraph has previouslyrevealed that NHS Trusts across the countryhave issued guidance that says patients should be admitted based on the gender they identify with and therefore can choose which ward, lavatory and shower facilities they use. Some trusts have labelled those patients who express discomfort as transphobic, compared them to racists in official guidelines and ordered staff to report them to police for hate crimes.' ? (my bolds)

Quoted from this article - <a class="break-all" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20211016221759/www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/10/16/nhs-hospitals-will-given-guidance-keeping-single-sex-wards-equalities/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">web.archive.org/web/20211016221759/www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/10/16/nhs-hospitals-will-given-guidance-keeping-single-sex-wards-equalities/

Women aren't allowed to have needs, according to current official guidance by the NHS (though thankfully that is under review). That's our point. That's not anti trans. That's pro woman.

I thought I'd share what Munroe Bergdorf thought of women mentioning reproductive rights on a women's march. Since Munroe wrote this, women in Texas have lost access to abortion, btw.

Munroe Bergdorf: 'Women Are Getting Feminism Wrong'Model and activist Munroe Bergdorf says feminism needs to include everyone – and not leave transgender women like herself behind

Feminism: the advocacy of women’s rights based on the equality of the sexes. A simple enough concept, right? Wrong! This is 2018 and if the past two years have taught us anything, it’s that nothing is simple any more – especially when it comes to matters of equality and identity.

As a society, our understanding of the language we use to describe aspects of gender, sex and sexuality is evolving. We’re beginning to understand that identity isn’t always black and white, it’s more like a sliding scale in which all can self-identify. What makes a woman ‘a woman’ has no definitive answer, nor does it need one.

A woman is more than a vagina, than her ability to bear children, the gender she was assigned at birth, a socio-economic class, marital status or sexual history – yet every one of these points has been used to define and control a woman’s place in society. This is why feminism must serve as an inclusive tool of liberation for all female identities and experiences, not just some.Thisis where so many women are still getting it wrong.

An example – January saw the second annual Women’s March in major cities in the US and UK. Rightfully charged up in the wake of the #MeToo and #TimesUp movements, hundreds of thousands of women took to the streets to show a united front against abuse and harassment. But in among the banners, a well-intentioned yet misguided symbol of women’s equality was worn by protestors – the pink pussy hat.

It might seem like a fun, inoffensive and light-hearted accessory, designed to unite women, but it feeds into a narrative that continues to push us apart. Last month, prior to the march I tweeted a reminder to those participating that it was an event for all women. I said, for the day to be truly progressive, it should focus on elevating the voices and experiences of those who are most often silenced and ignored in society. I felt it seemed reductive to summarise women as walking vaginas – isn’t that a similar approach to that of misogynists?

Almost immediately, I was shut down with a tidal wave of rebuttal, largely from cisgender women who seemed to believe that it was my desire to ‘co-opt the female experience’. Some said transgender issues are a ‘special case’ that not ‘all women’ should be expected to relate to. I stressed that you don’t need to be able to relate to somebody to exercise a sense of empathy. Injustice is injustice and trans women have a place under the umbrella of ‘all women’.Ultimately, this demonstrated to me a lack of interest about what we as trans people go through emotionally – it seems that that’s not quite as exciting as what we may choose to do with our bodies in a medical sense. These women do not see me as a ‘real woman’. Therefore they do not believe I had the right to be demanding space within a day that should be used to bring attention to issues that I too face at the hands of the patriarchy.

Trans women can’t continue to be an afterthought, especially when statistically we are the most at risk when it comes to issues of mental health, sexual assault, unemployment and homelessness. Our experiences must be approached with the same urgency in which we address the issues affecting cisgender women.

In the past, my relationships with cisgender women have been a valuable source of strength. There is great power in having allies and making use of social privilege to empower those who don’t have the same level of access. Lacking from so many conversations around feminism and equality is the acknowledgement of privilege and a strategy on how to use it to uplift women who are most at risk. If we’re going to have conversations about rape and sexual assault, we also need to talk about sex workers’ rights. We need to talk about the fact that the average life expectancy of a transgender woman of colour is just 35, largely because they’re statistically more likely to end up in sex work to survive.

