Woman on ward - complains about male patient. Is discharged.

KittenKong · 2022-01-27T11:01:03+00:00

Going on twitter. She was in a Women’s ward (signage says ‘women’ but later this was disputed by staff). Another patient on ward ‘Annie’ (not real name). Visitor comes in ‘Hello Fred’. Woman patient complains that there is a male in the ward. Staff come on handed and tell her that there isn’t (and that there were no single sec wards) - and treated as if she is a troublemaker. Woman mysteriously discharged PDQ, although not quite feeling well enough in herself. [[https://twitter.com/gillyism/status/1486596070096478209?s=21]] Baroness is on the case.

Migrainesbythedozen · 06/02/2022 03:39

@EeeICouldRipATissue

know I'm late to this but how fucking telling is the last line? Who of us heard this as the crap was being beaten out of us? Yes, that was my whole POINT!!! It's abuser language. So why can people not hear it or refuse to hear it when the exact same shit is being said from so called GC side?!

LOOK WHAT YOU MADE US DO

Every woman reading this has shivers up her spine now.

@EeeICouldRipATissue So why can people not hear it or refuse to hear it when the exact same shit is being said from so called GC side?!

It was said from the TRA side.

EeeICouldRipATissue · 06/02/2022 00:45

know I'm late to this but how fucking telling is the last line?
Who of us heard this as the crap was being beaten out of us?
Yes, that was my whole POINT!!!
It's abuser language.
So why can people not hear it or refuse to hear it when the exact same shit is being said from so called GC side?!

LOOK WHAT YOU MADE US DO

Every woman reading this has shivers up her spine now.

Terfydactyl · 05/02/2022 23:05

@barleybadminton

Do you or do you not think that women have the right to a single sex, female only ward where they can be guaranteed that everyone in there is actually female?

But that isn't practically possible.

And what about male guests, porters, nurses, cleaners and doctors?

You know the NHS is vast right. I mean enormous As of this year 1.4 million staff and a budget of 100 million. This as far as I know does not include GPs or dentists GPs 300 thousands Dentists 47 thousand

So in fact it is practically possible. Many women have multiple times said when necessary having a fully female team.

So you are as usual wrong.

Terfydactyl · 05/02/2022 22:53

@EeeICouldRipATissue

You must be proud of your contribution to this situation Never mind you know, the woman kicking off at the other woman, she's an innocent in all this is she?! Trans people and allies, this is your fault! Look what you made us do!

I know I'm late to this but how fucking telling is the last line? Who of us heard this as the crap was being beaten out of us?

LOOK WHAT YOU MADE US DO

Every woman reading this has shivers up her spine now.

Waitwhat23 · 05/02/2022 15:01

@EeeICouldRipATissue

Innocenta There are positions other than 'trans women are the most oppressed' and 'trans women are the least oppressed, you know.

waitwhat
Not according to our elected representatives. From the article

answer to a question about whether it’s bigoted to say only women have a cervix, Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer said: “We need to bear in mind that the trans community are amongst the most marginalised and abused communities.”

Asked to give his thoughts on Kemi Badenoch’s reported comments that LGBT activism has gone from wanting freedom to marry who you want, to men wanting to use women’s bathrooms, London Mayor Sadiq Khan replied: “The trans community is one of the most vulnerable in our society

All you're quoting there though is innocenta's point?.
That there is positions between most oppressed and least oppressed?
But you seem to be arguing otherwise
Your key words in the quoted bit are amongst and one of the most marginalised communities.

Nope. I'm arguing that elected representatives are doing nothing to address other oppressed groups. If transpeople are not the most oppressed, why is the focus solely, obsessively on tackling transphobia? Where is the concern for other oppressed groups?

DdraigGoch · 05/02/2022 15:00

@EeeICouldRipATissue

That link shows there has been murders, though. How many murders do you seem not enough to bother about and therefore shows they're '' safe '' (in somes eyes?)

