Sperm stealing and men's rights - what do you think?

The thing is even if he was, who is actually in the wrong here?

Both surely? She was knowingly taking it without permission, he was (if the hot sauces was for the purpose I suspect) knowingly causing harm.

I’d also add that it would NOT stop the man to have any responsibility for the child. He could have used a condom, not have sex etc.. if he REALLY didn’t want a child.

There is a question as to how you would prove that or how often it happens tbh. But o know my aunt (years and years ago) was going in about not taking the pill (and not telling her then husband) so they could age another child. She was hoping this would stop her cheating husband from moving out.
Thank god her plan didn’t work (no child and yes he left)

I have had consensual sex before where we agreed my partner would wear a condom. He took it off when I didn't see him do it and had sex with me without a condom because of his personal preference for how it felt. I didn't realise until after so I couldn't ask him to stop.
If I'd gotten pregnant from that would they prosecute him or would it be my fault for not taking the morning after pill?

One could argue it never would've happened to her in the first place if she hadn't attempted to steal the sperm. Like students who put laxatives in their milk to catch the milk thief housemate.

So if a woman is found guilty of this criminal offence will the man then not be obliged to support the child?

Another way to avoid paying maintenance?

A man shouldn't just rely on a woman to prevent a pregnancy. What steps is he taking.
Wear a condom, pull out, have the snip. Something else?

Apparently he had consensual sex with a condoms and then afterwards went into the bathroom, removed the filled condom and put hot sauce in it to kill the sperm.

I’m a bit dubious about his claim that the hot sauce was to kill the sperm. A) why would anyone have hot sauce in the bathroom? And B) he was in the bathroom- he could have rinsed out the condom before chucking it in the bin.

Suspect he knew the woman was going to try and steal the semen and decided to revenge.

The misandry on Mumsnet gets worse every day. This should be the same as stealthing and having an unsuspecting man on the hook for CMS isn't on. That said the man should take precautions too and perhaps only insist on having sex with women if they have a implant or something that cannot easily fail.

But by recognising it in law as an immoral act it gives the victims a right to feel violated and an outlet to process their emotions. Men have a right to feel violated that a sexual partner has betrayed their trust and lied to them to gain their consent just as much as women do.

I think it should be treated the same as stealthing (secretly removing a condom during sex).

Very difficult to prove though. And I'd be worried about women being falsely accused when the pill doesn't work for whatever reason (and it's obvs not 100% effective).

Any lie that is so egregious that it would cause the other person to change the decision to have sex is a violation of free and informed consent.

This. It needs to be illegal not from the angle of thinking about it with regard to pregnancy but with regards to consent.

If you lie to someone to gain their consent you have not got informed consent.

How would you prove this? The pill isn't 100% reliable and is notoriously ineffective when taken incorrectly. Looking back, I used to take it incorrectly quite often in my 20s when I was quite lackadaisical about this sort of thing (different times of day, missing a pill, being sick). No evil intent, but life was quite chaotic then and I wasn't particularly organised. That's why it's sensible to double up on contraception if you're absolutely set on avoiding pregnancy.

Also, have you thought through the logical consequence of jailing women who 'trick' men into pregnancy? Namely that the parent who wants the child will be sent to jail and the child will either be left with the parent who doesn't want them or placed in care or with relatives. Hardly ideal.

If a man wants to be 100% sure he won't get a woman pregnant, don't have sex with her.
No contraception is 100% effective.
Of course it shouldn't be illegal, two people having consensual sex are consenting to possible pregnancy unless they know they're infertile.

Someone I know slept with someone who said she was on the pill

She wasn’t but had decided he would make a great dad!

Partly his fault as he should have used a condom

Ok now the child is here he is stepping up, but it’s not what he wanted at 20

How often does it happen, no idea. The idea that men (or women) are thinking clearly at all times during a passionate encounter, clearly enough to say 'stop I'll just go get a condom), is anon starter. A male pill is needed.

The reality is that feckless men would like everyone to believe women are always doing this but it's not true.

She tricked me is a common lie told by men who don't want to take responsibility.

Hi guys,
What about the menz?
Did you consider how unfair you are being to the supreme beings with your centering of wimpunds?

No. Becoming pregnant by deception is a desperate and unwise act, but not one that should be criminalised. And as everyone else has pointed out, a man who wants to ensure a particular sexual encounter does not result in a pregnancy can take responsibility for the disposal of his ejaculate.

When you say "looking to write about it", are you saying you're a journo fishing for ideas here?

I think men would be best served by campaigning for the development and widespread distribution of a male contraceptive pi^ll
^
Of course it's easier to blame women than to take responsibility.

Just as it's easy to wear a condom.

It's not slipped my notice that OP has still not returned yet.

So much plopping today

'Siri, how can I attract some MRAs to mumsnet?'