Apparently we are a bunch of "stay at home mothers"

A really what’s wrong with a stay at home mum. My mum was one - she also helped dad with his business (she was a pretty shrewd stratigiser) and knew how to woo clients. She also wrangled loads of kids and pets and looked after the aged grandparents too.

She kept us all fed and clothed. Kept the house slick and span. She was always there.

What’s wrong with that?

And yes, it is difficult for most people to get their heads around, especially if you don't spend most of your time online, or even if you do but have a family, productive life, work etc which doesn't revolve around these issues. These issues are these people's whole lives.

There can seem to be less a desire to be one of the group formerly known as women, than to replace it, bumping that formerly known group out of the space. Only certain aspects of the group is wanted, certainly not the grotty bits which definitely remain the lot of those born female (like being kind, sucking up treatment that others are entitled to be enraged about, sexual violence threats etc), and a pecking order/hierarchy most definitely remains at all times. The utter disrespect and misogyny towards females can be subtle, but in conversation it is there and plain to see.

This is so true. Brilliant post.

There can seem to be less a desire to be one of the group formerly known as women, than to replace it, bumping that formerly known group out of the space. Only certain aspects of the group is wanted, certainly not the grotty bits which definitely remain the lot of those born female (like being kind, sucking up treatment that others are entitled to be enraged about, sexual violence threats etc), and a pecking order/hierarchy most definitely remains at all times. The utter disrespect and misogyny towards females can be subtle, but in conversation it is there and plain to see.

Again, why mixed spaces for female people will never work. Already in the failing attempts to force this to work, a ridiculous amount of effort, flexibility, tolerance and managing disadvantage is coming from female people, vigorously demanded of them and with constant anger and shaming that they are not doing more and better - while there are no reciprocal requirements of any kind whatsoever. None. This is supposed to be about 'sex isn't binary/not a thing/group by gender is better' - however the sexism is what is breaking it. And a heavy amount of political intolerance and a lack of basic human compassion for female inclusion, diversity and recognition of females as equally human.

Women talking together without appropriate male supervision has always been terrifying to a certain demographic. Women who have given birth are frightening and unpredictable, as are, oddly, women who haven’t given birth and so placed themselves outside of the “norm”.

Women banding together and talking always works up a good head of castration anxiety among men who are that way inclined

Therefore Mumsnet, being an unapologetically female centred space where men cannot exercise control must be written off as irrelevant and silly.

Trouble is, when you exert yourself to do that, you’re showing your hand - things that are irrelevant and silly don’t need to be so energetically dismissed, do they? Because, well, they’re irrelevant. You don’t need to enthusiastically try to disempower something that is already powerless.

It really is very helpful when the blatant sexism is exposed like this:

Mummies: stupid, easily led, easily frightened
Stay at home mummies: lots of time on their hands to sponge off their husbands and get worked up about things
Mumsnet: ought to be focused on how to feed babies, choose a pram and nothing else
Moral imperative: re-educate the mummies into better thinking

In 10-20 years - I think it'll be a lot quicker than that, tbh.

If they are/or want to be women so sadly, why are they so full of hatred towards us?

Must be mommy issues, and the fact we want to protect our young and freedom of speech/thought.

Bad bad wimen!

Anyway, as noted, let them dismiss us. They need not concern themselves with who we are, what we do or what we care about, do they?

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.

God the misogyny is to obvious, isn't it? That derisive, patronising tone - yes how fucking dare women stay at home and be concerned abut their kids!!! Pathetic individuals that they are!

FYI I'm not a mother and I have a job.

Also, I'm a fucking Stay At Home All The Time General Misanthropist, thank you, never mind Mother.

Gosh, what are the daft nincompoops saying today?

Isn't it interesting how mummies is used to dismiss us, yet we are birthing people when we try to remind people of our rights?

'Imperialism Is Responsible For Omicron''.

Actually I think that's a fair point. Vaccine hoarding by wealthy nations with an imperialist history is definitely a factor in the emergence of new variants.

Other than that, on the main point he's clearly a dick

How have we got to the point that "stay at home mother" is considered an insult? Why are things that were traditionally part of a woman's life so little valued? Most of our foremothers were stay at home mothers. Maybe the way that "the patriarchy" lives on, is in what is valued in society.

Mumsnet is a force, hiding in plain sight. It has radicalised me and made a far more empathetic women. It's cured my internalised misogyny and made me far more understanding of and interested in women's lives. it's made me far less tolerant of men that don't pull their weight. No wonder they sneer at it.

Something that constantly astonishes me is how trans rights activists misinterpret and underestimate gender critical feminists, and women who don't support transgender ideology. Sure, call us silly stay at home mummies who don't have a brain, and who just follow sheep-like whatever right wing religious organisations say...but it's not true. I'm sure it gives them great comfort to think that their opponents are really thick, but it doesn't seem like the best strategy in the long run. Surely a better thing to do would be to overestimate us! But many trans rights activists are so sexist, and so enamoured with the idea that women have silly lady thoughts, that they simply cannot comprehend that we are well read, educated, driven, and have our own opinions.

I can definitely confirm that mum work is indeed work.

@WorriedMumsDontSleep not going to speak for @ShagMeRiggins but I took it as you were saying it's only ok to be a SAHM if you need to, not want to, but I know you didn't mean that after clarifying! Sorry you are having a hard time with your little one.