Tom Daley Christmas message

I think surrogacy as an altruistic means to help someone have a baby is one thing but surrogacy as it is in the US, which is where Tom Daley and Dustin Lance Black found their surrogate and egg donor is exploitative. DLB is campaigning to try and get the laws changed in the UK to resemble US surrogacy laws.

As someone said before on here when rich women start offering to have babies for others I may revise my opinion.

There are laws about how soon you can take a puppy away from its mother because of how damaging it is for them both.

That’s a really good, saddening point. And puppies are born at a later stage of development than human babies. Human babies are the most helpless and dependent on their mothers of all infant mammals.

Yes I’m waiting to hear how allowing them likes of Lia Thomas to identify as a woman and annihilate all the biologically female swimmers isn’t in opposition to womens rights

Andy Murray is pro-women and pro-trans - because they're not in opposition to each other.

Until a mediocre male tennis player utters the magic words "I identify as a woman" and ends up playing the current womens number 1. Then they are quite literally opposing each other. Who benefits in this scenario? It's not women, or sport, is it?

Also, surrogacy has long been a thing with many women helping other women to have families. Would all those accusing Tom Daley of 'buying a baby' and being 'disgusting' hold the same standard towards others who have been involved in a surrogacy process?

If Tom Daley was less pretty, would the press be quite so interested in him I wonder?

I hope a bunch of dolphins start identifying as men and win all the diving competitions. That would serve him right.

It’s what happens when you throw TQ in with LGB

Of course he’s right about homophobia in sport but that’s got nothing to do with whether biological men should compete with women because of how they feel

And of course he doesn’t really believe TWAW - he knows exactly what sex gives both to babies. He knows TWATW.

I agree with him regarding hosting sports events in places with dreadful human rights records.

He is also right to shine a light on homophobia in male football.

What if we all started from the same place. Wouldnt that be something to be proud of is an interesting point. I imagine female sportspeople feel like that when competing with a trans opponent.

Well that’s him unfollowed on Instagram!

I really recommend Venus Rising podcasts, which usually last about half an hour - exactly my journey to work. Whilst some discuss surrogacy related issues other are about fertility issues generally and other topics of interest.

Episode notes of the podcast @GoodieMoomin posted.

"Today we travel across the pond to talk to England's own, Gary Powell. Gary is a LGB activist, public administration campaigner, and an original signer of the Stop Surrogacy Now statement. Gary was tutored in Philosophy by the Rt Hon Baroness Mary Warnock, a specialist in reproductive ethics whose inquiry led to the UK Human Fertilisation and Embryology Act 1990. Join us as we find out why, as a gay man, Gary opposes surrogacy."

podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/venus-rising/id1481872967?i=1000453100687

It always makes me think they are styling themselves after Madame Therese Defarge - except they are the aristocracy.

we aren't talking about puppies and kittens here, we're talking about living, breathing human babies.

There are laws about how soon you can take a puppy away from its mother because of how damaging it is for them both.

Surrogacy is an abhorrent practice and I can't look at him the same way since he went down that route.

In any civilised society it should never be possible to "commission" a woman to have a baby for you, which she will hand over after it's born. We aren't talking about puppies and kittens here, we're talking about living, breathing human babies. I will never understand why anyone could ever think it's ok to ask a woman to undertake all the physical and emotional risks of pregnancy and child birth simply to hand the baby over to a 3rd party. And what of the baby? Conceived with the aim of being separated from it's mother soon after birth, with all the damage that is known to cause?

I'm (not) sorry, having a baby isn't a human right.

This episode of Venus Rising is excellent on this topic
venusrising.podomatic.com/enclosure/2019-10-10T22_00_00-07_00.mp3 via

The remarkable achievements of trans athletes generally consists of the remarkable achievements of mediocre males who still have the ability to beat female athletes due to their male physiology.

Mediocre males.

Well done all you mediocre males.

Are these Tom's words or has he been paid to say them?

Not controversial or debatable. Illegal.

I'm gender critical at heart but I can't get myself worked up by the use of surrogates. Why is it so offensive that gay men get to have babies too? If the surrogate woman signs up to help then I can't see the harm?

Lovely that he's being so inclusive and generous in giving away women's sport.

I can think of about 42 off the top of my head. Many of them lesbians so double whammy. I am sorry your imagination is so poor.

Imagine if a female swimmer sat poolside knitting`? She'd be accused of being an old spinster

"Women's sports seem to be further ahead than men's"
Really Tom? When some countries don't even allow women to play sports? When male sports are so much more visible than women's and male athletes get paid so much more (not due to a difference in effort?) Granted, perhaps lesbians are more accepted in female sports. But how many lesbian athletes can the average person even name? If you think women's sports are ahead because male athletes are competing in them then you're not as progressive as you like to think you are.