Page 2 | advice for what we should do if the police visit?

vivariumvivariumsvivaria · 2022-01-24T15:39:07+00:00

It occurred to me that I have no idea what I should do if the police came to my door. Am I right in thinking that if they request an interview you can refuse to attend until you have posted on MN? Can anyone point a boring, conformist, clean living woman who may have written polite emails, harbour stickers and haberdashery (and who is definitely offensively female) in the direction of practical advice? I think Ceri Black politely refused all invitations to go to the station, Marion Millar and PP both attended with a solicitor, and Granarchist went alone. Because, frankly, I'm now at the stage of "bring it on".

TurquoiseBaubles · 26/01/2022 13:14

No I didn't. I have answered your question twice.

I presumed (rightly) that you were talking about the same crowdfunders that all the TRAs talk about - they (and you) always say "and then they ran off with the money and went silent".

Most women and indeed men know that no-one can change sex.

If you want to see "bonkers obsessed irrational bigots who've fallen down a conspiracy hole and have no grasp on reality" it's worth looking in a mirror

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 26/01/2022 12:53

Most people do find it difficult not to comment, which is why I wouldn't recommend it as an option without first consulting a solicitor, and having said solicitor in the same room during the interview.

That's what KJK recommends. With the addition of reading the prepared statement (statement prepared by solicitor).

BlueberryCheezecake · 26/01/2022 12:50

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TurquoiseBaubles · 26/01/2022 12:34

What's your definition of a woman?

What springs to mind is the continual accusations levelled at crowdfunders for adult human females. But you know that. Women-haters really hate women raising money to help other women.

BlueberryCheezecake · 26/01/2022 12:14

@TurquoiseBaubles

Yes, you are obviously directing it at women. In fact, you and Barley seem to be running tag team on accusing women of defrauding donors to crowdfunders.

You really, really don't like women do you?

I am a woman.

And as it happens, I can think of a number of GC crowdfunders which raised substantial amounts for a stated purpose which never materialised.

But please, I'm fascinated to know who in particular sprang to mind for you at the mention of someone crowdfunding for legal fees then going awol with the cash?

EarthSight · 26/01/2022 11:30

@GenderCriticalDad

If denied menstrual products would leaving bloody handprints everywhere be a valid response.

Don't know, but some women have such heavy periods that they practically gush or piss blood when they cough, sneeze or move in a certain way.

EarthSight · 26/01/2022 11:22

After what I've read of police conduct, it scares to think how many misogynistic police officers are absolutely loving this moment in history when they can intimidate and punish women in a way they would have found more difficult to do more than a decade ago. They are really having their moment, aren't they?

JohnRokesmith · 26/01/2022 06:21

I wonder whether the court would accept "I refused to comment because, well, have you seen Mumsnet?" as a justification?

My problem will be only saying "no comment". I have few skills in the "keeping my mouth shut" department.

Most people do find it difficult not to comment, which is why I wouldn't recommend it as an option without first consulting a solicitor, and having said solicitor in the same room during the interview.

I once worked on a particular matter where an individual in a police interview answered no comment to every question, except for providing a truthful, non-incriminating, three-word answer to a single question ... and that led them to submitting a guilty plea on legal advice a week later, leading to seven years in prison.

This is, of course, why you need a lawyer, and why you need to listen to what they tell you.

TurquoiseBaubles · 26/01/2022 00:08

Yes, you are obviously directing it at women. In fact, you and Barley seem to be running tag team on accusing women of defrauding donors to crowdfunders.

You really, really don't like women do you?

BlueberryCheezecake · 25/01/2022 21:51

@TurquoiseBaubles

I thought we weren't allowed to make generalisations about an entire group of people? Blueberry seems to get away with it, including an accusation of fraud and dishonesty against gender critical women, in general.

I'm not usually keen on reporting, but should Mumsnet really let such an accusation stay, especially as it's not too hard to work out who in particular it's directed at

Bit of an own goal here, Turquoise - if you think you know who it's directed at, you must be able to recognise the sequence of events, which only goes to confirm there's some truth to it.

Original poster

vivariumvivariumsvivaria · 25/01/2022 19:53

@JohnRokesmith "when in court you can say you refused to comment on the basis of legal advice, though you obviously have to speak to a solicitor first"

I wonder whether the court would accept "I refused to comment because, well, have you seen Mumsnet?" as a justification?

My problem will be only saying "no comment". I have few skills in the "keeping my mouth shut" department.

@HereticFanjo - footner. Good idea. I did it once, it was weird, but picking my feet might pass the time in the station.

They have come for the schools, the unis, the refuges, the jails, the rape crisis, the Guides, the midwives, the unions, the Arts, the sports, the billionaires, the politicians, the media and many women who have far more interesting opinions than mine.

They will come for me. And, woe betide them.

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Rhannion · 25/01/2022 15:12

Possibly better to say nothing at all?

HereticFanjo · 25/01/2022 14:50

I might finally get round to using my Footner thing 🤔

JohnRokesmith · 25/01/2022 10:35

@Donkeyinamanger

In theory the court can draw an inference from a no comment interview, (doubt your truthfulness basically if you later come up with a defence) however that doesn't often seem to happen. No comment interview does stop you dropping yourself in it by accidentally admitting to more than you intended. It's probably good advice in most cases.

