Sperm stealing and men's rights - what do you think?

I am heartily sick of the whole of society pretending there's nothing men can do to stop women getting pregnant. They're not fucking infants. Presumably they've heard of condoms. If they don't wear one, they should assume there's a good chance of pregnancy regardless of what the woman says to him.

Only 83% of the time

Yes but there is an ethical dimension to all of the medical and other issues you correctly set out under risks and experiences so couldn't agree more with the content of your post except the statement I highlighted.

"A man removing a condom during sex is a similar act, ethically". - well if you put aside the risk of STDs, the woman not consenting to the man ejaculating inside the woman and that in some nations it constitutes rape or sexual assault.

But, to play devil’s advocate, what’s the difference between that and a man removing a condom during sex?
Is it that a condom also protects against STDs and isn’t something the woman can take responsibility for alone ie no one can say “well if she didn’t want an STD she should have done X” in the way you’ve said “if he didn’t want children, he should have done x”?

A man removing a condom during sex is a similar act, ethically. However, choosing to have unprotected sex knowing that you are trusting your partner to use contraception isn't quite the same as starting sex and your partner removing the contraception covertly part way through.
There is also the fact that pregnancy is a medical condition that only affects women not men so they cannot be seen as equivalent.
It is also far more likely that a man will pass an STI to a woman than vice versa.
As ever, our biology means that our risks and experiences are different.

I have a son and a daughter, and having thought about it I think I would be equally upset if either were lied to by a partner about contraception and pushed into parenthood as a result.
And what about the child in all this? Why would anyone bring a child into the world with someone they knew didn't want to be a parent, or with a fling or one night stand?
Seems like very dubious behaviour to me.

how do you tell the difference between a woman....

If a man wants to be sure he doesn't have any children, then he needs to take full responsibility for that.

I'm so tired of the ever growing list of things that are apparently a womans job to do.

How do you tell the difference a woman who did do that or the man who said he had a vasectomy when he hadn't or the man who never asked if a woman was on birth control who both SAY they thought she was on contraception?
Does that also mean a rapist should be able to take his victim to court because she wasn't on contraception when he raped her?

It's all going to come down to he said/she said.

The solution is quite simple, "wrap it up" before engaging in sex with someone you don't trust or want to parent with.

Will no one think of the poor men and their right to ... choose not to use barrier protection when having sex. Or to walk any from any responsibility for children they jointly conceive while choosing not to use barrier protection when having sex. Or something.

Will the onus be on the woman to show she had a prescription for oral contraception, read the leaflet, took it correctly then put in place several systems to ensure she remembered every day? Or perhaps some expectation of an implant as a default.

Is the sanction a mandatory abortion so the man doesn't have the psychological discomfort of having a baby he wouldn't have to carry then pay for though he doesn't carry the baby anyway? Or just not to have to pay anything though he might choose to get in touch when the DC is an adult if he wants to? If so, many, many men seem to manage that just fine from the statistics.

It would be impossible to prove.

I know quite a few women who fell pregnant accidentally, I don't know if it was on purpose, but the statistics suggest that at least some were.

If that is the case, a lot of women could be in hot water.

Tricking a man into becoming a father seems immoral to me, I know a baby is a natural outcome of sex but the chances are much lower if the female partner is on the pill, not putting holes in condoms etc.

Are you going to come back @loubeatty

My knee jerk reaction to this is it’s absolutely awful and men should have access to protections from this.
Then my logical brain kicks in and I realise they do have access to protection from this happening… condoms

You would land up with women who fell pregnant because contraception is not 100%* being charged with a crime, when actually, they fell foul of the law of averages.

(*which raises the question, "why not?". Medical advances have been huge in the last century. You'd think controlling fertility would be one of the easier problems to solve)

No.
Men need to use condoms or have vasectomies if they don't want children.
If they trust a partner who then lies to them that is terrible but it's not a criminal offence.

And your last statement, I guess it’s true in an ideal world but people are capable of lying to partners of many years. So I think it’s a little unfair to say “don’t have sex with someone you can’t trust”. I trust DH, but it’s not impossible for me to be wrong in that judgement. DH and I don’t use condoms and the reason for that is that I trust he isn’t having an affair and therefore STDs are not a concern (and he trusts me on that as well). If it turned out I was wrong in my trust, and I caught chlamydia because actually he is having an affair, am I an idiot for having unprotected sex with someone I can’t trust, or he is a liar and in the wrong.
Someone could lie about being on the pill regardless of how long you’ve known them or what the relationship is.

Maybe scientists could invent something that allows men to take control of it if they don't want a child
Some sort of sheath perhaps that stops the sperm from entering the woman.

Maybe one day that will be invented.

All I see here is a way for men to claim it's the woman's fault.

Bend and snap

Its takes two to tango. We all know that one of the risks of intercourse is pregnancy. Don’t see your petician going anywhere. Its a bit extreme.

I think it should be a crime, yes. It's immoral. But its also impossible to prove.

Far better for both men and women to take individual responsibility. If he doesn't want to be a father, he wears a condom or doesn't have sex. If she doesn't want to be pregnant, she goes on the pill (or method of choice) or doesn't have sex. Maybe that means they double up, even better for them if they don't both want a child.

Surely this is a case of two adults each taking responsibility for their own contraception. The woman ensures she does not let her egg become fertilised. The man ensures he does not allow his sperm to escape, either by using a condom or by having the snip.

I'd never ever rely on a man for contraception. Men need to stop expecting women to do it for them.

Seems pretty straightforward to me !