A murder. One. In many years. Compared with god knows how many homicides committed against female victims.

After adjusting for population size, trans people are far less likely to be murdered than the population as a whole.

Rheopecticfluid · 05/02/2022 14:56

I dont understand that if it really was a woman, definitely not a man why would one woman have to leave ? Why and how would the hospital prove after the fact that it was a biological cunty type woman? If that could be done easily without breaking all kinds of rules, why not do it at the time?

It certainly sounds a bit stinky to me.

Terfydactyl · 05/02/2022 14:49

@EeeICouldRipATissue

A biological woman will always look woman enough because that’s what they are Like the biological woman this thread is about, you mean? Yeah, that didn't work out so well for her, did it as she clearly didn't look '' woman '' enough.

Didnt work out well for gilly? Who was removed from the hospital. Whilst still not well. Worked out just fine for the other woman who was allowed to stay. I dont understand that if it really was a woman, definitely not a man why would one woman have to leave ? Why and how would the hospital prove after the fact that it was a biological cunty type woman? If that could be done easily without breaking all kinds of rules, why not do it at the time?

EeeICouldRipATissue · 05/02/2022 14:46

Innocenta
There are positions other than 'trans women are the most oppressed' and 'trans women are the least oppressed, you know.

waitwhat
Not according to our elected representatives. From the article

answer to a question about whether it’s bigoted to say only women have a cervix, Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer said: “We need to bear in mind that the trans community are amongst the most marginalised and abused communities.”

Asked to give his thoughts on Kemi Badenoch’s reported comments that LGBT activism has gone from wanting freedom to marry who you want, to men wanting to use women’s bathrooms, London Mayor Sadiq Khan replied: “The trans community is one of the most vulnerable in our society

All you're quoting there though is innocenta's point?.
That there is positions between most oppressed and least oppressed?
But you seem to be arguing otherwise
Your key words in the quoted bit are amongst and one of the most marginalised communities.

Whatwouldscullydo · 05/02/2022 14:00

But how can you discuss the policies of males on a female ward if you won't discuss what criteria you feel would justify placing males on a female ward and why that criteria is beneficial to all patients on the ward and how you think this particular set of undefined criteria could be policed in a way that doesn't align witg "GC feminists" as you disagree and with them but also fits within your undefined criteria that you won't say what it is

Innocenta · 05/02/2022 13:57

@PurgatoryOfPotholes

I always wonder about the conflation of very different experiences under the umbrella of "transgender community".

I find it implausible that we can lump together the experiences of a bisexual female teenager identifying as trans, a homosexual male teenager identifying as trans, and the experiences of a 40 year old heterosexual male identifying as trans.

@PurgatoryOfPotholes Yes, totally agree on this. I also feel this way about the "LGBTQ+" community taken as a presumably unified group. It's very irritating that referring to LGB is seen by some as "terfy" or rightwing, as opposed to neutrally specific.

Innocenta · 05/02/2022 13:56

@Whatwouldscullydo Yes, I realise you want to have a pointless, time wasting argument because you're annoyed that I disagree with you. Unfortunately I'm not willing to waste my very limited energy on doing that with you. Either we talk about the actual issue, or we don't talk.

I've made it very clear that I'm happy to discuss it. But I just see no value in going round and round over basic theoretical stuff.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 05/02/2022 13:50

I always wonder about the conflation of very different experiences under the umbrella of "transgender community".

I find it implausible that we can lump together the experiences of a bisexual female teenager identifying as trans, a homosexual male teenager identifying as trans, and the experiences of a 40 year old heterosexual male identifying as trans.

Whatwouldscullydo · 05/02/2022 13:46

Then why if they aren't oppressed and I'm fact remain in the oppressor class as you cant change sex, do you believe they belong on a female. Ward.

You haven't explained what women get out if this policy and why what they lose is less important than how a male feels.

Innocenta · 05/02/2022 13:45

@Innocenta

I think femicide should be the leading concern for our elected representatives. Which I guess most GC feminists would agree with?

