House of Lords debate #KeepPrisonsSingleSex

Because having a GRC is a private matter. Not even the MoJ have the right to see one.

The policy document which you linked previously makes it clear that the statement above is false.

Your arguments are laughable.

From MoJ rules.

Link?

Sorry that was re Datuns post

Indeed!

Where ‘sex’ cannot be determined, staff must use the best information available, consulting
with equality leads as necessary. Staff should avoid asking to see a GRC but instead
request sight of a birth certificate as confirmation of legal gender where the person was born
in the UK. Someone born abroad who has a UK-issued GRC may not have been able to
obtain a new birth certificate in their acquired gender. A GRC is an acceptable form of proof of
sex, if produced voluntarily. If an individual cannot produce a birth certificate, and have not
chosen to provide a GRC, they may give permission for staff to check directly with the Gender
Recognition Panel to confirm that a GRC has been issued.

It's one thing having a nonsense ideology, it's quite another saying it out loud to the entire country.

Baroness Nicol has also tweeted to 'write strong, calm letters'. Fair Play to Women has templates to make it easier (I'm sure Keep Prisons Single Sex do to).

Best to follow her advice, if women get organised, and write to MP's, Liz Truss etc it will get heard. We need to act, otherwise our rights will be trampled on.

Because having a GRC is a private matter. Not even the MoJ have the right to see one.

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2004/7/section/22

This is the part of the GRA which is concerned with "Prohibition on disclosure of information".

I can't see anything there which indicates that the MoJ don't have the right to know whether someone has a GRC.

Because having a GRC is a private matter. Not even the MoJ have the right to see one.

By this logic no male can ever be excluded from female prisons. A GRC means no risk assessment applies and nobody can ask about grcs.

So what you are saying Redlake is that all womens prisons are effectively open to anyone who wishes to go to one.

Good of you to point out this potentially hugely dangerous loophole.

Btw used to be a regular poster on here under a similar name. Been away awhile

I got through the first 10 minutes until I heard ' living as a woman,' then ' born in the wrong sex'
Some of these folk are so ill informed it never ceases to amaze me. They spout dangerous nonesense and try to look like they know what theyre talking about.

Because having a GRC is a private matter. Not even the MoJ have the right to see one.

Which legislation says that?

2022*

Because having a GRC is a private matter. Not even the MoJ have the right to see one.

It says a lot about you and your attitude that you believe that sentence backs up your argument and not mine.

In 2021 we are in a situation where convicted murders and rapists can acquire a piece of paper that lies about their biological sex, gives them access to incarcerated women, and it's kept secret.

And you're still claiming it as a victory.

No debate is over. Let's hope this amendment comes back when more debate has already been had and it gets more sunlight on the issue. Keep pushing, everyone.

This. Is. Not. Over.

Thanks for covering this

Good question @OhHolyJesus I’d also like them to ask;

‘Why were women and men segregated in prison populations? What was the original thinking behind that?’ We all know why!

If the amendment can be brought back some day soon I'd love to hear the following question asked:

"I invite the Rt Hon Gentleman to explain to the House how a man becomes a woman."

Simple yet effective I think, if they think this is a real possibility then let's hear it. I'm sure the resulting look on Lord Winston's face will be worthy of a new meme.

Thank you

For chrissake. The relentless campaigning is to have these assaults recorded as committed by women. In order that reports committed by transwomen simply aren't possible.

They don't even know how many men are in there with a GRC. It's a bloody shambles.

It's just disgusting to know that you are enthusiastically advocating for women to be put in prisons with rapists and sex offenders, inside a system where the reporting of assaults can't happen, and claiming it as a victory.

The amendment was withdrawn because, sadly, they did not have the numbers to carry it - more speakers were against, than in favour. They must have done the maths

Because it had no chance of passing. It would have been voted down. But I don't think it was proposed in order to pass, it was proposed to trigger a debate in Parliament to increase awareness, and to get put on the public historical record that some of the people who govern us really do think that male sex offenders should go into women's prisons if they declare themselves to have a feminine gender identity.