Peter Tatchell says bisexuality will be the new normal for many

So you can't - or won't - explain why you think an increase in bisexuality would lead to an erosion of consent?

Probably because she quite obviously doesn't think any such thing.

Blueberry. I speak in defense of bisexuality, for the love of god. You're misunderstanding entirely the point I'm making, which has hee haw to do with bisexuality - or any sexual orientation - and is to do with consent. Did you miss the bit where I said 'Being bisexual has nothing to do with blurring boundaries, at all. It just means being attracted to both males and females. Nothing 'blurry' there, at all.'?

Or are you just being wilfully obtuse as usual?

NO, I DONT THINK AN INCREASE IN BISEXUALITY WOULD LEAD TO AN EROSION OF CONSENT.

Okay?

Hopping on the thread to say that it would be great if bisexuality was more socially acceptable. It's not particularly easy to be "out" as bi, as someone said upfront lesbian groups are not welcoming of bi women, they seem to regard us as tourists (NALALT...) Straight men immediately think you'll be into threesomes

I wonder In.part if this is all a way to create problems in order to become relevant and even paid to " fix" them. We seemed to have gone from a point where any of it was completely unacceptable to a time where gay marriage became legal ( although obviously homphobia/biphobia does still exist) and it was bit more mainstream/acceptable. To time where everyone Is having to double down on /protect their sexual orientation and boundaries because of identity being peddled as nore important than sex. Turning what is probably a normal state of being for many people ( for instance only having sex with people you have an emotional connection with being a sub category of asexuality ) into an official kind of sexuality status with its own name/flag. And now encouraging a complete overshare amd over investment in sexuality to the point nany are sick of hearing/seeing it not because they are bigoted but because in many of the circumstances its completely irrelevant or unnecessary to have it even be a focus, that it's created uts own set of problems.leading to worse misconceptions or opinions than before. Isn't Peter tatchell involved with Educate amd Celebrate? So in order to stay relevant and keep themselves in a job these problems do need to be created so they can flog the solution.

Jesus wept, Blueberry.

Peter Tatchell is a dubious character for all the reasons mentioned.
Hopping on the thread to say that it would be great if bisexuality was more socially acceptable. It's not particularly easy to be "out" as bi, as someone said upfront lesbian groups are not welcoming of bi women, they seem to regard us as tourists (NALALT...) Straight men immediately think you'll be into threesomes

On this thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4196176-Consent-for-women

It was discussed in context of a programme - I think in US universities - about consent. 'no means no' was discussed as - does this imply a default 'yes' that one has to negate? Actively decline sex to avoid rape? OR should we start with a presumption of 'no' and people should seek active consent.

And certainly no adjusting of boundaries - in fact, wtf does he mean by describing orientation as a 'boundary'? Something is off there - is it the presumption of 'yes' rather than 'no', again? I can't quite put my finger on it.

It is that, I think. Rather than 'I am attracted to X or Y sex' it is predicated on 'I am excluding X or Y sex' as a boundary of 'who I will not sleep with'.

I've noticed this before, not sure if I've explained it well, but it is a switch of world view from 'who are you attracted to' (basic presumption of not sleeping with most people, singling out those to whom you are attracted) to 'who you will not sleep with' (basic presumption of sleeping with everyone, singling out those to whom you are not attracted).

This might not make sense yet. I am still trying to reason it out! But yes, that is 'blurring boundaries'. We have discussed this before when talking about consent - a presumption of 'yes' can perhaps be a very undesirable thing.

The idea that sexual orientation never changes for anyone and to disagree is homophobic is just a dogmatic statement, there's no logical necessary connection there.

I have a handful of friends who have declared they are bi and had very short lived lesbian relationships before reverting fully back to men.

Bisexuals are not welcome in the lesbian community though, or at least weren't when I had same sex relationships. People now mostly assume that I'm heterosexual because I have a child and my last relationship was with a man. I'd be open to a relationship with a woman, but then I feel as though I wouldn't fit well anywhere. Social pressure is a big thing.

I'm just not sure I agree. I'm straight and never dabbled and never wanted to. My lesbian friends have always been lesbians. I have a handful of friends who have declared they are bi and had very short lived lesbian relationships before reverting fully back to men. I know no bi men. Again exclusively straight or gay. The view that we're all bi doesn't chime at all with my experience of people.

'Homophobia' seems to have become 'being homosexual and saying no to hetero sex'. We live in odd times.

Tatchell, sadly, is a walking example of the distorted boundaries and perceptions that abused children can grow up with. I can see why he'd feel better if his personal perceptions were more usual, but I'd much prefer no other children were ever let down by responsible adults in the way he was.

When I tried to come out as bi as a teenager in the 80s I was told quite firmly by the l&g community that bisexuals didn't exist and I'd need to pick a side. I had solely same sex relationships for 10 years, but then when I started to see a man I was disowned by many of my lesbian friends. I do understand this to some degree but it was horrible to be on the receiving end of it.

That's a good spot. Why is it that some people are so keen to blur boundaries, remove barriers?

This video was in the replies to Tatchell, I hadn’t come across it before.

m.youtube.com/watch?v=n-NseFg2kno

No, being bi is its own thing, we’re not an overflow category for people wanting to ‘blur boundaries’ or experiment.

This. Peter Tatchell is not a useful authority on sexual behaviour.

That's me to a t Tabasco. I could appreciate a good looking guy . And I was fairly androgynous looking lad. Had a crush on a guy and we enjoyed kissing. But after that I couldn't make anything happen? Felt really silly but he was very understanding about it. Since he was really gorgeous that's that I guess - I'm just an old straight. Some lucky people are naturally bi sexual. Tatchell certainly isn't one of them.

Meh.

I was raised in a heavily hetero-normative world. I got "accused" of being gay for displaying "gender non-conforming" behaviour.
I pursued heterosexual relationships as:

1. I was genuinely attracted
2. it was the path of least resistance (and greater social acceptance)

Once I got over the fact that "lesbian" had been used against me as an insult in an attempt to control and define me, I started to accept I was also attracted to females. Very much so.

That's me. I'm bi.
Sometimes I like to fantasise that "everybody is gay until proven otherwise" (mostly to tease strongly heterosexual people), but deep inside I know sexual orientation is a scale, and you simply are what you are.
Whether you're free to express it or not is a different matter, and bi-erasure is real. But I don't believe the average number of bi people is likely to change overtime. The only thing that changes, is how visible we are (including to ourselves).
Some people will always be firmly and exclusively straight or gay. That does NOT make them bigots, and their boundaries must be respected.

I think this is really interesting. Sexual expression really varies between cultures and it is quite possible that he will be proved right. But there are still lots of homophobic men (more than women IMO) in our society... I wonder if that will change.

That's a good spot. Why is it that some people are so keen to blur boundaries, remove barriers

Funny how it's claimed small children know their sexuality in.order to justify inappropriate teaching content but then their boundaries are all blurred and maybe they aren't gay/straight at all.

Which is it?

There's a big difference between saying that more people can "admit" to being bisexual in a society where it is seen as socially acceptable, and saying that more people actually "become" bisexual.

Saying that people can actually change their sexual orientation is obviously extremely homophobic.