Disagreement with husband about trans debate

Ask him the Staniland question, after reminding him the proportion of transwomen, operation or not, who would classify their own sexuality as lesbian.

Sure, your daughter might be at some theoretical threat from natal women lesbians, but in practice, as captured on the record books, male physiologies (term used to make a point) subjected to childhood and adolescent male socialisation training commit sex crimes at incredibly different rates to female ones!

I think the angles you need to take is a) as above - that women aren’t ‘inferior men’ who lack a penis. We are full humans and not a lesser sub species of men. We are different.

b) that rape isn’t the only reason women don’t want people of the opposite sex in their single sex spaces. Other sexual assaults or physical assaults are still possible. Also, equally important reasons are privacy and dignity. Many women don’t want males present no matter what their genitals look like. It is their sex that is the issue. Finally, some women have religious reasons for single sex places.

C) it’s mission creep, as we’ve seen before. First it will be full bottom surgery, then some TW will complain and say it should include variations of that or being on hormones fora certain length of time, etc The simple answer is to go by sex not surgery or hormones.

d) Ask DH if he’d be a woman if his penis was removed or seriously damaged.

I do wonder how the character Hayley would have been taken if it had been played by a male, as it should have been IMO.

Bloody hell, the great post was on a thread started by someone who said they were a transwoman who turned out to be trolling and MNHQ took the whole thing down, losing loads of good content.

Can’t recall the poster’s name. She argued that some mens brains are the thing that make then a risk, so if policy is to be based on surgery / removal of male body parts, it should be the head!

I don’t suppose men will ever get it though, as there’s a big difference between a man in a female space, and a woman in a male space.
I don’t think they will understand the fear.

Ah, penis focus!

There’s a great post on another thread here about this: will dig it out!

I don't think it's unusual or even unexpected for people to think this way. Even those who have grasped the issues with self ID and the unfairness of men in women's sports and awards.

A lot of people still see a fully transitioned male as being Hayley from Corrie or even India Willoughby. As obnoxious as they are, many people do see them as a woman.

See how he feels about it if you have a daughter who is changing in a shop/ swimming pool etc… the men in my life saw no issue until I pointed this out to them!

Plenty of men seem to see the penis as key.

Don't they always

I posted a long post on another thread can copy if interested OP.

Essentially it's about
Men, masculinity, for millennia they've focused on penis as THE thing that makes a man a man.

Women aren't people in their own right, they're non men. Men- dick. No dick- not a man.

Men are one group. Not-men are another group.

If a male has no dick then belongs with other non men.

That's the thinking.

Plus that it's theoretical for them. Can do the whole look be logical, not emotional thing. And for many it's fun to do that to women, wind them up, watch them get more angry/upset.

So if someone had a catastrophic accident/etc and their penis was amputated, would he consider that person a woman?
A woman is not just a man without a penis.

Tell him that no means no and women don’t have to justify why they don’t want males in their spaces.

I don't know if your disagreement is as fundamental as all that. He agrees with you about all but a tiny number in terms of policy, and he agrees that people don't really change sex.

His feeling may be that back when numbers of fully transitioned males were tiny, this wasn't really much of an issue because it so very rarely came up, it really wasn't even on the radar in the vast majority of places. As far as that goes, it's not untrue - it mostly was a non-issue because most people went through their whole lives without encountering it.

I think you can disagree on something at that level without it representing a significant difference in values or beliefs.

The other thing is, lots of people change their views on this over time, and it's an area where there is a lot happening. For many of us, had you asked us five or ten years ago we'd have said something different than we would now.

He seems to genuinely think that a de-penised man would pose absolutely no threat to women

Don't worry women, they can't rape you now so what's your problem eh? Ffs.

Don't you just love men who think it's their place to tell women what rights we should and shouldn't have?

Does your DH realise that the number of males who actually have their penis removed is only a tiny percentage of those who claim to be women?

Your DH is an arsehole who gives no shits about female safety because fobbing these males off into female only spaces has no effect on him whatsoever, whilst earning him special virtue signalling points.

It also means HE won't have to deal with them making HIM feel uncomfortable by being in mens' single sex spaces.

Most TW keep their penis and expect lesbians to accept full heterosexual sex as 'women' can have a penis now...if they say no to TW they are labelled bigots.
Does your DH think that's fair?

"He said he thinks I’m too radical and shouldn’t think this way about a marginalised group 😡"
And there's the problem - your husband is gullible. He actually believes that a group which has every political party dancing to its tune, a group which has big businesses handing over single-sex changing rooms to them as soon as they ask (and often without having to ask), a group that police forces up and down the country jump to defend from hurty feelz - your gullible-as-fuck husband believes such a group can be described as 'marginalised'? My arse.

If he believes post operative TWAW then would he have a sexual relationship with one? (If you and he separated). My brother thinks TWAW, apparently "getting your cock chopped off and turned into a fanny means you've literally changed sex". But when I asked if he'd sleep with one he said "ewww. I'm not a freak and I'm not gay"

Is he expecting you to check men that are dressed as women to see if they do or do not have a penis, as they enter the loos, or will he help with that?