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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Jon Stewart sticking the knife in to JKR over "Jewish" goblins

330 replies

WandaWomblesaurus73 · 05/01/2022 10:58

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10368289/Jon-Stewart-accuses-JK-Rowling-anti-Semitism-Harry-Potter.html

Ffs

OP posts:
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6
TheIncredibleBookEatingManchot · 05/01/2022 18:47

Even Harry was less common back then. I grew up with the books, and the only Harry I knew of at the time was Prince Harry.

Yes, I was born in 1980 so would have been in the same school year as Harry. Not a single Harry in my year in my large school. Never met any Harrys the same age as me in fact, though I'm sure there are some somewhere.

DS1 was born in 2003 and there were three Harrys in his class at primary school.

Sorry going off topic here. But people criticising the name Cho because it's "unlikely" or uncommon seem to forget that names like Draco, Sirius or Xenophilius aren't exactly common either.

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 05/01/2022 18:31

Yes, none of the characters, bar Harry of course, have common names in the story do they? Even the ones from muggle backgrounds. I have never thought about that before!

Even Harry was less common back then. I grew up with the books, and the only Harry I knew of at the time was Prince Harry.

If she'd picked contemporary children's names, Harry's yearmates would have been very different. My year (not at Hogwarts!) was all Sarahs, Kylies and Liams!

SolasAnla · 05/01/2022 18:31

@barleybadminton

People who take issue with any of the above would do better directing their anger at the filmmakers. But then why would they do that, when it's way more fun getting to shit all over the woman they love to hate so much. Again.

I think the film makers share culpability but Rowling had creative control over the films which are also the source of a great deal of her vast wealth. It's inconceivable that if she had objected to the way the goblins were portrayed on the grounds of antisemitism the producers would have ignored her. And she has made no public criticism since, despite the controversy dating back over 15 years.

Great conspiracy theory.

So the film crew were all involved in the new character adaptations all to reimagined to make it more marketable to the largest market segment of the group of film going population, hereafter named "Nazis".
The "Good" can safely call all who ever profited off the film's or anyone who ever walked by a cinema "Nazi" too, post memes at anyone remotely connected and accuse them of killing people.......

ShagMeRiggins · 05/01/2022 18:25

@barleybadminton

People who take issue with any of the above would do better directing their anger at the filmmakers. But then why would they do that, when it's way more fun getting to shit all over the woman they love to hate so much. Again.

I think the film makers share culpability but Rowling had creative control over the films which are also the source of a great deal of her vast wealth. It's inconceivable that if she had objected to the way the goblins were portrayed on the grounds of antisemitism the producers would have ignored her. And she has made no public criticism since, despite the controversy dating back over 15 years.

Rowling didn’t have “creative control.” She had various levels of input, possibly more than other authors who sign away their creative rights (from memory I believe she insisted in her contract that British child actors were cast in the three main roles).

She also had—again, from memory—producing credit on two of the films.

When you assert she had “creative control,” it leads me to believe you don’t know what that means nor have much idea how filmmaking works. I do.

Mollyollydolly · 05/01/2022 18:24

There's some funny tweets on twitter now .. 'JK Rowling steals single socks from your laundry' etc ..

twitter.com/CroneInAMillion/status/1478771331814600708

Omicrone · 05/01/2022 18:22

@PurgatoryOfPotholes

JK said once that she tried to pick unusual names because she didn't want a real life child of the same name to wind up being picked on. So we have Vernon, Dudley, Hermione, Ronald and Ginevra. Grin
Yes, none of the characters, bar Harry of course, have common names in the story do they? Even the ones from muggle backgrounds. I have never thought about that before!
Omicrone · 05/01/2022 18:20

@nauticant

twitter.com/HadleyFreeman/status/1478772881979056137

It's an interesting tweet but since it's from a woman, less persuasive than Jon Stewart.

Interestingly, James O'brien has re-tweeted that tweet.

I thought he would be on the 'JKR is a bigot and everything she has ever said or done is bigoted' side of things.

JellySaurus · 05/01/2022 18:20

JellySaurus
Who am I support to be booing at then?

Voldemort?
In Oliver Twist?

Grin

Bill Sykes.

faithfulbird20 · 05/01/2022 18:18

Jon who? Is he trying to become famous. Is he the channel 4 guy that looks like a goblin?

Alysskea · 05/01/2022 18:18

@nauticant

twitter.com/HadleyFreeman/status/1478772881979056137

It's an interesting tweet but since it's from a woman, less persuasive than Jon Stewart.

Very well put
SolasAnla · 05/01/2022 18:18

@JellySaurus

Who am I support to be booing at then?

Voldemort?

In Oliver Twist?
ViceLikeBlip · 05/01/2022 18:16

Antisemitic tropes are deeply ingrained within our society. I do consider the goblins, in the films especially, to perpetuate these tropes.

I wish it were possible occasionally to raise/discuss these sorts of issues without discrediting ("cancelling") people altogether, and without the expectation of a nauseating, vacuous, insincere tweet of abject apology 🙄

I'm very glad I'm not famous!