(I mean when it comes to crime, sorry.)

Innocenta · 05/02/2022 13:44

I think femicide should be the leading concern for our elected representatives. Which I guess most GC feminists would agree with?

Innocenta · 05/02/2022 13:43

I don't know why, but you're not going to get the answer to that question from someone who doesn't subscribe to that view (that TW are the most oppressed) in the first place.

Waitwhat23 · 05/02/2022 13:37

Not according to our elected representatives. From the article -

'In his much-mocked answer to a question about whether it’s bigoted to say only women have a cervix, Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer said: “We need to bear in mind that the trans community are amongst the most marginalised and abused communities.”

Asked to give his thoughts on Kemi Badenoch’s reported comments that LGBT activism has gone from wanting freedom to marry who you want, to men wanting to use women’s bathrooms, London Mayor Sadiq Khan replied: “The trans community is one of the most vulnerable in our society.”

Liberal Democrat leader Sir Ed Davey, presumably on his own accord, even tweeted that “The trans community is one of the most discriminated against in the UK” in order to condemn a story that the government was unlikely to introduce self ID in order to protect women’s spaces.'

Where is their concern for other oppressed groups? Why are there not discussion changes topolicies, change in law and language to support other groups? Why is the trope always 'trans people are the most oppressed group'?

Innocenta · 05/02/2022 13:31

@Waitwhat23 I agree entirely that they're not the most oppressed group. I've read that link before.

There are positions other than 'trans women are the most oppressed' and 'trans women are the least oppressed, you know.

Waitwhat23 · 05/02/2022 13:25

Sorry, link didn't work - thecritic.co.uk/neither-marginalised-abused-nor-vulnerable/

Waitwhat23 · 05/02/2022 13:24

I think it's frankly bonkers and a deliberate misinterpretation of the facts as stated by C4 to claim transwomen are the safest demographic.

And I think it's bonkers and a deliberate misinterpretation of the facts to claim that transwomen are the most oppressed group.

The UK is one of the safest places in the world to be trans or non binary, despite the oft repeated trope of 'most marginalised and oppressed' -thecritic.co.uk/neither-marginalised-abused-nor-vulnerable/

There are undoubtedly places in the world where this is not the case, but it's a bit pointless to pretend that the situation in other countries can be extrapolated as if applies here too - the awful statistic of murdered Brazilian transwomen sex workers is applied as a statistic to 'prove' that transpeople in the UK are at similar risk. They're not.

Do I believe that transpeople receive abuse? Yes. Obviously transphobia exists. Does it mean they are the most oppressed group? No. I can think of several other groups and protected characteristics who are the subject of abuse and violence. Where is the focus on protecting them?

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 05/02/2022 13:00

@yourhairiswinterfire

If you read the article. One person stabbed. Possibly to do with sex work.

Stabbed by a schizophrenic man, IIRC.

Didn't stop TRA Twitter jumping at the chance to blame feminists for the violent actions of a mentally ill man though

Indeed

Woman on ward - complains about male patient. Is discharged.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 05/02/2022 12:58

@EeeICouldRipATissue

At the hands if males no doubt You have no way of knowing that though, you're just guessing, hence your "no doubt '' Yes, most of it probably is but abuse is abuse whoever it's coming from whether male or female

If you think women are attacking transwomen, why do you want to place transwomen in women's wards and endanger them?

yourhairiswinterfire · 05/02/2022 12:57

If you read the article. One person stabbed. Possibly to do with sex work.

Stabbed by a schizophrenic man, IIRC.

Didn't stop TRA Twitter jumping at the chance to blame feminists for the violent actions of a mentally ill man though

Theeyeballsinthesky · 05/02/2022 12:46

I see we’re onto ‘women kill occasionally so you can’t say men are more dangerous’ on the bingo card

Answer is still no

Male violence is not women a problem to solve

Somehow I doubt TRA are over on pistonhead scolding men for being mean