You should actually get appropriate advice from a solicitor before committing to a "no comment" interview. It is almost impossible to draw negative inferences in court from such an interview (when in court you can say you refused to comment on the basis of legal advice, though you obviously have to speak to a solicitor first). However, refusing to comment may prolong your police experience, particularly as most officers really just want an explanation of events; proper legal advice will let you know whether you are better making a prepared statement or answering all questions.

What you should never do is answer some questions, and respond with "no comment" to others. That really does make you look guilty, and is likely to harm you if a case ever comes to court.

ProfessorSillyStuff · 25/01/2022 09:34

It's so awfully sad that women feel like this about the police after the events of the last two years. In my life, I feel they did protect me in the immediate when I was in a horribly abusive relationship in my teens but didn't help in the longer term ( no dv specialist, risk assessment, idva, refuge or suzi/freedom project, no housing, no concequence for perp)

In a relationship with abusive ex mid 20s I hit him back after much abuse from him and I called police for help and they cautioned me and not him, as I told the truth but he lied. Not good.

In ine more recent years since Laura Richards and the coercive control law they were much better. I was able to obtain the occupation order with the help of the agencies they referred me to. They handled it really well and saw that it was abuse and making me ill despite it being no physical. I felt they were my heroes, and I still feel that, but again I feel I am more wary of them now. What a shame.

Donkeyinamanger · 25/01/2022 08:47

In theory the court can draw an inference from a no comment interview, (doubt your truthfulness basically if you later come up with a defence) however that doesn't often seem to happen. No comment interview does stop you dropping yourself in it by accidentally admitting to more than you intended. It's probably good advice in most cases.

FlowerArranger · 25/01/2022 07:07

There are several references to "no comment interviews" in this thread. How does this square with the bit about "things you rely on later in court" part of the reading of rights?

FannyCann · 25/01/2022 06:43

BlueberryCheezecake
Based on previous GC arrests, the thing to do seems to be to immediately start a crowdfunder to cover your legal fees, then once the charges get dropped, go mysteriously quiet and don't tell anyone what's happened to their money or whether they're going to get it back.

Although I am reminded there is still a Gofundme with over £10k raised to pay for someone to give birth in Sweden to get a birth certificate giving false information about the parent of the child. The baby having arrived early this plan has been scuppered. What to do with the £10k 🤷‍♀️
It's a conundrum isn't it.

advice for what we should do if the police visit?

Datun · 25/01/2022 03:24

This seems to be the same advice as others have given. What do you think is wrong with what others have said?

I was wondering that.

Rhannion · 25/01/2022 01:34

@BlueberryCheezecake

Based on previous GC arrests, the thing to do seems to be to immediately start a crowdfunder to cover your legal fees, then once the charges get dropped, go mysteriously quiet and don't tell anyone what's happened to their money or whether they're going to get it back.

😂😂😂 Women give, and have given money to support others who are in need for whatever reason. We each decide who to give to, when and how much, so we don’t need any “ advice “ , comments or guidance from you. HTH

DdraigGoch · 25/01/2022 01:28

@HirplesWithHaggis

If you admit guilt to your solicitor, they cannot enter a "not guilty" plea for you. They can argue in mitigation.

They will point this out to you.

But then admitting to flyposting some stickers is not admitting to harassment or any other trumped-up charges. It's best to be completely open and honest with your solicitor. In the sort of cases we're talking about, no crime was committed (other than really minor FPN-level stuff like littering or flyposting) so the job of the solicitor is to point out the large holes in the prosecution case that mean that the CPS wouldn't touch it with a bargepole.

Rhannion · 25/01/2022 01:26

@RocketPanda

I reckon I am a lot older than some posters here so have less to lose in terms of employment, status etc. I may or may not have been in possession of stickers. I may or may not have given stickers to another person. I may or may not have left offensive ribbons in public places. They can come for me, I don't care.

Me too Rocket! Let the fuckers come...💚🤍💜

HirplesWithHaggis · 25/01/2022 01:09

If you admit guilt to your solicitor, they cannot enter a "not guilty" plea for you. They can argue in mitigation.

They will point this out to you.

SomewhereOnlyIKnow · 24/01/2022 21:02

I’ve always wondered if you tell your solicitor the truth, but then they tell you what to say to the police, or do you not tell them what you’ve really done ?

Original poster

vivariumvivariumsvivaria · 24/01/2022 20:57

This is very helpful, so thank you to the PPs.

I am aiming to not get arrested, but I am also of the opinion that as engaging in the democratic process and a bit of amateurish NVDA has not helped focus my elected representatives minds on the sex based needs of women and girls then perhaps my NVDA game needs to be upped. If there is a mass protest or action then I'm there, and I do not think that a women's refusal to "go home and sit down" would be tolerated in Scotland.

Afghan women went to university, they had jobs, they could travel and make choices a few years and a lifetime ago.

"Never forget that a political, economical or religious crisis will be enough to cast doubt on women's rights. These rights will never be vested. You'll have to stay vigilant your whole life" Simone de Beauvoir

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