PurgatoryOfPotholes · 05/01/2022 18:16

JK said once that she tried to pick unusual names because she didn't want a real life child of the same name to wind up being picked on. So we have Vernon, Dudley, Hermione, Ronald and Ginevra. Grin

nauticant · 05/01/2022 18:15

twitter.com/HadleyFreeman/status/1478772881979056137

It's an interesting tweet but since it's from a woman, less persuasive than Jon Stewart.

Mollyollydolly · 05/01/2022 18:14

@Alysskea

As a Jewish person all I hear is that these people think Jews are like goblins?? Because they're ugly and like money? How progressive.

Its just stereotyping and antisemitism - and to make matters worse they're only doing it for woke points.

Yes I'd feel the same. It's sick.
Alysskea · 05/01/2022 18:12

As a Jewish person all I hear is that these people think Jews are like goblins?? Because they're ugly and like money? How progressive.

Its just stereotyping and antisemitism - and to make matters worse they're only doing it for woke points.

merrymouse · 05/01/2022 18:10

Yes, the young people criticising the lack of diversity in books written in the 1990s should go back and compare them with other popular fantasy or YA series from the period, like Buffy or Queer as Folk. The characters were almost all white.

And those were tv shows with multiple writers and producers.

Harry Potter and the Philosopher’s Stone was a book by an unknown author with a small print run whose initial popularity was driven by word of mouth.

JellySaurus · 05/01/2022 18:09

Ethnicity wise we also don't know what the rest of the student population were as it's just not mentioned. The ones we know about these were the characters who were specifically mentioned

I always assumed that Hermione was mixed-race. So I found Emma Watson's casting very jarring and wrong. I also assumed, because a few non/WASP names and characters were given, that there must have been more and that the school body was not overwhelmingly white. To list lots of non-WASP characters would have been sickly virtue-signalling. After all, Neville (just for example) is not described as white IIRC, just that he has jug ears. He could have been black, or Korean, or anything. So non-WASP readers could well have imagined the characters in their own images. And ethnically diverse individuals in the UK do not always have 'forrin' names, anyway.

The film makers should have cast so much more diversely. What a missed opportunity.

Mollyollydolly · 05/01/2022 18:09

The thing that drives me mad is how people have no nuance about any of this. I'm a big Frank Sinatra fan and in the 40's and 50's he was very outspoken about racism and segregation in the USA, at a time when it was a brave thing to do. Roll on 20 years he was accused of being racist because of his nickname for Sammy Davis Jnr. And it was a racist nickname. Times change, attitudes change, we shouldn't judge people by our standards. The Harry Potter books were incredibly diverse for the time in which they were written. It's the lack of critical thinking that drives me crackers.

Kotatsu · 05/01/2022 18:08

To be fair, I've never met anyone called Minerva, Severus, Albus or Draco. I wonder how many Scotswomen called Minerva McGonagall there can be.

Yes, very true, the wizarding baby naming board clearly isn't like the muggle one :D

KittenKong · 05/01/2022 18:06

There was a storyline in Curb Your Enthusiasm where a black actress kept bumping into Larry David and berating him about there being no black friends in Seinfeld.

WandaWomblesaurus73 · 05/01/2022 18:05

Jon Stewart is friends with Dave Chapelle and defended him and was then accused of being transphobic.
Slinging mud at JKR is his way to get everyone to "Do it to Julia" surely?

OP posts:
PurgatoryOfPotholes · 05/01/2022 18:05

To be fair, I've never met anyone called Minerva, Severus, Albus or Draco. I wonder how many Scotswomen called Minerva McGonagall there can be.

It came up on another thread once that people took the evidence of intermingling cultures in the wozarding world completely for granted, except for Cho Chang

She's expected to have a name that follows the convections of one country, exactly. Otherwise it makes JK racist apparently.

IvyTwines · 05/01/2022 18:03

@merrymouse

But she's added some diversity but that's still not right?

With 2020s eyes, if you were going to write a series of books that you had the foresight to know would be an international phenomenon and make billions and billions of pounds, you would make the main characters more diverse.

However people don’t seem to be able to appreciate that JKR was just writing a book that might never be published at a time when nobody questioned why the cast of Friends was all white. They talk as though she knew what the books would become, and as though she should be able to foresee their international impact.

Also, if the books were retrofitted to accommodate all current criticism, they would probably be unreadable.

Yes, the young people criticising the lack of diversity in books written in the 1990s should go back and compare them with other popular fantasy or YA series from the period, like Buffy or Queer as Folk. The characters were almost all white.
NitroNine · 05/01/2022 18:01

In case anyone missed it, Stewart defended Dave Chappelle at the end of last year when there was outrage over his last Netflix special. But then, he & Chappelle are friends Hmm

The absolute shamelessness of people shouldn’t surprise me, yet somehow it still does.

I’m amazed some people can see straight to post on social media as you’d think they’d send themselves dizzy lurching about from one convenient contradiction to the next - eg “the books & films are totally separate; the latter were nothing to do with JKR” to “JKR bears sole responsibility for any & all production & design elements that have even tenuous links to antisemitic tropes & she blatantly designed & laid the floor in Australia House too damnit ” within the space of a couple of days. And yet on they go…

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