As a trans woman, I find it so distressing to see the media host conversations about abuse, yet consistently fail to focus on such issues. In doing so they’re perpetuating the idea that safety and dignity is only for some women. I long to see more cisgender women in positions of influence standing up for trans women, making people aware of issues that may not affect all of us, but that we should all care about deeply.

In the same vein, we need to see more women who identify as straight standing up for lesbians. More Christian women standing with Muslim women. More able- bodied women standing with disabled women. For feminism to be an empowering sisterhood that all women bene t from, we must stop prioritising the experiences of only certain kinds of women and stand up for women who are different to ourselves.

We must learn to see all women’s experiences as worthy of being listened to within feminist discourse. Because the fact is not all women possess a functioning reproductive system, not all women have a vagina, not all women’s vaginas are pink. So, when ‘pink pussies’ are used as imagery intended to unify all women, what they are actually doing is excluding a large amount of women from feeling like they have a voice within feminism.

graziadaily.co.uk/life/opinion/munroe-bergdorf-women-getting-feminism-wrong/

Lots of stuff to unpack there. Munroe, vulvas and vaginas are different things, darling.

@Lovelyricepudding The colloquial term and the classification of “indigenous” doesn’t just mean “been there for a very long time.” For example there’s the Congo (forgetting if this is DRC, or the country itself.) You could say that most people living in the nation state of “the congo” are indigenous because they’ve been there for a long time. However, when describing the indigenous people of the congo it doesn’t refer to all people genetically there for a long time.

An example of an indigenous group within the Congo would be the Aka people. Their traditions and practices are indigenous because they are highly tied with the land around them, and as such cannot be separated from the land around them. They live in relation with the world around them. That’s usually what gets called “indigenous”.

Completely separate from the matter at hand but I thought i’d share.

Hark at EeeI pretending to give a shit about women when it suits.
You've been asked multiple times pn here over the years about your lack of compassion for all the women who will be excluded from their own single sex spaces if we allow Males into them and not a dicky bird from you.

Yes I am Indigenous to North America. The word does apply in the European context but that’s a whole other thing.

The word does apply in the European context. I am indigenous as are the majority of people in Britain. The problem is that it's use is normally associated with nationalistic far right parties. But that not mean there are not 'native' populations.

Well the HCPs knew the person in question was a woman, even if another woman in the ward didn't know
Didn't stop the person in question being harassed/intimidated and told she didn't belong there as she was a man, though did it?

I think it probably depends on a range of factor, a lot of trans men pass quite well so would go unnoticed, and many may well the dignity of being on a ward inline with their gender to being on a female ward where many women might object to their presence.

I think a trans man who passes reasonably well would certainly be safer than a trans woman who passes reasonably well, but I think a common sense approach would be to let him decide which ward he wants to be on assuming he is able to.

@FFSFFSFFS I phrased it quite badly. I didn't mean my sympathy for any woman is limited when it comes to her needs for a specific type of accommodation in hospital. I see how it's possible for my post to read that way, and I apologise.

I was trying to convey my wider discomfort with some aspects of the GC movement (although I think others are valid and fair). For example, I do think there is a lot of transphobia under GC colours, and that really does trouble and upset me very much. I truly believe that it should be possible to support women's rights, even to be a radical feminist, and also to support trans people. But I sincerely didn't intend to sound as though I was unconcerned over any woman in hospital. I am often admitted myself and I know that anyone in that situation is very vulnerable.

yes there’s an issue there and it’s annoying. But to join in with the the “gender critical” movement which directs hate and aggression towards trans women and trans people generally is overkill for what is infighting within a movement.

You don't have their authority to assess things for me, or to tell me what is a proportional reaction, petal. It is not "infighting", it is unrestrained aggression towards women discussing their own needs and I'm not making excuses for it any more.

To hate women so much, as they do, that we cannot even talk about DOMESTIC VIOLENCE, shows the level of dogmatic and ideological brainwashing that the TRAs have engaged in.

I wonder what the simpering apologists for the Meninists on here think about that? That we can't even talk about a normal issue like Domestic Violence?

I bet they are gleeful in their striking a blow for men.